The 'Higher Ground' ending of ROTS duel: Good for TPM's duel ending or bad?

I understand that Obi-Wan spoke both tactically and morally, (i.e. I am morally higher than you anakin, therefore you have already lost, etc etc.)

However, tactically speaking, what did that statement, and its result do for the end of tpm's duel? Good for it or bad? IMO after rots I personally think TPM's ending needs an edit BAD; Obi-wan's leap needs to be sped be uberly, and perhaps his saber strike needs to be artificially sped up (so it looks like he is using his last strength to draw heavily on the force and speed up his actions) otherwise Maul looks like a moron.

Obi-wan had enough time to dodge anakins saber strike (after anakin jumps), and then chop off THREE limbs; while Maul onle had to do one of these to survive. I say there is still time for edit before the 6 saga series set is released.

 

The sequence of events should have been:

A. Obi-Wan jumps.

B. Saber is in hand.

C. Maul is cut in half in the middle of Obi-Wan's flip.

 

Maul wasn't thinking "Ha! I have the higher ground!" Maul was thinking "Ha! This fool is going to fall down that big hole!" that's the biggest difference. Maul also wasn't thinking "Better block this lightsaber blow." Maul was thinking "I kicked his lightsaber down that pit." In short: Maul is stupid.

 

Yes, that's how it should have been. Would have qualified as the coolest kill move in Star Wars movie history and been a TOTALLY satisfying end to a spectacular duel.

 

And I'm sure Kenobi could of just as easily of killed Anakin, but was being held back by his attachment for him. By warning him that he had the higher ground, he was saying "I'm most likely going to kill you if you try it, and I really don't want too."

Maul, like Anakin was cockheaded at the end and figured he had Kenobi where he wanted him (just like Anakin's "You underestimate my power!" line before he jumps). Like mentioned above, Maul figured "I got this idiot in the hole, he's just a padawan and he's got no lightsaber -- what's he gonna do?"

Never underestimate your opponent would be the lesson here.

 

The whole point with the end of TPM's duel is Maul's lack of concentration and extreme overconfidence.

In RotS, Obi-Wan is confident - but not overly so, and he is prepared for Anakin to jump; Maul is not. Thus, I don't think the RotS duel affects how I see TPM's duel in the slightest.

 

When Obi-Wan says "Don't try it" he of all people should know, being that, for all we know, he came up with that move against Maul, and knows precisley how to counter it.

*good* for TPM's ending. Good for ROTS's ending, and good for me!

 

Yes, it is supposed to show Mual's overconfindence (rightly placed IMO since he just basically dominated and crushed one jedi master and his apprentice at the same time) but what I am saying is that after watching ROTS's end duel, I think TPM duels ending needs to be sped up. ZTo be more specific, obi-wan's leap needs to be sped up since Maul had much more of a reaction time than obi-wan did when he faced anakins leap.

YES, obi-wan was prepared, and facing an armed opponent; but even then IMO the inconsisitency, which has palgued many sine tpm, has become even more glaring now after rots's duel.

It just stings that the best and most intense duel in the entire saga is being slighted by a sloppy ending.

 

I do have to admit that the idea of having Obi-Wan slice through Maul on the way down while he is still in the air is a kick ass one. I think it would make Maul's death much more believable.

 

Yup, yup, Strilo. Or as was suggested, a horizontal slice (like he ultimately got) whilst Obi was in mid-flip.

But getting him AS he's landing would be cool, too! Kind of a diagonal slash down his front that doesn't necessarily result in a de-cap (but FATAL!)?

Anakin's leap, although telegraphed to the max, was REALLY quick and impressive. I liked in the videogame for ROTS the alternate ending you can unlock that shows what might have happened had Anakin succeeded with that leap!

 

Or as was suggested, a horizontal slice (like he ultimately got) whilst Obi was in mid-flip

That's what I was talking about.

 

maybe maul didn't realize he had the high ground advantage.

 

Maul was an overconfident fool.

All that was needed to finish off Obi was a force push or lightning zap and that would have been the end of it. Instead, he chose to be like a cat and toy with his prey (man, does this seem like a common thing with overconfident villians)...taunting him with his saber and staring down, just waiting for him to give up and drop, beg for mercy, whatever.

That's what so cool about the Terminator. He didn't taunt you or play with you...he just killed you.

I also liked that about Christian Bale in "Equilibrium". He was awesome in that (though he was a bad/good guy in the vein of "Logan's Run").

 

Maul was never the great thinker.

 

Not so sure about that. Keep in mind he was sidious's apprentice; the only _TRUE_ apprentice one might say, since he was uncorrupted by jedi teachings, and was a sith from the get-go, just like palps.

Plus, keep in mind that Maul tracked padme's ship when no one else in the galaxy was able to do so; in the OT vader had an entire armada at his disposal, yet could not find the millenium falcon at all. (had to beg the bounty hunters for help).

 

Maul was dealing with some royal pilots who never had to evade anyone a day in their lives, whereas Solo was a seasoned smuggler(who was the best according to Jabba) who evaded an imperial fleet in an asteroid field. Hardly a good basis for judgement of intelligence.

 

Never had to evade anyone in their lives? <sarcasm>I suppose the part where they evaded the trade federation BATTLE ARMADA and an entire palnetary BLOCKADE must have been my imagination.</sarcasm>

(They also did not do this in an asteroid field I might add; much easier to hide in a field of asteroids than to hide in CLEAR FREAKING view. )

 

Don't forget that Maul also had the trace from the communication from Naboo, telling him they were Tatooine, helping his search considerably.

But thats not really the point of this thread.

 

The Higher ground issue isn't a continuity problem. Maul did nothing. He had time to block Obi-wan's blow, but did nothing. Higher ground became irrelivant if Maul wasn't going to act.

 

I think that is the problem though. As bad as Maul was in the force and lightsaber combat, he didnt act. With his skills and such, Obi Wan should have never bested Maul that way. I think that Mauls demise should have been different, seeing as how Anakin was made short work of by Obi Wan while trying to use the same tactic.

 

Personally, I think that the Obi-Wan slice in The Phantom Menace should stay the way it is. Most people are missing the point of why Lucas had Obi-Wan land first, then slice at Maul:

First, Obi-Wan was only a padawan. He needed to concentrate on the jump, the un-ignited saber at Qui-Gon's side, and Maul all at the same time.

Second, there is no time for the saber to get all the way over to the duel in time for Obi-Wan to do the move. Think about it, in order for Obi-Wan to do the move, he would need to send the lightsaber to his hand way before he started the jump, which would give Maul a heads-up on the move and he could end it before it started.

and
Third, and most importantly, Lucas wanted to show how arrogant the Sith, and specifically Maul, was to not be ready for that move. Maul thought Obi-Wan was doomed and never expected in a million years that a young Jedi would be able to do something that clever and skilled. Wasn't it great to see the surprised look on Maul's face as Obi-Wan landed in front of him?

 

If I might interject for a moment with my opinion

As many have said here, Maul was arrogant, and that played a part in his downfall. I also agree that the end of the RotS duel doesn't really detract from the TPM one, if anything it helps bridge them (at least, that's what I felt when I saw it). Like wcleere stated earlier, if you execute a move, you'd best know how to counter it yourself. It showed Obi-Wan was a smart fighter, and being smart keeps you alive longer.

As far as the finishing move goes, I think the TPM finale had a good tempo to it, so I don't think it requires any modifications - to speed it up would make it feel like it went by too quickly, bookended as it is by slower tempos. It's flashy enough to be a good finisher, far better than I've seen in other swordfights around that time.

An incredible finishing move, absolutely. My only quibble is that some yahoo would say it's already been used by Duncan MacLeod in the Highlander series.

Crap. That yahoo turned out to be me, huh? Well, who's to say you can't tweak a good move and make it your own?

 

I think that is the problem though. As bad as Maul was in the force and lightsaber combat, he didnt act.

It is a problem, but has nothing to do with higher ground. Maul didn't try, which causes an inconsitancy in his character, not an inconsistancy between movies.

 

otherwise Maul looks like a moron

He does look like a moron. He looks at Obi jump over him and doesn't do anything as he gets cut in two. Pretty weak.

 

But is that as bad as actually being WARNED out loud as to what would happen were one to actually jump? Obi-Wan told anakin what, yet li'l ani still jumped and still got chopped up. THat is not simply weak, its downright stupid.