ST The First Order in Episodes 8 and 9

Unlike the New Republic, the First Order was prepared for war. They would not have congregated their fleet all in one spot. The New Republic had followed the Disarmament Act and had vastly demilitarized to a defensive state. If we take C3PO's statement as an indicator ("Oh my, without the Republic fleet, we are doomed.") the New Republic fleet is decimated.

Though SKB was destroyed, one would think that they would not have concentrated all their military strength on one planet. With or without ancillary material to go on, it only seems logical to me that the aggressor, preparing for war on another political entity that was in a state of mostly denial concerning the threat, would have positioned themselves for their expansion after the initial blow. Their intent is not to simply blow up worlds and star systems, but to rule. After destroying Hosian Prime, they would have been ready to begin open annexation and / or blitzkrieg.

Snoke was not on planet, and we know or presume that the command and Kylo made it off the SKB, and unlike Hosian Prime, there was some warning. Even the Star Destroyers and other ships around that world could have had some communicated warning to leave the system. Perhaps not all but most. If Rey, Chewie, and Finn had time to leave the system, so did many others on the other side.

Though the destruction of SKB was a loss and a blow to the efforts of the First Order, it hardly was a defeat. They lost men and material and any future employment of that weapon, but their first objective had been accomplished, and the only things now in the path of total galactic domination are the poorly funded and equipped Resistance, and the specter of Jedi involvement.

It now is a parallel path: bringing the galaxy under their domination, worlds and sections at a time while swatting off the Resistance, and finding and eliminating any potential Jedi threat.

 

I don't think SKB was that much of a loss for the FO. Yes they won't be able to blow up planets anymore, but they actually don't need to anymore; the destruction of Hosnian Prime was a success after all. Sure, it could have been used to intimidate other leaders into just giving up territory, but it's not like the NR or the Resistance have much to offer in a direct conflict against the FO anymore.

Plus, I too think many managed to get off SKB. All those tie fighters who were in the air fighting the Resistance (and weren't shot down of course), all people who were smart enough to leave ASAP (like that officer we see looking out of the window and turning his superior away with "Even Hux has gone!" before storming out), and right after that scene Hux is ordered to evacuate and bring Kylo along (in the book there wasn't just Hux on that rescue ship to retrieve him btw, stormtroopers as well - so it makes sense that anyone near any of the hangar bays had a chance to escape).
Plus, any losses regarding their manpoewr are dwarfed by the fact that they have a few backup armies up their sleeve in the Unknown Regions.

tl;dr - Dire times lie ahead for the hero-trio.

 

Ancillary material makes it clear that the SKB was simply the First Order's largest forward military deployment, and not representative of the whole (or even bulk) of its forces. So the FO is almost certainly going to be dominant in Episode 8, at least.

 

I think we'll see plenty more of the First Order in the ST. The SW formula is to have a continuous 'enemy' organisation and I don't think that will be meddled with. I would imagine we'll see Hux, Phasma etc back on deck for Ep 8.

 

Hux (per Mark Hamill's' Oxford talk recently) is still in his spanking black Generals uniform from VII .. FO dynamics will be interesting. The galactic republic has to be utterly disordered and disunited if the FO is to succeed in whatever they want to achieve - presumably the Empire redux. After the Hosnian demonstratoin, is it difficult to imagine that the good citizens of the Republic would not unite against the common enemy..

EDIT:
Pablo tweets FO:

Not all of FO on SKB. Repeat - Not all of FO on SKB..

https://twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/711755395891527680

settled.

 

The First Order will definitely play a role on Ep8&9. As said before, it would be pointless to introduce such a ludicrously big organistion and put it on the shelf after just one film. In addition, it would be great to know more about it. Where does it come from? Why did Snoke create it? Any link with the Old Empire? How far can they get to conquer the Galaxy? etc...

 

One thing that I want to see involving the First Order is actually an extension of Finn's arc in TFA. When Finn defected it was a huge deal. It seemed like it was something that had NEVER been done before, like the FO thought they had their troopers so completely brainwashed and that such a thing could never happen. So when Finn left he became one of their most important targets, with the troopers themselves seeming to almost take his defection personally ("TRAITOR!").

But, if it can happen to one and the news can spread so quickly, it can certainly happen to others. Now I know that they made a jab early in the film about going back to Clones... what if that becomes necessary by the time the trilogy concludes? What if Finn's defection goes on to actually inspire many other Stormtroopers to leave in the same way when they realize just what they've gotten themselves into? By he end of the trilogy Finn could potentially be leading his own battalion of Stormtroopers on the side of the Republic/Resistance (kind of recalling the imagery of the Clone Wars and coming full circle, with Jedi leading the white armored troops into battle), with the FO left scrambling and trying to breed Clones to combat them so that they can completely brainwash them to their own cause.

 

I just hope they don't build another planet-destroyer. Getting pretty tired of that. I'd love for the next films to focus on space battles with fighters/battleships and ground battles with some newly designed vehicles/tanks.

 

I wouldn't mind it at all if the FO was wiped out in Episode IX and a new threat would emerge. A powerful alien race or other type of threat from the outer reaches of space with a vast army could work.

 

Not gonna happen, don't worry. Even Abrams said in an interview that SKB was more like something of a joke.

Considering that the FO might have a new set of new star destroyer battle ships, it's quite likely actually.
You know, the scene in the very beginning of TFA when we see the Finalizer blocking out that moon still gives me chills. If they give us a scene with tons of these battle ships, I'm gonna melt in my cinema seat!

 

Mmh... cool though it may seem, it's not credible. It took years to the Galactic Empire to build their ultimate weapon. And Starkiller Base was also a unique space station that required an awful lot of staff to be run. Hundreds of them? No please, that's not what I'd like to see.

 

Mmh... I can't delete my previous post. I've just realised I've misunderstood what Rimfaxe96 said...

 

It would be pretty beast if the FO could create hundreds of SKBs.

 

Hi great description. In your opinion what would the FO target next? It is a big galaxy after all. Do they target the core worlds, or would they take the worlds around the outskirts of republic space? Fascinated to hear what you think...Thanks

 

I personally believe that there will be a methodical push in from the Unknown Regions, by passing less important systems, and going after major systems on the way to the core. For now they feel the Resistance is a bother, one they need to deal with, but their objective is to move now and fill the vacuum left by the destruction of the New Republic government.

 

What would you consider a major system? Would Bespin or Naboo fall into this catagory? [Love those planets and want to see them on screen again. I hope dubrovnik is Naboo]

 

I wouldn't mind something like that, as long as it wasn't handled as poorly as the Vong. An extra-galactic horde, ala the Huns or Mongols, could be cool. Especially if it brings together Republicans and Imperials/ First Order sympathizers.

 

I never read the post ROTJ EU can you please explain the problems with the VV and how you would better them?

 

It's a matter of picking out those who would have some importance. I really would consider Naboo but not Bespin. There are really many to pick from.

 

One thing I disagree on you with is the FO's desire to rule. To me they are pure terroists. They want to destroy the republic, the jedi and their whole belief system. If they want to rule then wiping out entire systems is not a wise/popular thing to do.

 

I thought the bad guys in TFA were very good. If they keep doing what they are doing I don't care if some of the foot soldiers resemble storm troopers, all they are really doing is portraying the fact that the first order believes in the ideals of the empire but not the sith. Snoke obviously wants nothing to do with the sith and does not agree with their rules. This difference alone is HUGE and completely changes the game

 

Take Nazi Germany and their blitzkrieg. They were willing to destroy entire cities for the sake of expansion. What they could annex (Austria, Sudetenland) or easily overcome (remainder of Czechoslovakia) they did quickly, quietly and without much destruction. When they invaded France, as soon as there was surrender, they quickly set up the Vichy government in the south and occupied the north. My point is blowing up Hosian Prime was a quick killing blow to the New Republic. It was part of a strategy, not an indication of terror for its own sake. If they can conquer or bring system on board without violence but just intimidation, they will. If they cannot, they will take out the local governments and any infrastructure that could lead to resistance.

 

Right but they destroyed the hosnian system and would have destroyed the resistance homeworld. There was no gain from doing this other than wiping out enemies and striking terror into the people of the galaxy. Ruling the galaxy by destroying it? Plus the movie states they want destroy the last jedi. It is a religious motive as well. They are in my opinion less Nazi Germany more ISIS. If ISIS had a nuclear bomb they would not hesitate to use it on a western country. But I would not think they would invade.

 

Well, Genghis Khan destroyed cities in order to subjugate the next ones on his list (many of which would open up their gates to him in fear). So yeah. The First Order can destroy the existing governance system of the Republic in order to then conquer the galaxy, and impose its own form of government on it. I imagine those are its intentions. I doubt they are content with terrorism. Not to mention, if terrorists like ISIS had the equivalent capacity of the FO, and the ability to completely destroy their enemies (such as, say, every NATO country, Russia and the Gulf states), who says they would not then seek to impose themselves as a global or at least regional government? Terrorists deploy certain tactics due to their weakness, not strength. And the FO in TFA, with its system and star-destroying capability, certainly wasn't weak.

 

If I had to guess as to the the FO's next target, I would imagine it would be Luke and Rey. Both Kylo and Snoke know about her and know that she can find Luke. If they find her in her strong but relatively untrained Force user state, then they know that Luke must not be too far away from her. If they cannot find either of their exact whereabouts, then it wouldn't be a huge stretch of the imagination to assume that they'll take the route Vader did in ESB and try to hurt those closest to them in an attempt to flush them out of hiding.

This attempt to flush them out could lead us to two possible scenarios: the first would be a rehash of ESB - something nobody wants as it would make the claims of the ST being an OT rehash all the more valid. The second scenario would be something totally different and perhaps darker: if the FO tortures, attempts to assassinate, or just makes life difficult for those closest to Luke and Rey, then the temptation would be for them to go after them and try to fix the problem much like Luke did in ESB. Instead, Luke has become wiser in his isolation and keeps Rey with him at his island hovel despite Rey's protests and the pain they both feel from their friends through the Force. Luke learned the hard way that it isn't wise to go running after evil when you're half trained as a Jedi and he wants to keep Rey from making that mistake, even if it means keeping her there longer than she would like. Perhaps this conflict could drive a significant part of the story all while the FO is going after the Resistance and everybody and anybody who has ties to both Luke and Rey.

If Luke's Jedi crash course and epic cram session work for Rey as it did for him with Yoda, then they should both be able to take on Kylo and Snoke by the third film. The downside to all of this is that it could lead to things getting very bad for our heroes and leading to some resentment by those who felt left behind by Luke and Rey when all hell was breaking loose at the hand of the First Order.

Again, this is just a guess. I could be completely wrong about this.