Arena The First Basketball Draft

Discussion in 'Archive: The Arena' started by The Great No One, Apr 7, 2011.

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  1. JediMaster1511 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2010
    star 9
    Monroe did some amazing things on bad knees though. :p

    Anyway, I'll address the team game tommorrow maybe.
  2. The Great No One Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2005
    star 8
    6'3 and 185 pounds isn't... QUITE the same as 7'3 and 279 pounds. just sayin'. :p
  3. Point Given Mod of Literature and Community

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Dec 12, 2006
    star 5
    I have the edge in guard play while Tunick has the edge in the frontcourt.

    The Admiral < Kareem
    Rodman = McHale (Just witness what Rodman did defensively to Karl Malone in the '97 and '98 Finals and Malone was much better than McHale)
    Pierce = Worthy
    Jordan > Miller
    Stockton > Nash (Nash's poor defense is a huge liability and Stockton is the all time steals leader

    Bench play


    Bernard King > Anyone on Tunick's bench

    Dennis Johnson > Anyone on Tunick's bench

    In one of the matchups Pau beat out Mourning and with Rice's outside shooting and Baron Davis running the court along with with DJ, my bench play is miles ahead

    Coach:

    Red Auerbach > Chuck Daly.

    Daly had a two year window where his team was good while Auerbach dominated for an entire decade and then more as GM
  4. JediMaster1511 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2010
    star 9
    Okay, I've watched some old Sabonis footage of him playing. He does look good, I will admit, but he I think his style puts him at a disadvantage against Monroe. Monroe's quickness looks like something he rarely saw, at least judging by the film. Monroe has the abilty to get away from someone playing him closely.



    for my team matchup I will point this out....Phil is coaching, Kiki, Oakley, Ewing, Starks, and Mark Jackson have played together with the Knicks. Oakley Mentored Horace Grant in Chicago, where Phil coached. Oakley played with Carter in Toronto, and Carter played with Kidd in New Jersey. Starks played in Utah with Malone for a couple of seasons, albeit his last two seasons in the NBA and not as a starter. Cohesion is on my side it seems here.
  5. The Great No One Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2005
    star 8
    not necessarily saying i think sabonis will win, haven't decided yet, but was just saying that you were selling him a bit short.
  6. JediMaster1511 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2010
    star 9
    Like I said, I can see he was good in Russia, I won't deny that.
  7. DarthIntegral Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    Haven't started thinking about team matches yet, but here are my strong leans on the individuals:

    Jordan
    Hawkins
    Jerry West
    Daugherty
    Monroe
    Petit

  8. New_York_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2002
    star 6
    The key thing to remember about Hawkins is we barely saw his prime. By the time he hit the NBA he was already older and suffered from injuries that limited him. Yet when he finally got to the NBA, as a 27 year old with serious knee injuries slowing him down, he posted 24.6-10.5-4.8 on 49% shooting. That?s amazing, and speaks to how supremely good he was at basketball. Bill Sharman described him as ?moving on sheer desire?I?ve never seen a performance like that. He?s made some moves I?ve never seen before. Hawkins belongs in the same class with Jerry West, Elgin Baylor, and John Havlicek.?* That was in description to Hawkins 41 point game 7 in the ABA finals on the aforementioned injured knee. He also had that game against Doug Moe, considered the best defense forward in the league. **

    As a rookie in the ABA, he posted a 26.8-13.5-4.6 on 52% shooting. That was after playing no college ball, and his pro career consisting of the ABL and the globetrotters. And he wasn?t just an otherworldy scorer. Despite everything that could have made him a selfish gunner looking to get his, he was a true student of the game. ?A guy who was a basketball person could watch Connie and see the subtle things?his passing, how he blocked shots and rebounded and knew how to help out teammates on defense. I?m convinced that the Connie Hawkins that led Pittsburgh to that first title could play in the NBA and be on the same level as Magic Johnson, Larry Bird and Michael Jordan are today? is what Mel Daniels said about him***. Certainly, Issel had a longer, more productive career. But in a one on one game, in his prime, there are very few people who could stand against him.


    *Free Darko Presents The Undisputed Guide to Pro Basketball, pg 70.
    ** Loose Balls: The Short, Wild Life of the American Basketball Association, pg 81
    *** Loose Balls: The Short, Wilde Life of the American Basketball Association Pg. 83.
  9. The Great No One Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2005
    star 8
    anyone else have anything to say?
  10. New_York_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2002
    star 6
    I mean, I need more time to think/plan for teams. I can post tomorrow afternoon on that, since today is a holiday.

    Of course, if you were going to vote for me, go ahead without an argument!
  11. The Great No One Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2005
    star 8
    no, was just hoping more people would comment on their teams matches. be nice.

    anyway, i haven't figured out any team leanings yet so...
  12. MandaloreYak Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2004
    star 5
  13. JediMaster1511 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2010
    star 9
    I'll have something at some point.....

    I'll point out on top of my cohesion that I do have an actual starting 5 on my team, and they will likely be on the court together at some point, even if they aren't the starting 5 for my team in this matchup.
  14. EmpireForever Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2004
    star 8
    Well, I'm on vacation pretty much until Monday. I really shouldn't even be here to post this now, but here are a couple of thoughts(ignoring the individual match):

    My team is built to force people to go inside. Cheeks, Dumars, Moncrief, these are all top notch perimeter defenders. On top of that, Cheeks is one of the best floor generals of all time. Just look at what people have to say about him, and what the 6ers did after he showed up(that team had the talent to win, but Cheeks was able to pull it all together). On top of that, he led the league in steals until Jordan and Stockton showed up. I have more to say about him, but here I am on vacation.

    Like I said, though, this team is built to force you inside. I realize there's not a lot of offense coming from the guards, but...come on, they need it? And a couple of my guards can contribute on offense--Cheeks, Dumars, and Manu are all capable in that area. But, the other thing my team is built for is, well, to dominate you on the inside. All three of those guys are forces of nature. Who can stop or get past Chamberlain in this matchup? Who can keep up with Barkley, or put up numbers on Garnett? Those three are monsters on offense and defense. Sure, the opposition here has fantastic guard play, but I'd say they're built more for the smaller games, since he has at least 4 point guards(those guys can't all be on the court at the same time, and, while coming off of the bench with that kind of talent is nice, it does kind of limit what they can do in a game).

    Meanwhile, coming off of my bench are incredible offensive players in Barry and English. I mean, if you don't think my team can put up points, you're kind of insane. They're fast, athletic, big, smooth.

    Now, if these defensive guards can slow down the other team, and if the other team cannot stop this front court, the opposition could be in a little trouble early, and with explosive offensive players coming off of the bench, that could run the score up even more.

    I could go into the leadership of my team as well. Most of them were respected for their knowledge of the game while playing, and a few of them went on to coach pretty successfully, so Rudy is going to have plenty of help. Speaking of, that guy is pretty good. Look him up. He had plenty of success with less than all-star talent.

    Anyway, happy fourth, guys.
  15. New_York_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2002
    star 6
    My opponent definitely has a hellacious front court. That's true. Fortunately, I got some tools to deal with that. Number one being the 7'2'', 4 time defensive player of the year Dikembe Mutombo. Wilt never faced anyone like him in his career. Mutombo is actually bigger than Wilt. I'm not saying he'll shut him down...but he'll definitely do as good a job as anyone slowing him down.

    Secondly, if he has Wilt, KG and Barkely on the court at once as his starting lineup, that means one of them is matching up with Dr. J. And that's a bad match up for him. And yeah, Cheeks and Ginobili are good players. But matching up with Oscar Robertson and Walt Frazier? That's not a recipe for success. Not to mention my bench wings- Isiah Thomas, David Thompson and Connie Hawkins. With Petrovic there to space the floor. Up front Wes Unseld and Spencer Haywood is a great duo off the pine. When Mutombo is out, Unseld can come in and bruise and rebound and do all the little things. Maybe that wasn't as valuable in two on two...but 5 on 5? Someone who will play tough as nails defense, set bonerattling picks, swing the ball, rebound and whip outlet passes (seriously look at his assist numbers) is just the complement for Isiah, Oscar, Dr. J and the rest. Hell, does anyone want a piece of Unseld shooting outlets to finishers like Dr. J, David Thompson, and Connie Hawkins? Haywood and McAdoo are both predecessors to KG, with their jump shooting and rebounding, making sure the lane won't be clogged for my guards.

    As for coaching, my coach is the architect of the triangle and just joined the hall of fame (or technically will in about a month). I think he'll do ok.
  16. Darth Tunes SfC Part III Commissioner

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2000
    star 10
    If it's possible, I can do my arguments for this round on Thursday.

    Viva Los Angeles![face_flag]
  17. JediMaster1511 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2010
    star 9
    Alright, team arguements....

    My outside threat beyond the arc has Kiki, Starks, Kidd, Carter, A.I., and Jackson. Some better than others at it, but they all have a respectable shot from beond the arc. At any time they can drop a bucket there. Monroe, A.I., and Carter can go inside as can Starks. A.I. and Moroe are huge threats running it in th elane though, and Starks can dunk on some of the best of them. Carter as well who is known for some amazing circus shots. Inside is the threat of Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing. Big men that can score points, grab rebounds and be a force to be reckoned with. Oakley and Grant also posses tremendous inside presence. Kidd and A.I. are good at steals(Kidd being third of all time) and many of my guys aren't too shabby stealing either.

    There is also the matter of(not to sound like a broken record) cohesion. Guys who will know each other and what the other can do. Know's who likes what where and who will be where they need/want to be to make a play. Not to mention that there are guys who's cohesion span through other teams and connect each other and with Phil at the helm it helps the process along.
  18. MandaloreYak Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2004
    star 5
    Oh, yeah, meant to post this for the team match. Remember I have Chris Bosh now, not Alvertis.
  19. Point Given Mod of Literature and Community

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Dec 12, 2006
    star 5
    Gone for the weekend if the draft moves on. Be back Sunday night or Monday.
  20. Darth Tunes SfC Part III Commissioner

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2000
    star 10

    How could you possibly equate Pierce to James Worthy, or Daly wouldn't have the chops to coach against Auerbach?

    Viva Los Angeles![face_flag]
  21. New_York_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2002
    star 6
    Red is the greatest coach of all time.
  22. MandaloreYak Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2004
    star 5
    At this point, if someone could be found to take my team, I'd go be a judge to get this thing movin. I mean, it's a good team too, this kind of opportunity doesn't come around too often.
  23. Point Given Mod of Literature and Community

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Dec 12, 2006
    star 5
  24. MandaloreYak Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2004
    star 5
  25. DarthIntegral Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    MASTERPRENN has agreed to replace me as a judge.

    Life got helluva busy for me all at once, so I'm sorry guys.
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