The Hell Thread

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by The1, Jul 18, 2002.

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  1. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    According to REVELATIONS, there is no night in Heaven.

    Well there you go, heaven for some hell for others. What about people who would rather experience night and day, who would like to look at the stars and the moon? No night? What a rip off. :p

  2. gwaernardel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    A pet peeve of mine:
    The book is called Revelation, not The Revelations, as in the Revelation of John.
  3. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    Brooks:

    I'll ask this one more time. See if you can answer the question this time, rather than attacking me personally.

    A child is born in Iraq. As per state law, he's raised to be a devout Muslim, and trained to believe that he'll be damned if he even considers converting to another religion. He dies in an accident at age thirteen, never having heard the word of Christ.

    One: Does he go to Hell? Two: If so, did he send himself there? Three: If so, how?

    Finally, let me clear something up: I'm not questioning God. I'm questioning your interpretation of God, and if you ask me, arrogance isn't questioning such an idea; it's assuming that you yourself are one hundred percent right.
  4. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    Well Geist, the kid was past the "age of accountability"

    I think this is the age where God decides on sending people to hell who don't believe the way he wants them to. So, basically the kid's blank out of luck.

    Anyway the muslim faith is the only true one and all infidels will burn so the kid really has nothing to worry about. It's all those other religions that better come to allah before they die.
  5. Darkside_Spirit Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 3
    The caveat is that the people who would not accept it while here on earth will not just magically change their minds and accept it there. If you wouldn't accept it here, you won't accept it there.


    Kimball_Kinnison, do you really believe that people will either Accept the Gospel or Not Accept the Gospel, with upbringing and environment playing no part whatsoever?

    If the answer is "yes", then it's an extraordinary coincidence that most people follow their parents' religion.

    If the answer is "no", then what degree of proselytization will the people receive after they die? Will they get just a passing mention, or a full two decades of Christian upbringing?
  6. Kimball_Kinnison Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2001
    star 6
    Kimball_Kinnison, do you really believe that people will either Accept the Gospel or Not Accept the Gospel, with upbringing and environment playing no part whatsoever?

    Yes, I do. I spent two years as a missionary for my church (yes, I'm LDS), and in that time I saw people from all walks of life and from a great variety of upbringings accept the Gospel. With that background, I can say that the Gospel transcends upbringing and environment.

    If the answer is "yes", then it's an extraordinary coincidence that most people follow their parents' religion.

    If the answer is "no", then what degree of proselytization will the people receive after they die? Will they get just a passing mention, or a full two decades of Christian upbringing?


    I don't know the specifics of the proselytization they will receive (not being dead, I figure I don't need to worry about it yet). However, God will provide everyone a fair chance to accept the Gospel or reject it. Whether that is two weeks, two years or two hundred years, I don't know.

    However, not everyone will accept. During my mission, I met people who said "I know that what you are teaching is true, but I don't want to change." If a person is not willing to accept in this life, chances are that they won't accept in the next life. But God will still bless tham as much as He can for those principles of the Gospel that they do follow.

    Kimball Kinnison
  7. Darth_name Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 14, 2000
    star 4
    Once an atheist I knew argued that when you die, it is eternal darkness. That's how I envision hell. A conscious mind not being able to movie, talk, or see. Just infinite loneliness.
  8. Darkside_Spirit Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 3
    Yes, I do. I spent two years as a missionary for my church (yes, I'm LDS), and in that time I saw people from all walks of life and from a great variety of upbringings accept the Gospel. With that background, I can say that the Gospel transcends upbringing and environment.


    In that case, why aren't we constantly seeing pockets of Christianity appearing all over the world? Why are the vast majority of Indian children Hindu, the vast majority of Afghanistanian children Muslim, etc? I'm not saying that people brought up in other environments are incapable of accepting the Gospel, merely that they are less likely. Surely you cannot maintain that someone brought up in a Christian home, in a Christian country, with Christian parents, attending a Christian school for their education, is as likely to accept the Gospel as a child of Muslim parents in Afghanistan.

    I don't know the specifics of the proselytization they will receive (not being dead, I figure I don't need to worry about it yet). However, God will provide everyone a fair chance to accept the Gospel or reject it.


    So, do the children of Christian families get a period after death in which they are given the opportunity to posthumously reject the Gospel, in order to even things out?
  9. DESERTJEDI Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2001
    star 4
    Why would a loving god cast someone into hell for only the reason they did not know about him or had their own "other" beliefs.

    Sounds like an evil god to me, if he would like to throw the Dalai Lama into a pit of fire.

    Why would I want to live under a gospel by an evil tyrrant bent on controling everybody.
  10. Darth_name Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 14, 2000
    star 4
  11. Obi-HaCoR Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2002
    star 5
    DESERTJEDI : "Why would a loving god cast someone into hell for only the reason they did not know about him or had their own "other" beliefs.

    Sounds like an evil god to me, if he would like to throw the Dalai Lama into a pit of fire. Why would I want to live under a gospel by an evil tyrrant bent on controling everybody"


    First off, I really don't appreciate you bashing a God that you personally don't know anything about because you havent done your own research and going by simply what people are telling you.

    First off, he doesn't caste you there. It is your decision. He's given you free will to choose what ever you want to. You can either accept him and live with Him in eternal Life, or you can reject him and go to Hell basically. Its your decision, not His to make. He gave his only son for us, and his son died for us and opened the gates of heaven to give us the oppertunity to live with Him forever. An oppertunity that we didn't deserve. Christ died for the ungodly, so that they could seek him and find him and join him.

    For those without the oppertunity to have ever heard Him, I don't think you would go to Hell for that. I believe when you die, and if you've never heard the gospel before, I believe God gives you the oppertunity to jojn him. I think he gives you a chance to choose for yourself. He created free will in us to make our own decisions. Its not Him who casts us away, its ourselves. He's a loving God that wants the best for you, and the best is with him. If you reject that, you've made your own decision.

    If your going to place a thread that you know will bring forth tons of different people with different religious backgrounds, why even Bash on other peoples Gods. As a Christian, I do respect other peoples religion, but that doesn't mean I have to accept it as the truth. Tell me all you want about your religion, I'm interested in hearing about it, I want to learn more. Just because I learn about your religion doesn't mean I feel its right. Just because I feel it isn't right doesn't mean I'm going to sit there and Bash your god over it. What right do I have to do that??? I don't have any. When talking about religion, it would be nice if we had grown ups instead of some people being little kids about things and demoralizing someone elses Religion simply because they don't understand it the way you do.

    May The Force Be With You,
    Obi-HaCoR

  12. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    First off, he doesn't caste you there. It is your decision. He's given you free will to choose what ever you want to. You can either accept him and live with Him in eternal Life, or you can reject him and go to Hell basically.

    I think what some people are saying is that they don't like the idea of having to choose to follow/worship God or go to Hell for not doing so.
  13. Kimball_Kinnison Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2001
    star 6
    In that case, why aren't we constantly seeing pockets of Christianity appearing all over the world? Why are the vast majority of Indian children Hindu, the vast majority of Afghanistanian children Muslim, etc? I'm not saying that people brought up in other environments are incapable of accepting the Gospel, merely that they are less likely. Surely you cannot maintain that someone brought up in a Christian home, in a Christian country, with Christian parents, attending a Christian school for their education, is as likely to accept the Gospel as a child of Muslim parents in Afghanistan.

    Well, all I can do is speak from my own experience. I have personally met people from many different religions (including many non-Christian ones), some of whom had little-to-no knowledge of Christ or his teachings, who have accepted the Gospel. It is a slow, indiviual process. As a missionary, I worked with individuals, not populations. On an individual basis, I have seen the Gospel transcend cultural upbringing and environment.

    So, do the children of Christian families get a period after death in which they are given the opportunity to posthumously reject the Gospel, in order to even things out?

    You accept the gospel through obedience and reject it through disobedience. Once you have learned that something is true, if you choose to disobey it you are rejecting it. In that way, yes, everyone still has the opportunity to reject the Gospel by choosing to disobey it.

    Those who are likely to accept the Gospel after they die are those who tried to follow all the truth they could during their lives, but who never had the opportunity to recieve the full Gospel. Unfortunately, not everyone will choose to follow the truth.

    Kimball Kinnison
  14. DarthYama Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2001
    star 4
    Did you know they weren't Christians?<gasp!>
    Is this due to there being no Christians at the time?
    And what makes people think that they spend the afterlife with everyone? I don't believe in an afterlife, but I'd rather be with people I care about for until the universe goes cold and black and the atomic bonds fail.
  15. Saint_of_Killers Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 5
  16. CwrnPuppet Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 4
    Hey, if Heaven and Hell want to compete for my business, they should at least send me travel pamphlets with photos.
  17. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    Sounds like an evil god to me, if he would like to throw the Dalai Lama into a pit of fire.

    Well a more liberal christian might leave the pit of fire out, and just say that hell is eternal seperation from God, loneliness, etc. So maybe the dalai lama is just totally seperated from God and lonely since he did nothing to benefit himself spiritually. Just like Hitler. Him and Hitler will share a room down there. Maybe Osama Bin Laden will bunk with Einstein, i'm not exactly sure. The point is they're cramped for space.


    (lighten up, kids.)
  18. CwrnPuppet Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 4
    Well a more liberal christian might leave the pit of fire out, and just say that hell is eternal seperation from God, loneliness, etc. So maybe the dali lama is just totally seperated from God and lonely since he did nothing to benefit himself spiritually.

    I almost peed my pants, laughing.

    Just like Hitler. Him and Hitler will share a room down there.

    Yeah, birds of a feather...

    Maybe Osama Bin Laden will bunk with Einstein, i'm not exactly sure. The point is they're cramped for space.

    Hehehehehehehe. This would make a great sitcom.
  19. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
  20. DESERTJEDI Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2001
    star 4
    First off, I really don't appreciate you bashing a God that you personally don't know anything about because you havent done your own research and going by simply what people are telling you

    Easy there cowboy, I wasn't bashing "your" god, Partner. I asked a simple question, don't get your shorts in a wad.

    You don't see me going off on cydonia for saying hitler and the dalai lama are going to be in the same place and playing chess with jimi hendrix in the after life.

    although if thats what christians believe, well thats mean to other people. how do you all know that there isn't a "magical" place for them too. :p

    maybe the dali lama is just totally seperated from God and lonely since he did nothing to benefit himself spiritually

    Now that is something I have never heard of before, the dalai lama is not spiritual? [face_shocked]
  21. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
  22. Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 1999
    star 5
    It's amazing how people can be so sure of places they've never seen. No-one knows about the afterlife because no-one has ever come back from death.

    I think it might be more like "What Dreams May Come"-you make your own afterlife, based on your own thoughts and dreams. This I can believe, because I cannot imagine living in another dimension with members of civilizations long dead. I think if there is an afterlife, it is personal for each individual, although individuals can interact with loved ones and 'come together' by thinking of that person.

    Just my opinion.

    By the way, as far as near-death experiences go, many neurologists are divided on the issue. There is simply no way to tell whether or not they are a true afterlife experience. For me, the proof is in the paradox: you can reduce whatever you want to brain function, but studying the brain only tells you about the wires-it doesn't shed any light on the battery. We can look at brainwaves and electrochemical impulses all we like, but if a human brain is more than just the cellular wiring, we are doomed never to find the soul, because most scientists have never even started looking.

    I personally don't think it is a question science will ever answer. It is a matter of faith, and for me, that is the proof.

    Peace,

    V-03
  23. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
  24. Chris2 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 4
    According to "Female Christ" Dore Williamson, Hell is a lot like the Star Wars cantina:


    http://members.tripod.com/~spirit_of_prophecy/hell.html




  25. Chris2 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 4
    Anyway, on heaven---

    The bible seems to state that it's a place of total peace, where people can reguarly hang out with God and everybody else without any fear. It's also pretty too; it's apparentally filled with precious stones and other stuff. Heaven has two parts, apparentally-Heaven the realm, which is the core part of God's throne--and a "fixed" Earth itself at the end of time. Not sure about how the other planets and so on fit into this "kingdom". Also, social standings and ranks have little meaning there--there is no marriage either, since everyone is practically equal. Although certainly people will remember their families, and can perhaps hang out with them.
    As for Gender, it's hard to say--and sexual relations seem to be obselete since you have a spiritual body of some kind and there's no need to procreate.
    Apparentally people have houses of some kind, as well. Also, animals will apparentally be there, and even former carnivores will be friendly.("The Lion shall lay with the lamb")
    It's not exactly the mystical pleasure world many people imagine, but it's a small price to pray for peace, isn't it?
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