The Hater Community

Discussion in 'Literature' started by barnsthefatjedi, Mar 21, 2001.

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  1. Darth Ludicrous Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2000
    star 5
    Well, it wouldn't do to create a Coma Star when the heroes have already beaten the Death Star. That would be a walk in the park for them, hence more advanced weapons. Not to mention the fact that with time comes progress.

    As for the characters, Luke could take down Kyp and Mara at once if he goes full throttle, Winter is Leia's aid and friend (every girl needs a best friend), and not really better than her, and Han could take down Dash every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Hell, Dash doesn't even remind me of Han in the least. Only the fact that both are smugglers and one's ship is a newer model of the other's. That's all superficial. Characterwise, they are very different.
  2. bigchicken Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2001
    I think you just sorta proved my point. My contention is that the EU is a poor idea to begin with. You have a charachter that sets out on a journey. In this case the trio set out to free the galaxy from tyrrany and evil. They succeed gloriously and.......the next day they run off to fight a tougher enemy???????? Followed by a series of tougher enemies??????


    What happens to " Le Mort D'Arthur" if Galahad wins the grail, only to have rebuild the temple on the mount? Or LOTR if Gandalf and the gang defeat Sauron...only to have Morgoth take his throne in a week.

    When this happens, you have to move from unique, powerful and exciting fantasy to dull, dreary and lifeless fiction. By "expanding" this story you take innovation and excitement and turn it into the Hardy Boys. Your plots have to get more and more convoluted, your charachters more and more static. Or, you kill them off by dropping a rock on their heads for a plot twist.

    What that does is makes the events of the original, classic work irrelavant. An anticlimax is one thing...but this is getting ridiculous.

    In my oppinion, when the death star was destroyed the charachters completed their arc. Luke, when he says "You have failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me" sums up all his courage, strength and will to make a stand. Why cheapen moments like this by making him act them out over and over again as if he were a saturday morning cartoon. To me, it's like covering the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel with plaster and painting it eggshell white to match the pope's hat.

    This is by no means the fault of the authors. They are simply working on material that, like a McDonalds happy meal is fine the first time. Reheat it though, and its not that pretty and definately not that satisfying.


    Then again, maybe it's just me.

    bc.
  3. Darth Ludicrous Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2000
    star 5
    You mean like in Lord of the Rings during the Scouring of the Shire. The Hobbits return home heroes, but still have to prove it to the other Hobbits by defeating Sauran and the Humans, granted the enemy, isn't as tough, but it is a different battle on different terms and still affects their world.
    Good always triumphs over Evil, but Evil always comes back because it is always in the hearts of man. It's the whole idea of Original Sin. Even Jesus' victory on the cross when he died for our sins does not keep Satan from this world.
  4. bigchicken Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2001
    Like I said, an anticlimax is one thing...beating a dead horse is another entirely.

    The difference is, Frodo dosent go home to find a cloned ring, 2 or 3 better weapons than the ring ever was, 200 ringwraiths, Sauron ressurected, and the mouth of Sauron take his place and start all over again. He also didnt drop a rock on Legolas's head to keep the fans interested.

    Then again, maybe it's just me.

    btw...Im really enjoying this. Intelligent discussion is hard to find at times. Please dont let this degenerate.
  5. bigchicken Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2001
    About the Original Sin, I agree completely. And, the bible essentially ends with the resurection of Christ. Everything else is prologue.

    In essence all you have after that is the spread of the word of Jesus. You dont have Lucifer's apprentice come back the next day, forcing the apostles into action. You dont have Shiva making a cameo. You dont have Mary Magdelin making wine of water.
  6. DaJames Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2000
    star 4
    Sorry bigchicken, my poultry friend, but i really liked LOTR and i would be quite willing to forgive Tolkien if he pulled out Morgoth with a half million Sauron-clones and the ghost of Saruman travelling around the countryside whining about how unfair life is, IF he was able to keep the story alive. I liked the characters, i liked the setting and i really want to see some more of it, even if it's only repetition. Instead i have to settle for books about Elves, set a million years or so previously and written in a form of English that makes Shakespeare look like a couple of mates hanging out at McDonalds.

    Lucky me, my other big addiction (Star Wars) has been fulfilled on a regular basis. I don't like the idea of the Emperor coming back, but i wouldn't mind it so much if Tom Veitch or whoever wrote it didn't decide to rewrite the end of Return of the Jedi. The Bantam books remained locked in place for years, with the main characters still the same, but badly characterised. The whole idea of NJO is to get Star Wars moving again, in a new direction.
  7. bigchicken Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2001
    DaJames,

    If Im not mistaken, The Silmarilion is a compilation of notes published posthumously. I believe he used them as backstory, much as GL does with his mythic binder. If that was published, edited by Anthony Daniels it probably wouldnt make much sense to you and I either. Thats the trouble with having someone else interpret your vision for you.

    On getting your "fix" of Star Wars or LOTR...thats where you and I differ. I dont want to know more about the charachters. In my oppinion they completed their arcs. If one was to write something interesting in my oppinion it would have to be something almost completely unrelated. I would be much happier if the EU was based on events FAR into the future. I would be very interested in the reformed republic 200 years later. I would also be interested in events that were 200 or more years before EP1. That way, you can keep the essence and atmosphere of the SW universe while maintaining the integrity of GL's vision

    To me, watching the same charachters do the same things over and over again is very sad. It's like taking my favourite baseball glove from my childhood, slapping a Nike sticker on, making it Day-Glo pink, telling me it has supernatural powers and doubles as a magic carpet. Those things may be attractive features to some but then it would cease to be my baseball glove....wouldn't it?


    Then again, maybe it's just me.

    bc.

    p.s. Would the Sauron clones be Saurrons? ;)


    EDIT: for poor grammar and the post script

  8. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    No, no, NO! You've got it all wrong!





    Clones have two VOWELS, not consonants! It would be Sauuron, or Saauron! [face_laugh]
  9. bigchicken Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2001
    So...if you cloned a clone he would be Sauuroon. Or if you cloned a cloned clone could he be Saauuroon?

    Wow...I really think Im getting the hang of this EU stuff. :cool:

    Then again, maybe It's just me.

    bc.
  10. Dev Sibwarra Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 1999
    star 4
    Clones always have an extra "u". There's a really bad pun in that which I won't go into more detail on.
  11. barnsthefatjedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2001
    star 5
    There is some very interesting discussion going on in here. I hope the Community continues to progress in this manner.

    To all members of the EUDF. Thank you for your consideration and respect for our views. You are welcome to participate in this thread as long you abide by the Community's principles of posting stated in my first post. As Emperor of the Community I would like to offer you a friendly warning. Do not try to govern the Community by telling members what to do. You have no right to order members around in this thread and such behaviour will not be tolerated in the Community. If people do choose to mindlessly flame in the Community without any real coherance then it is an internal matter which we will deal with. Not you. I hope that our alliance is a long and strong one, but please, you are not Community members and your authority is not recognised here. Thank you for your co-operation.

    I have decided that in wake of recent conflicts it is a sensible idea to have a command structure within the Community. I will be Emperor. Shortly I will invite members who I feel deserve ranks to join the High Command. However you must be a member of the Community in order for you to be selected.

    Please continue the interesting discussion.

    Emperor Barns ;)
  12. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Very well put Emperor....we're peaceful, and we haven't attacked yet. But some people have tried to detur us from our goal of creating a nice, and respected community.
  13. Yanksfan Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2000
    star 5
    Oooh, am I member yet?

    It is with a real fire in my blood that I loathe Mara Jade Skywalker. She is an over-hyped, overrated two dimensional character, who's only purpose it seems, is to take valuable screen time away from *real* 'Star Wars' characters. I can't stand her.
  14. sweetheart Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 19, 2001
    star 4
    Gooood Yanksfan you are turning to the Dark Side! [face_devil] Buahahahaha!

    Mara's ok. What's annoying is how she is not "aging" despite being a redhead, and redhead show premature aging more than anyone. That's annoying.

    But my *real* top hating favorites are: Bria, Isolder, and Callista. I hate Mary Sues.
  15. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    Why are BOTH your signup pages locked? ?[face_plain]
  16. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Well in a PM, DL wrote "no. You keep it in the original HC topic. I locked both because another topic was not needed." Soo...there's your answer...just sign up for the HCDF here and it'll apply.
  17. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    Oh, I'M not planning to sign up. I was just curious.
  18. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    I hate negative fan feedback from the people who mourn Chewie's death. "Ohh it's a horrible book because he died." No it's not. You either like or hate VP there's no middle ground. I personally like it it truly brought the EU back from la-la land.

    Now you can bash me for it, but those people who say "Since you killed Chewie I'm not reading EU again." <~~~ Those people aren't fans, love it or hate it Chewie's death made things better. And those of you who braved Chewie's death are the TRUE fans of the EU.
  19. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    Hey, we have something in common!
  20. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    See we're not ALL monsters...
  21. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    What are you talking about?! I'm a monster!
  22. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Im the Wookiee monster, WOOKIEES!!!
  23. Ben_Solo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2001
    star 3
    Hey EU Defence Council! You can take your 3000+ posts and shove them up your arse! We will soon rule this message board, and you will become our slaves. Oh, i'm quite sorry to tell you that your deflecter shield will not be operational when my freinds arrive!
  24. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    Regarding the flag of truce with the EUDF we are at peace conditions right now. And let me state that we do not condone bashing other people's speculations, ideas, or opinions on the EU. ANY members acting in such a way shall be out of the HC and will have to formally apologize to the one they attacked. We are not an evil entity....atleast I'm not of the dark part of this group. My opinions I have stated and given good reaons for them as per our directive.

    The JC is our home as well as the EUDF so share it well and let it all be in good fun. And respect. Flaming will be tolerated if you are flamed first. I cannot stress this enough, we're not offensive.
  25. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    Ooooooooookay. Someone *coughbensolocough* needs a nap. [face_laugh]
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