Amph The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey, The Desolation of Smaug, Battle of the Five Armies

Discussion in 'Community' started by -Courtney-, Nov 25, 2006.

  1. Nobody145 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2007
    star 4
    I can see why the critics say what they say. How much has to be in spoilers now? Well, I'll just be a bit careful then just in case.

    Show Spoiler
    Most of the performances are great, if this was during Lord of the Rings with Radagast delivering messages on Gandalf's behalf I'd love it, but... after LotR I shouldn't be surprised, but I'm just so tired of the added angst, but then I am somewhat of a book purist. The elves and dwarves are never on really great terms with each other, but this was ridiculous (like them "sneaking" out of Rivendell). Thorin is far from perfect, but this is really heavy-handed, but again, no surprise after how Aragorn only got Narsil back halfway through the third movie personally from Eldrond. And poor blue wizards, not even Gandalf bothers to remember their names. :p
    Last edited by Nobody145, Dec 15, 2012
  2. Mar17swgirl Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 26, 2000
    star 7
    The reason why Gandalf couldn't name the Blue Wizards is that they're only named in the Unfinished Tales to which PJ and co. didn't have the rights. :p Personally I loved the way they worked around that - made Gandalf forgetful. :p

    I have a small plush hedgehog (a birthday present from a friend when I was a kid) who has been my travelling partner for many years. Even now he's sitting at the night table of my hotel room. I never bothered to name him, but after seeing the Hobbit, I'm totally naming him Sebastian. :p
    Chewgumma likes this.
  3. ophelia Cards Against Humanity Host. Ex-Mod

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    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 6
    Hooray for hedgehogs! I have no pet hedgies at the moment, but if I ever bring home a little boy hog in the future, I'll seriously consider naming him Sebastian. :p
  4. Rebel_Padawan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 11, 2003
    star 4
    Video blog of the premiere!!


    Just quietly. Peter's daughter is smokin' hot.
  5. Point Given Mod of Literature and Community

    Manager
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    Dec 12, 2006
    star 5
    I thought the hedgehog scene was strange up until he called him Sebastian, which happens to be my youngest brother's name. Got a big laugh from me.
  6. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

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    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
    I saw the movie last night ad really enjoyed it. Didn't feel sick or anything.

    I still don't see how they're going to split the rest into two movies, but I'm sure I'll just be pleasantly surprised :)

    Though--where was Radagast during LOTR? And the blue wizards, for that matter?
  7. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    Show Spoiler
    I really liked the 48 fps. I loved all the references to different scenes, and was fine with a lot of the changes they made (even if i might also have liked to see them the way they were written. The repeated falling a really long way uninjured and the stone giant sequence annoyed me, and I'm slightly worried by the theft of certain lines from the end of the book that were included in this one, but other than that, I really enjoyed the film. Bag-end was great, not stretched at all. If anything, the movie could have been a little longer. Actually, Radagast getting over the mountains in a bunny sled also bothered me. We have a massive set piece for the Dwarves crossing, but the fact that there were mountains never came up for Radagast.

    MAmbrosius, I shall respond soon, I just got my Wi-Fi back and am swamped at the moment...
  8. Blue_Jedi33 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2003
    star 5
    I can't read all these posts, but I have a question do you think Gollum is looking better this round is because of the 48 fps ?
    Last edited by Blue_Jedi33, Dec 15, 2012
  9. AaylaSecurOWNED Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2005
    star 6
    I saw it in 24fps and I thought he looked better. I think it's just improvements in CGI over the last 10 years.
  10. Mar17swgirl Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 26, 2000
    star 7
    Went to see it again, in 24fps 2D this time, and the blur and flickering was considerable and annoying. It still looks very sharp and crisp, but the 48fps version is so much more fluid and smooth, it makes the wide sweeping shots look 100% better, without the irritating blur.

    I'll post my thoughts on the story later tonight.
    Random Comments likes this.
  11. Everton Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 18, 2003
    star 10
    Yep, the 48fps version knocked the 24fps version out of the park. For the first time a 3D movie looked at home on the cinema screen. It would on interesting to see a 48fps 2D version, but since that's not an option I'm happy to proclaim 48fps 3D a success.
    Mar17swgirl and Random Comments like this.
  12. Legolas Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 6
    They made him look younger
  13. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    @Merlin_Ambrosius69
    To clarify my stance here, I agree with C."the large number of them is essential to the story," but don't think B. can be supported. (And I've read The Hobbit numerous times, too.) I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say with A...
  14. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
    They were having a pizza party.
  15. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    Radagast is there for a bit in the books.
    The blue wizards are in the east.
  16. -NaTaLie- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    It's ironic because the book is a tight adventure about one man's (hobbit's) transformation. They could have made one three-hour movie of the entire book and satisfied everyone, from fans to casual moviegoers. Instead, they decided to make as epic as possible with as many links to LOTR as possible and as a result lost the narrative thrust.
    Bacon164 likes this.
  17. Todd the Jedi Mod and Sitcom Dad of SWTV

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    Oct 16, 2008
    star 5
    Lol, I remember a friend of mine had a crazy theory that Radagast was really Saruman in disguise or something. I should check what theatres around me have the 48 fps, if they even mention it.
  18. Legolas Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 6
    Radagast is doesn't appear in the book only mentioned
    Last edited by Darth Vader, Dec 15, 2012
  19. Lugija Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 3, 2009
    star 4
    One movie would have made me happy... for about a year. In the next December, I would have watched the extended edition and said quietly aloud "Can I have more Middle-Earth?" and listened to the echo bounce from the walls. This way I'm happy until 2015.

    I saw it yesterday, and I'm incapable of saying anything about it, on the account of me being too happy. Have to go see it again with other friends on holidays.
  20. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    You're probably right....I haven't read it since last January (I read them every January).
  21. Miana Kenobi Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Apr 5, 2000
    star 8
    Rachel's ridiculous long review, under a spoiler cut for, well, spoilers, and for length.

    Show Spoiler

    Where to even start... I guess I can start by saying that I am extremely happy with it. I did not walk out of the movie both times thinking "OMG this is the greatest movie in my entire life!" but I definitely loved it. I have very little negative things to say about it.

    So the story itself is following very closely to the book. There's far less to cover so they can embellish on it a bit more. That being said, PJ and his team's attention to detail made me SO happy. There are so many tiny itty-bitty details in it that made me ecstatic. Off the top of my head, the fact that the elves are vegetarian. I know it seems silly, and they do use it as a joke in the film, but that's just a little side-detail that PJ threw in there that I was just happy got mentioned. Also there are some throw-away names that also made me happy, like Radagast calling the spiders "some spawn of Ungoliant." I'm pretty sure most my friends don't even know who Ungoliant is, but it made me happy. One that made me giggle was Gandalf naming the 5 wizards and commenting that he didn't remember the names of the two Blues. Little stuff like that makes me happy.

    There are a few times when it does derive from the book, namely the main antagonist of the first film (and I suppose he will continue on through the other ones). Focusing first on the small changes, I kinda like them. Embellishing on the escape from the Goblin lair, making the troll scene a bit more comedic, I thought they were fun changes. I know one of my friends has an issue with Gandalf giving Bilbo Sting as opposed to Bilbo finding it, but I like it in the film as it's definitely helping Bilbo's character growth.

    The biggest addition to the book was Radagast, whom I absolutely loved.

    There are a few small changes I still have some issue with, like Thorin's lack of a beard. While I'm happy that Richard Armitage gets to keep some sexiness, he's THORIN. Thorin should have an epic beard. Then there's the whole part about the fact that a handful of the dwarves were at that battle for Moria, which they even point out was 60 years earlier. So... how long do dwarves live, exactly? My next big complaint is that the eagles didn't take them to Gwaihir, because damnit I wanted to see how they would handle Gwaihir.

    So the big three changes. First off, Azog as the antagonist. While they tweaked the history a bit, they did get right the fact that Azog killed King Thror. However, that was before that big battle, but the battle was brought on by him killing Thror (and he did behead him, but only after torturing him for a few days). It didn't really say if Thorin was there or not, but the biggest difference here is the fact that Azog was killed in that battle by Dain, the lord of the Dwarves of the Iron Hills (Thorin's second cousin whom we will see in the 3rd Hobbit film). So instead in the film, we have Azog alive and Thorin's mortal enemy. While yes, this is a big change, I really like it because honestly the films need a villain. Technically it kinda is Smaug, but Smaug isn't there for a while, and even then, Smaug isn't going to be in the Battle of the Five Armies, where the Big Baddy needs to be defeated for good.

    Which leads into the 2nd big change that it's not just some pack of wolves that trap the dwarves in the trees but it's Azog and his warg pack. The big change here is that the film adds the first showdown between Thorin and Azog, and I honestly kinda love that Thorin got his ass kicked. This is just going to help build up the tension and anticipation of the next Thorin vs. Azog showdown.

    Then there was Bilbo's involvement in that whole scene. At first I was very "WTF this doesn't happen" but I really loved the scene. The entire movie we've been building up from Bilbo being completely helpless to Bilbo finally realizing his own courage and strength. Plus it helped build the trust and respect between Thorin and Bilbo, which is going to be key for the other two films (MORE MAN HUGS!).


    The 3rd change is the whole council meeting of Elrond, Galadriel, Gandalf, and Saruman, which was handled so much better than I thought. I'll grudgingly admit that I'm now okay with Galadriel being in the film, though I REALLY don't like that foreshadowing comment about her telling Gandalf that if he ever needs her, she'll be there. Galadriel, I don't want you popping up in more movies!

    So then the whole Necromancer discussion and the Morgul blade. So yeah, the blade isn't in the appendices at ALL, but I thought it was a very well thought out plot device to lead us into the Dol Guldor plot.


    So next let's look at the dwarves. We really only get to know a few very well: Thorin, naturally, Balin (who I really really love, even though he's the exposition dwarf but I'm sure now I'm going to be SUPER sad every time I watch Fellowship and they find Balin's tomb in Moria), and then to a lesser degree, Bofur and Kili. We get to know Dwalin, Fili, and Ori a tiny bit, but then the rest just get glossed over. Dori and Nori I think only have like 1 or 2 lines each, Oin has turned into a tiny bit of comedy relief with his bad hearing, and then I honestly don't remember if Gloin, Bifur, or Bombur had more than one line each. I really hope over the next two films the rest of them get a bit more development. Especially concerning how some of them are related. Even if they're throw away lines, I want the films to at least address the fact that Fili and Kili are Thorin's nephews, or the fact that Gloin is Gimli's father.


    So things I loved: First up, the Riddles in the Dark scene was absolutely PERFECT. It makes me a bit sad that Gollum's part in the Hobbit films is now done. At first I was rather bummed that they didn't do a shot for shot recreation of Bilbo finding the ring, but the more I think about it, I still enjoyed how Freeman handled it.

    Next up, I love the movie parallels. Thorin pulling the arrow out of the orc and saying "Elves" with the same disdain and style of Legolas pulling the arrow out of the dwarf in Moria and saying "Orcs." Bilbo falling and having the ring slip on in the same style of Frodo's first time putting on the ring. Perfect.

    I loved Elrond so much in this movie. Even though it's only 60 years before Fellowship, I loved how they tried to make him (and Galadriel) look younger. Plus, instead of brooding Elrond, we get action-hero Elrond! Which is awesome.

    Speaking of elves, I got not only 1 but TWO glimpses of Thranduil. And that made me so freaking happy you don't even know. He's only my favorite character for god knows what reason and the only character that I am terrified of PJ messing up.

    I haven't even talked about the 48fps!! I will admit this; I enjoyed 48fps more the second time of seeing it. The first time, it took me maybe 5 minutes to get accustomed to it, and it wasn't until the end that my eyes 100% adjusted. There were a few times my eyes felt strained, but that could also be because I was so sleep deprived. However on second viewing, I loved it and it look less than a minute to get fully readjusted. There was one whole shot that I did have the thought of "Oh, this does kind look like a BBC film," but that was very near the beginning in Dale and only one shot. After that, it just made the entire film look SO much cleaner and prettier. A few people commented that the fast-action scenes looked like they were in fast-forward. I never got that; they just looked like the characters were going fast to me. :p


    Overall, I will give this a 9.5 out of 10. Very well done, and the Tolkien nerd inside of me is very happy.
    Summer Dreamer likes this.
  22. -NaTaLie- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2001
    star 4
    I'd rather leave the theater wanting more than sit there wishing it would end soon.
    Bacon164 likes this.
  23. Legolas Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 6
    And that Morgul blade is also a plot device for LOTR so is the spirit of the Witch King
  24. Miana Kenobi Admin Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Apr 5, 2000
    star 8
    Yes but I liked it's inclusion as a way to segue into the Dol Guldur plot.
  25. VadersLaMent Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2002
    star 9
    The Balrog is so far my favorite scene of the 4 films, but this just might be my fav film overall. Visually speaking it utterly buries the others, every environment was just flat out incredible looking.

    SPOILS! (open)
    The two most iconic moments in this for me were the riddle battle and the meeting between Gandalf, Elrond, Saruman, and Galadriel. I have never read the books. I have only seen the animated films before Jackson did these films. Nostalgia feels good. What bit of Smaug there was was well done. To date Vermithrax is the best dragon on screen. I hope Smaug beats it but I have this feeling I will have a "too cartoony" moment with the special effects. We shall see. I thought to myself, "Why didn't the damned eagles fly them a little closer if not all the way? Ah! Because a batch of dwarves and a wizard riding to the Lonely Mountain with a wizard in tow via giant eagles might get too much attention. Fine.

    I don't know how accurate Thorin was to the books but that was a well done role.



    So, which would you prefer, dinner with elves or dinner with dwarves?

    EDIT: I have zero complaints about the length of the film or what could have been done without. I would have sat there for 6 hours if need be, crossing my legs to prevent a bathroom break so as not to miss anything.
    Last edited by VadersLaMent, Dec 15, 2012