The Key to what was Wrong

Who wouldn´t be obsessed
by a girl like Padme?!
I know I am!
Falling in love for sure
but also becoming
sexually aroused
and obsessed!
It´s inevitable!
The urges are
to strong!
Down boy!

 

More credible? Well, I was looking at girls when I was 14... I can even imagine fixating on one for the next five.

Anakin had a five-year jumpstart on you. He didn't look at Padme in a sexual or romantic way when he was 9, since he had yet to hit puberty. He just saw her as this really pretty girl who was sweet to him. Then when puberty hit, the feelings were intensified.

And it isn't as if the Jedi are a male-only order. He must have met other females in the decade.

And none of them were Padme. Plus Jedi are not supposed to get romantically involved.

 

"Absense makes the heart grow fonder."

Anyway, the real key to what was wrong, was that fanboys like yourself were not allowed to write and direct the movie. Oh wait, it's not your movie and IF you had penned it and directed it, we would be here complaining about what an unbelievable piece of bantha poop it was.
You want to do better, go to the fan film thread and learn to make your own.

 

What would be a more likely age for you feel like that OB3 - when you were 14 or when you were 9?

Absence seems to make something grow, anyway...

 

He didn´t feel like that
at all when he was nine!
But through the years
of isolation, boredom
and loneliness during
his jedi training,
without his mom
and missing his
only opposite
sex encounter
iow Padme,
it grew into a very
unhealthy obsession
which ultimately contributes
to his unavoidable downfall
deep into bottomless pit
of the dark side!
Tragic!

 

SHELLEY--
He THINKS he's better than all Jedi. That doesn't mean he is. Aside from his podracing abilities, we don't see that Anakin is a Force prodigy--he has a lot of power, but he doesn't know how to use it. I don't see why he'd necessarily develop his skills faster than other Padawans.



including Yoda. And everyone else seems to think he's pretty close, including his own master.

Oh? Then why does he say, "Only in your mind, my young Padawan!" when Anakin says he equals Yoda in lightsaber skills?

>>>Obi Wan basically tells Anakin that if he would truly apply himself that he could be Yoda's rival. I can't imagine Obi Wan throwing comparisons out like that to every padawan. Obi Wan also tells MAce that Anakin's talents and skill have made him "arrogant." The implication here is that Anakin is a lot better than the rest is progressing much quicker so he's cocky. There is also the obvious foreshadowing of Anakin and Palpatine saying that he will be the most powerful Jedi ever. >>>>>


For the billionth time...Lucas wanted him an innocent child in TPM to show that the future Darth Vader did not start out bad, and that his separation from his mother was a big deal to him. It would not have been so easy to show this if he was a teenager.

Why can't innocence and pain of separation be shown in a teenager? Is that unbelievable? not at all. Asolescence is the most emotionally vulnerable time of most people's lives. It would probably make the most believable scenario.

What's the big deal with making him 14 in TPM? Why are YOU so fixated on seeing him at that age?

I am not fixated on the age 14, but Anakin in TPM was not a very compelling, interesting character. It is hard to get a good emotional range from a 9 year old kid. If Anakin was supposed to sit and smile and look innocent and say yipeee, then he should really not be the main character of TPM and it should not be the "story of Anakin Skywalker". He should be more of a background character because as is, he is not doing much to be a driving force as a character. At least having him as a teenager gives a little chance for us to be moved by the performance. I know you probably disagree, but I was not impressed with Jake Lloyd. But I do think some of the criticism of him wa sunwarranted. The job was too big for him, or any 9 year old IMHO.



Yeah. And when's the last time you saw a SW movie move ahead 5 years in the middle?

When was the last time you saw a SW scroll move in the opposite direction of the OT's? Or when was the last time we saw a double-bladed lightsaber? There's nothing wrong with doing some a little different from the formula.

I can see the complaints if he'd done that: "Why did Lucas do that stupid jump in time? He's raping my childhood by not staying true to the formula he used in the other movies!"

Well, it seems like you are just ranting here.



WRONG. It is harder to convey innocence in a teenager than a small child. It is harder for a child to leave their mother than a teenager.

Again, I don't see why this is the case. Why can't teenagers be innocent? Why is their separation from a mother any less compelling? It's all about the actors and the direction. You could have a 75 year old man lose his mother and get tears flowing in the audience.

I fail to see how anything significant would have come from seeing Anakin as a 14-year-old, except it would have shut some bashers up. Although they'd have found other stuff to whine about, like, "How come we didn't see Anakin's childhood? Why didn't we see more of him with his mother? Lucas should have shown us, not told us in flashback!"

Again, you're ranting about people critiquing the film.

Having him older brings more credibility to some of the plot (the Padme/Anakin romance)

How?

Because it's not believable for a 9th grader to be romantically attracted to a 4th grader. In fact, it's disturbing.



Oh, I think Anakin was pretty dynamic in TPM.

I respectf

 

"Absense makes the heart grow fonder."

Well, there's this one girl I liked in my class when I was a Sophomore in high school...and just recently I told her that I liked her...and I'm already a Senior in college

 

Like Qui-Gon told him after he was freed from slavery: training to become a jedi is not easy but a hard way of life.
But of course he would take the
chance to try that in the
center of the galaxy any
day before being a slave
in a dessert in the
outer rim.
But he was to reckless
and impulsive to
pull it off.

 

"Obi-Wan IS here and the force is with him!"

I ALWAYS wondered why Vader said that. At some point, the Force leaves a Jedi or something?

 

Obi Wan basically tells Anakin that if he would truly apply himself that he could be Yoda's rival. I can't imagine Obi Wan throwing comparisons out like that to every padawan.

He has exactly one Padawan: Anakin. And I took that comment to be spoken in exasperated sarcasm.

Obi Wan also tells MAce that Anakin's talents and skill have made him "arrogant." The implication here is that Anakin is a lot better than the rest is progressing much quicker so he's cocky.

The implication is that he's got such strong powers that he's arrogant. And perhaps he is progressing quicker, but this progression came about more recently, like in the last couple of years.

There is also the obvious foreshadowing of Anakin and Palpatine saying that he will be the most powerful Jedi ever.

Yes. So?

Why can't innocence and pain of separation be shown in a teenager?

Because it is harder to convey innocence in a teenager than in a child, and a separation from one's parent is harder to take when you are a small child than when you are a teenager. Teenagers tend to be striving toward independence, and bucking under parental authority.

Is that unbelievable? not at all. Asolescence is the most emotionally vulnerable time of most people's lives. It would probably make the most believable scenario.

I think a small child is pretty vulnerable.

I am not fixated on the age 14, but Anakin in TPM was not a very compelling, interesting character. It is hard to get a good emotional range from a 9 year old kid. If Anakin was supposed to sit and smile and look innocent and say yipeee,

He did a lot more than that.

When was the last time you saw a SW scroll move in the opposite direction of the OT's?

Say wha-?

Or when was the last time we saw a double-bladed lightsaber? There's nothing wrong with doing some a little different from the formula.

Little? Try major difference in the formula.

Well, it seems like you are just ranting here.

No, actually, I'm basing that on the basher complaints I've seen, which on the one hand say that the events of TPM could have been condensed into a 10-minute prologue, and then go on to complain that we are "told" too much in TPM and AOTC and not "shown" it.

Again, I don't see why this is the case. Why can't teenagers be innocent?

Because teenagers are going through puberty, are experiencing sexual impulses, and have a greater perception of right and wrong than children. Moreover, they are more rebellious.

Why is their separation from a mother any less compelling?

Because teenagers are generally starting to detach from their parents. A 9-year-old is not.

Because it's not believable for a 9th grader to be romantically attracted to a 4th grader. In fact, it's disturbing.

It's disturbing that you'd think that Anakin was romantically attracted to Padme in TPM.

 

Because it's not believable for a 9th grader to be romantically attracted to a 4th grader. In fact, it's disturbing.

A 9th grader attracted to a 4th grader? Very bad...unlike a 4th grader like Nelson Muntz getting with a 2nd grader like Lisa Simpson


...


Okay I'm just being facetious to make this debate a little more lighthearted

 

"And the time away from his mother without so much as an interstellar phone call would likewise not have strained credibility so much"

When are people going to accept that training to be a Jedi means severing ties with family? That's why the Jedi try to get kids when they're very young and haven't developed that much of an attachment yet.

Whether or not the Jedi were making a mistake by doing this is a matter of opinion. The PT is very focused on what the Jedi did wrong, over confidence etc. Even in ESB, Yoda doesn't want Luke to go after his friends. In my opinion, Human beings need friends and family, and Luke needed friends and family (Han and Leia).

As far as I can tell in AOTC, protecting Padme is Anakin's first mission. So he's spent the last ten years in the temple training and being told to extinguish his feelings for his mother. Obviously it didn't work because he runs off to find her, but it doesn't mean it didn't happen and this plot point does not affect the story's credibility at all.

 

What do you want to bet that 200 years from now, when we're all dead, that if you watch a copy of THE PHANTOM MENACE, Anakin will STILL be nine years old!, and so shall it ever be. Let's all move along and stop beating a dead horse. I remember this debate raging in 1999.

If you don't like the way other people write their stories, that's fine, you're certainly entitled your opinion. But how many times do we have to go over this! LOL

This debate is as predictable as a forced four hour walking tour of your own living room.

Be constructive and write your own stories where you will have control of the content and then you (we all hope ) will be happy!
Unless of course you start bashing yourself!

 

*Shakes head*

Those who cannot create will be critics.

And this is what we have here, a bunch of people who don't share an ounce of talent between them that have decided to make themselves feel better by bashing something others have the creativity, and intelligence to simply appreciate.

You see this is entertainment, not religion. Try not to hold it up to such high standards.

 

Its amazing.

We're talking about credibility as it relates to the real world. When did anyone ever hear about somebody travelling across the Galaxy in a matter of minutes? When did anyone ever see a vicious lightsaber attack? When did anyone ever see a person dropping thousands of feet through the air onto a floating vehicle?

And the only thing that lacked credibility was that a nine year old boy developed a crush on a girl over ten years time?

Does anybody else find this reasoning to lack credibility?

If there are problems with the PT, this would hardly make the difference.

 

"We're talking about credibility as it relates to the real world. When did anyone ever hear about somebody travelling across the Galaxy in a matter of minutes? When did anyone ever see a vicious lightsaber attack? When did anyone ever see a person dropping thousands of feet through the air onto a floating vehicle?"

actually its credibility as it relates to the audience... yes there may be fantasy elements... things that dont exist in the real world, but real world emotions and human interactions still have to be credible otherwise the viewer would simply not relate to the situation, the story, or the characters.

 

I think that the reason many disliked showing Anakin at 9yrs old is not so much Jake Lloyd or all discussion about the emotional detachment from his mother; but rather the problem stems from our preconceived ideas about how Anakin became a Jedi in the first place.

Before the Prequels, we knew nothing about how old children became Jedi, how they were found, and what it would mean to enter the Jedi order at an older age.

Even from the OT, when Yoda proclaimed that Luke was too old to begin the training, we had no information that Jedi children were discovered and entered the order shortly after birth.

So though Luke was around 18-20 yrs old in TESB, we all likely thought that maybe he was probably 10 years older than he should have been to start training as a Jedi, or Yoda was trying to find a way to not have to train this impatient young man.

Then there is what we thought of Obi-Wan and how he discovered Anakin; or so we thought he did until TPM. We for the most part got a completely different story than what we put together based on the info from the OT, even the words that Obi-Wan said in Yoda being the Jedi Master that instructed him.

So in reality, it is our preconceived ideas, notions and thoughts that have created these disappointments by some over seeing Anakin at 9yrs old.

The truth is, many of us wanted to see a middle-teen young man, with some anger problems, but powerful in the Force, and Obi-Wan discovers him and decides that he can train this young boy as well as Yoda trained him.

I think it is preconceived ideas from the OT that have contributed to people having a problem seeing Anakin start out at 9yrs old on his path to becoming Darth Vader.

The OT is the culprit in this case, or at least what we thought we were going to see after all these years of waiting for the Prequels.

Darth Sin!

 

I understand that relating to characters emotionally is important, but there are a few things to realize.

She was the only woman, besides his mother, that he grew attached to. Even if it was only for a short time. Padme was the last girl he had met before he joined a life without attachment. I think that is part of his problem. She was also a remnant of his old life. Actually she is a bridge between his old life and his new life. He couldn't let go of the old.

Anyway, I hardly find the scenario to be unbelievable. Especially to the point where it somehow mires the entire PT.

 

"Be constructive and write your own stories where you will have control of the content and then you (we all hope ) will be
happy! "

thank you, don't mind if i do!

"unless you start bashing yourself!"

of course not, but maybe others will?
i've begun work on my own fanfic screenplay. i'll start posting on the forums as soon as i've got enough to draw people in.

 

Bashing the bashers, no better than the normal bashers....

It would have been a good idea except it is better for the whole "leaving mom" thing. I agree with that, cause it is true.

However, I would not have minded a more mature Anakin. For example, such as Anakin being a person who would obay the spirt of the law and not just the words (then again, he was not much better in AOTC).

Although showing Anakin's innocence may be a good idea, is it really? A part of me finds it unbelievable for a person who became almost compleatly evil to have had any innocens. However, this I have to live with because Anakin had to have been a "good man." (wait a second though, he was just a boy...?)

Maybe in the other ways it would have been better for Anakin to be older in TPM in those other ways. But it was good for his him mother to be used as a plot device to start to turn him to the dark side. Not many people seem to argue that it was a bad idea, and since it is such a big thing, it was sort of needed for Anakin to be young in TPM.

 

There are a number of reasons that Lucas made Anakin 9 years old.

1. It is more remarkable from a movie standpoint to make a 9-year old save the day than a 14 year old. Especially from a child's point of view

2. It showed how special Anakin was. How much he could do at such a young age.

3. It gives a better sense of how difficult Luke's journey to become a Jedi actually is. If his father, who's training started at 9 was considered too old, than imagine Luke.

4. the mother/son relationship would be harder to form. At 14, a teenager is already rebelling and looking to leave home. There's little emotional attachment that's created that could lead to the fall of Anakin.

5. He needed to convey Anakin's innocence. A 14-year old wouldn't do that quite as effectively.

Now granted, it may have been possible to make him a bit older, say 11 years old. That way he would have been able to choose from a wider range of actors and for many a 3-year spread between Padme and Anakin wouldn't have been as big a deal.

 

I hear a lot a criticism about the age difference between Padme and Anakin in TPM. One possible reason GL may have decided to have the Anakin character be 9, and thus pre-pubescent, was to indicate that his relationship with Padme was more than just sexual attraction. Just something to consider, I think.

 

"I said, 'They're gonna hate this. They're gonna get really upset that I have a 9-year-old as the hero.' But what can I do? That's the story. I can't make him 15. The whole story is about where he came from, who is he? You had to start at the beginning."

George Lucas
Time April 29, 2002

 

Ya know, I literally - LITERALLY - had to scroll up to the top of the screen to make sure I hadn't logged onto the TPM forum by mistake.

If you're going to be a basher, for heaven's sake, could we PLEASE get with the program?

This topic has been brought up at least five trillion times, and been beaten to death Every Single Time.

If you want to bash, bash the romance, or Hayden's acting, or anything, just find something NEW.

Thank you.