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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

The Force is a metaphor for Christianity

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Freedom_Fighter, Apr 18, 2005.

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  1. Kit-Fisto7BA

    Kit-Fisto7BA Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2003
    I think if you have Star Wars facet Christian beiliefs than Obi-Wan represents Jesus more than Anakin. Anakin represents Judah more than Christ.
     
  2. Darth_Stern

    Darth_Stern Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Sep 15, 2003
    Star Wars is one of the greatist buddist tomes to ever be told.

    Attachment leads to fear of loss, fear leads to angry pride, anger leads to hate of oneself and those who would take from you, and that leads to the suffering path of the dark side.

    Letting go in the moment leads to inner peace, unconditional love, and the TRUE enlightenment of the light side of universal truth(the force).

    All monolithic religions are based on attachment.

    That is the way of the Sith.

    And in Star Wars they are the BAD GUYS.

     
  3. sepharih

    sepharih Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Mar 16, 2005
    ^well said, eastern religon and philosophy is predominant in the star wars universe, but there is still a healthy amount of christian symbolism to be analyzed in the films I think

    From what I saw, it hasn't been mentioned, but there is a reference to the holy trinity.
    Anakin is clearly the christ figure of the story, what with the too obvious virgin birth and all. And the force is essentially "God" in one way or another. Now, how does the force tell Anakin what his essential destiny is? Who comes down from the heavens to teach him? Qui-gon. So then, the force is the father, Anakin is the son, and Qui-gon is the holy spirit.
     
  4. Wolfus

    Wolfus Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    May 1, 2005
    Why the hell you folks must have YOUR religions everywhere? Star Wars are Star Wars. They aren't similar to any religion. They ARE religion.
     
  5. sepharih

    sepharih Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Mar 16, 2005
    ^i'm not religous at all. I don't attend church and i'm not even sure exactly what form of christianity I'm supposed to be a part of, I think i'm a lutheran? It's not about that, it's about seeing what the inspiration was for the film. It's more literary than anything else.
     
  6. Ascaaear

    Ascaaear Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Jun 23, 2005
    Well, mister Wolfus. If you dont know it, every religion on this planet does have a connection somehow, even when it doesnt seems like it. That is what we try to find out here, what kind of inspiration religions had on Star Wars, not to blend Star Wars into another religion.
     
  7. sepharih

    sepharih Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Mar 16, 2005

    Anakin represents Judah more than Christ.


    Sorry I didn't see that earlier, I would have commented on it, because you basically hit the nail and didn't realize it.

    Anakin is both Judah and Jesus. He is the savior, and the betrayer. Hence, brining balance to the force, get it.
     
  8. General_Obi_1

    General_Obi_1 Jedi Youngling star 1

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    May 27, 2005
    In judochristian belive all things are created good because they are created by God. The devil was once good but greed made him try to sit above God and so he was cast down. He like us was a creation of God and thus good but choose to become evil. The devil IS NOT Gods equal and exact opposite, he in his bitterness and sadness at what he has lost temptes people to do evil but is altermently a bit part player in the grand scheme of things.

    The force is two equal eliments Light and Dark. This has more in common with ancient religious stories such as Norse and Greek mythology.

    I can understand that there are similarities with christianity and with the point I made above but christianity is no ware near as simplistic as the Force. Does any one know GLs religous belives?

    By the way I'm a total athieste.
     
  9. jeromew

    jeromew Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Jul 13, 2005
    Lucas wanted to borrow from myth generally (and Campbell [who Lucas loves] said myth = other people's religion). However, the way of the jedi clearly has more overlap with Buddhism, Taoism, Zen. To say that it's a metaphor strikes me as Christian chauvinism and wishful thinking (i.e., arguing it is the case because you want your religion to = jedi).
     
  10. Grover

    Grover Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2002
    The Force is a metaphor for the Bio-electricMagnetic field


    It's apparent that people are confusing 3 different things here:
    1. The Force (the original thread topic)
    2. Jedi and their philosophies/code
    3. Star Wars mythology/meta-themes as a whole



    1. The "Force" is chi, period. Chi,
    ki, prana, ruach, or, for those Christians, who, as was
    already posted, so often have to (fearfully) try to alter everything to fit
    their limited worldview, the Force is "etheric vitality" (as per
    famed Christian mystic, 'Daskalos' www.researchers-of-truth.com)

    Chi fits every description of the Force in the movies (well, except
    for midi-chlorians), though it's function tends to work far better on
    organic than in-organic targets. That is, chi works better on people, worse
    on objects, but the Force (except for Dooku whipping Kenobi), seems to work
    opposite. (you could never use chi to move an x-wing!)

    And finally, in a docu on A&E or Discovery or wherever, George said THE
    FORCE IS BASED ON CHI.

    See here: for real chi/ki/Force usage by a 'real' jedi: (towards bottom of
    page)
    Ueshiba Ki-throw, 1950's




    2. The Jedi are based largely on the samurai, the masters of
    which were all Zen masters (see Musashi, Tesshu, Yagyu). Essentially every
    Jedi philosophy ever spouted in any of the movies has a Buddhist influence,
    namely Zen. (of course, this will have a superficial Taoist feel as well).


    3. The overall theme and plot, ie, the mythology, is
    another topic altogether, as many have already commented. This, if
    anyplace, is where the Christian themes come in. (there is not one
    Christian theme or occurance, from virgin births, to sacrificial deaths,
    that haven't already occured in some other history or myth before
    Christianity). This topic is hackneyed and relatively common
    knowledge...assuming one actually wants the Truth of it, and isn't merely
    trying to verify their pre-existing world-view.

    (here's an old analysis I did years ago:
    http://www.ericgrove.com/StarWars_metaphysics.html)


    The original question to this thread was about the Force (1), but most of
    the response topics have been about the mythology(3).





     
  11. -maynard-

    -maynard- Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 1, 2005
    there are some parallels about some of the characters and main ideas, but its only a surface relationship.

    Another thing is that SW is contradictory to religions because the Force only benefits a handful of the priveleged, whereas religion has the potential to save everyone and give all of humanity immortality, not just 4 guys
     
  12. mandragora

    mandragora Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 28, 2005
    There's a thread I started years ago with an old account (the password for which I had lost - therefore I created the mandragora-account), in which many parallels between Taoism and the Jedi philosophy have been discussed - maybe it's of some interest for some of you. There are more connections than the Force between Star Wars and Chinese philosophy. For those who are interested and possibly willing to revive the discussion, this is the link: http://boards.theforce.net/Star_Wars_Community/b10012/1523876/p1

    Edit: What you are saying, maynard, that "SW is contradictory to religions because the Force only benefits a handful of the priveleged, whereas religion has the potential to save everyone and give all of humanity immortality" is not true for the Taoist concept of immortality. In Taoism, immortality must be earned through exercises in meditation. Interestingly, when it's accomplished, it is associated with a vanishing physical dead body and the reappearance as a conscious entity (more in the above-mentioned thread, if your interested). I find it hard to believe that it is just concidental that Lucas placed vanishing bodies of dying Jedi without knowing of this part of Taoist philosophy.


     
  13. -maynard-

    -maynard- Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 1, 2005
    well, im not familiar w/ Taoism. what im saying is this: in the SW universe, immortality cannot be gained by Frank the water farmer. Only the handful of those deemed "good" enough can reach the deeper understandings of the universe. So the average guy...actually 99.99% of the universe has little hope for themselves.

    One Christian belief is the idea that the lowly ones will inheret God's kingdom, not just the gifted, talented or those held in high esteem.
     
  14. jessie_smitts

    jessie_smitts Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Aug 2, 2005
    i think padme's butt in AOTC was a metaphor for a hot booty.
     
  15. Darth-Stryphe

    Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2001
    Upped at request.
     
  16. RamRed

    RamRed Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 16, 2002
    Only the handful of those deemed "good" enough can reach the deeper understandings of the universe. So the average guy...actually 99.99% of the universe has little hope for themselves.

    How is only a handful of people "deemed good enough" to reach a deeper understanding of the universe?
     
  17. Jedsithor

    Jedsithor Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 1, 2005
    It should be pointed out that the whole conceived by the Force = virgin birth of Jesus isn't entirely accurate...after all there's no proof that Shmi was a virgin and given the fact that she was a slave to a Hutt...I seriously doubt she was a virgin.
     
  18. Lord_Pilaf

    Lord_Pilaf Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Jan 9, 2006
    It's easy to impose the religious ideas you already follow into various forms of art, including movies and television. The fact of the matter is that Mr. Lucas was drawing off classical, mythylogical ideas of light and dark which predate the Abrahamic religions and are rather generic.
     
  19. nexivdr

    nexivdr Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Sep 6, 2006
    i dont know about christianity as much as buddhism with the jedi.
     
  20. Darth-Stryphe

    Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2001
    I never really got the impression it was meant to mirror Christianity until the PT, and even then I am not so sure. GL had said he used eastern religions for ideas on the Force.
     
  21. Master_Starwalker

    Master_Starwalker Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 20, 2003
    He once called himself a "Buddhist Methodist."
     
  22. AlrikFassbauer

    AlrikFassbauer Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 2, 2003
    The Force can't be any symbol for anything, because it is - in principle - real. Everyone knowing asian philosophies and religions knows that.

    Grover explained it quite good, imho.
     
  23. DarthBoba

    DarthBoba Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 29, 2000
    George describes himself as a "Buddhist-Methodist".
     
  24. darth-grievance

    darth-grievance Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Sep 17, 2006
    I can agree with the topic creator, though... You can relate Star Wars to almost all religions. General writers do not grab a story out of no-where. The ideas had to have come from somewhere have it be ancient Greece, Rome, etc.
     
  25. SEPARATESICKLEROOK2

    SEPARATESICKLEROOK2 Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Sep 1, 2003
    The Force is beyond Christianity. Christianity draws heavily from every mythology that was present around it. There are no original tenets in Christianity whatsoever. Virgin birth, the human sacrifice, rising from the dead,fallen angels, etc have all been explored in a variety of religions before it. Lucas explored "Hero of a thousand faces" earlier in his life, which as a compendium explored the human experience in the form of mythology, and i feel that is what makes SW so compelling, everyone from every religion (or lack thereof) can find something that speaks to them in SW. It is unfortunate that Christians think they have claim to all these ancient stories and express their inability to see the forest for the trees. Now, GL may be Christian, but he has stated his intentions were never to parallel any one religion before. That, largely, helped the SW saga become so universal to all. RE: The Force is a metaphor for the Human Experience.
     
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