The Last Hurrah

Discussion in 'Communications' started by Liz Skywalker, Dec 8, 2003.

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  1. Vertical Former Head Admin

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 1999
    star 6
    // pushes phantom ban button

    ;)
  2. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    I try to have dreams of Whaladon swinging parties, but alas, I have nothing to go by.

    Can someone point me to some good fan-fic involving it?
  3. Saint_of_Killers Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 5
    If the whaladons are gay, I'm sure Liz can. Liz knows her fags.

    Edit: GOING TO SLEEP NOW. GRR.
  4. MeBeJedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 6
  5. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    Saint,
    I said "I have nothing to go by," not "I have nothing to go bi-" :D
  6. DarthBreezy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 6
    So the OC rule has been usurpted?
    I thought we had put this matter (at least part of it) behind us... :(

    If I had the time I would chase down the thread in WRF where we got the word from down on high but if it's been changed....
  7. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    So the OC rule has been usurpted?

    For those of us uninitiated in the ways of the Fic, can you illuminate us please? :)
  8. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
  9. Isbeth Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 28, 2001
    star 4
    Um, why do gays call lesbians "dyke" and use the terms "fag" and "queer"? I would think that would be derogatory. Kinda like calling a black person the "n" word, I would think. But come to think of it, there are black people who call one another that. :confused: This makes no sense. I have always found that confusing. :confused: Whether a person is gay or straight, we should treat them with respect. :)
  10. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    Isbeth, I'm confused as well and see things the same way. And I definitely agree with the last part about treating everyone with respect and dignity.
  11. Liz Skywalker Ex-Mod

    Member Since:
    Jun 13, 2000
    star 6
    You. Have. Josh's. Reasons.

    And if you would bother to read my first post, I refuted his points. Considering that he closed that thread immediatly upon posting that, there was nowhere to refute.

    Times have also changed since.



    How many times do you expect such behavior to go unnoticed?

    Do you people honestly think GL cares about the Jedi Council Forums?



    Josh's boards are risked everytime he posts a spoiler.

    Amen.



    3) LFL HAS gone around and shut down places hosting those derivitive works that are slash -- that's fact.

    PPOR.



    Um, why do gays call lesbians "dyke" and use the terms "fag" and "queer"?

    If you're refering to Sainty's last comment, it's because he's a honey.

    As for why lesbians and gays do it to each other, we're reclaiming them. Though calling the Queer Eye guy the Fab Five has to go.




    Am I the only person who's curious as to why this thread has 460 replies and not one of them is from the man to whom the first post is addressed? Considering that not only did he log in yesterday, he also posted several times in a private forum.
  12. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    What was his reponse to the PM you sent him directing him to this thread and inquiring a response?
  13. MeBeJedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 6
  14. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    3) LFL HAS gone around and shut down places hosting those derivitive works that are slash -- that's fact.

    PPOR.


    Um, I already have I thought.

    "Lucasfilm has suppressed Skywalker slash on the grounds that it harms the Star Wars image"

    Which part of that was unclear?

    EDIT: Lest there be confusion:
    Main Entry: sup·press
    Pronunciation: s&-'pres
    Function: transitive verb
    Etymology: Middle English, from Latin suppressus, past participle of supprimere, from sub- + premere to press -- more at PRESS
    Date: 14th century
    1 : to put down by authority or force : SUBDUE
    2 : to keep from public knowledge: as a : to keep secret b : to stop or prohibit the publication or revelation of
    3 a : to exclude from consciousness b : to keep from giving vent to :
  15. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    Liz...
    "And if you would bother to read my first post, I refuted his points."

    As your agreement, understanding, acceptance or otherwise approval of Josh's reasons is not really relevent to Josh's reasons, so there is no point in somehow refuting them in your mind.

    Furthermore, I refuted several of your points, and you responded by stating 1) "now's not the time," and 2) "I'm not going to comment on it." Why do you hold Josh to a standard different from your own.

    "Am I the only person who's curious as to why this thread has 460 replies and not one of them is from the man to whom the first post is addressed? Considering that not only did he log in yesterday, he also posted several times in a private forum."

    There's no reason for you to be curious about that. One of the last times this came up, and Josh gave his reason, his response was:
      "Joshua Griffin
      2/12 12:30pm
      "Yet it still angers some parents and powerful political groups. So instead of opening themselves up to hate mail, criticism, and boycotts of their own, the TF.N staff/owners has decided to make a call that avoids all that. They have no obligation to break down any walls of prejudice against slash fiction OR help reduce bias against homosexuals. SW doesn't depict any homosexual relationships, but no one is accusing GL of declaring homosexuality wrong by that omission. They have every right to dictate what they will allow on their site and message boards. They aren't stating their opinion about gays and lesbians with this policy, they are avoiding conflict."

      The horse is dead. Lets quit beating it.
      Josh"
    Could it be that he believes the horse is dead and that it should quit getting beat?

    That's at least the way I read his thoughts.

    So we come back around full circle. You stated that the. Point. To. This. Thread. Is. To. Get. Josh's. Reason. (Period.)

    Whether you believe those reasons are refuted or not, the fact is you have them.

    What is the point of this thread now?
  16. MeBeJedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 6
    "And if you would bother to read my first post, I refuted his points."

    Which accounts for nothing.

    "As your agreement, understanding, acceptance or otherwise approval of Josh's reasons is not really relevent to Josh's reasons, so there is no point in somehow refuting them in your mind."

    Agreed.

    "Times have also changed since."

    But answers haven't.

    "Josh's boards are risked everytime he posts a spoiler."

    "Amen."


    So now spoilers of Ep.III are on the same level as homosexual stories of major characters, which LFL has stated ahead of time are unacceptable?

    I don't think so.

    "Am I the only person who's curious as to why this thread has 460 replies and not one of them is from the man to whom the first post is addressed?"

    Not really, since his answer is known unless otherwise changed, which would be when he would make another appearance. That being said, you are the only person who is trying to make some implication about his absence.

    I might also add, I find some humor in the fact that you believe slash fan-fic should be okay because Josh doesn't go to the fan-fic boards, but you are upset that he won't go to the comms boards. You want him out of one area, but demand him in another? ?[face_plain]

  17. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    You're not getting it. Times change and answers haven't means that he created a rule for whatever reason and he's staying with it. He can do that in this virtual world he owns. Answer don't have to change. And technically he doesn't have to answer them. I'd be posting the same thing if I weren't a mod. That is really just the way it is in Cyberspace.
  18. MariahJade2 Former Fan Fiction Archive Editor

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2001
    star 5
    DP, I think Breezy is referring to Original Character. OC. I'm not sure if I remember the exact rule she's referring to though.
  19. Isbeth Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 28, 2001
    star 4
    Isn't the whole point that this is Josh's board and he can do what he wants for whatever reason he wants? Josh seems like a pretty reasonable guy. I haven't read every one of these posts, but didn't you just PM him and discuss this with him privately? :confused: I kinda agree with Genghis, I don't get the point of this thread. :confused: Liz if you want this so very badly, what is wrong with a compromise. You start your own board with only slash fan fiction and post links to it, here or in your sig or in a header in fan fiction. Maybe run a thread in fan fiction resources called, "Go Here for Best Fan Fiction With Slash" and give links to the best slash fiction. Or is that against the rules, too? :confused: Wouldn't this be easier than to get someone else to change their policy or create a special board as a trial? How about a private board where slash readers can register to read it, and Liz could mod it, to keep away spammers and underage folks. It would seem to me this would be a bear to mod with all these anti-gay feelings some people harbor, and trying to keep hostile folks from being idiots. I know there is a separate registering area for fan fic, maybe you can tie it in somehow to that.

    Liz thanks for your response about the terms, "fag", "queer" but it still sounds derogatory instead of claiming someone. :confused: and for the life of me I can't see why Fab Five is worse. It sounds the best of the lot. :)
  20. Liz Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2000
    star 1
    You start your own board with only slash fan fiction and post links to it, here or in your sig or in a header in fan fiction. Maybe run a thread in fan fiction resources called, "Go Here for Best Fan Fiction With Slash" and give links to the best slash fiction. Or is that against the rules, too?

    Yes. Very.
  21. jedi_master_ousley Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 14, 2002
    star 8
    I said I was done unless I found something interesting. Well, I found something interesting.

    7/23 1:48pm RE: Homosexuality and theforce.net

    Right now there's landmark moral and legal battles in the US, Canada and more about the topic of homosexuality. Feel free to post all you want about homosexuality in the Senate. That is why that controversial forum was created in the first place - for issues we wouldn't normally allow on this message board in any capacity.

    Josh


    Also, a quote from Sapient that Josh agreed with here in that same thread:

    No matter my opinion on this subject, when I actualy stand back and look at it, I'm amazed that we are debating this at a Star Wars movie messagboard. Amazing. Doesn't the whole thing just seem beyond why we ever joined the site in the first place?

    Date Posted: 2/12 12:30pm Subject: RE: Homophobia in the JC

    Yet it still angers some parents and powerful political groups. So instead of opening themselves up to hate mail, criticism, and boycotts of their own, the TF.N staff/owners has decided to make a call that avoids all that. They have no obligation to break down any walls of prejudice against slash fiction OR help reduce bias against homosexuals. SW doesn't depict any homosexual relationships, but no one is accusing GL of declaring homosexuality wrong by that omission. They have every right to dictate what they will allow on their site and message boards. They aren't stating their opinion about gays and lesbians with this policy, they are avoiding conflict.

    The horse is dead. Lets quit beating it.

    Josh


    Date Posted: 2/11 11:48am Subject: RE: Homophobia in the JC

    I'm definitely not a relgious fundamentalist. Wow, anyone who actually knows me would know that is quite far from the truth.

    Obviously, you do not.

    A member wrote this once and I love whey they said:



    It's a highly controversial topic and there are a large number of parents out there who do not want their children to be exposed to anything that depicts homosexual lifestyles. There is a reason that 'Will and Grace' is aired at 9pm in the US, because they believe most children will already be in bed and not still watching television. And the show is still the target of protests and boycotts.

    And with all of that, all they do is TALK about being gay. They don't makeout and there aren't any bedroom scenes. For the majority of the series, 'Will' has been single and while 'Jack' jokes about being promiscuous, he is rarely, if ever, seen with another man.

    Yet it still angers some parents and powerful political groups. So instead of opening themselves up to hate mail, criticism, and boycotts of their own, the TF.N staff/owners has decided to make a call that avoids all that. They have no obligation to break down any walls of prejudice against slash fiction OR help reduce bias against homosexuals. SW doesn't depict any homosexual relationships, but no one is accusing GL of declaring homosexuality wrong by that omission. They have every right to dictate what they will allow on their site and message boards. They aren't stating their opinion about gays and lesbians with this policy, they are avoiding conflict.



    Josh


    Date Posted: 2/10 3:20pm Subject: RE: Homophobia in the JC

    Yes, moot. As for now, the policy stands without question.

    Josh


    Date Posted: 11/12/02 7:18am Subject: RE: Slash isn't allowed on the JC

    If anyone wants to know what I think, simply read Gay-LenKenobi's post directly above this one.

    I simply could not say it
  22. Genghis12 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 1999
    star 6
    For those keeping score, the count's up to 457 now, I think.
  23. anakin_girl Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2000
    star 6
    Why do people question Josh's sincerity when he states that he's just trying to avoid controversy?

    Actually, if he'd pop in here and say that, I would buy it. I am a member of another site that does not allow slash for that reason--I am friends with the site owner and I know for a fact that she has nothing against homosexuals or homosexual fanfic itself, she just doesn't want to deal with the crud that she believes it would cause (I disagree with her on whether it would cause the **** to hit the fan, but I pick my battles). What I have a problem with is his disagreeing for religious reasons--that seems to me that he's forcing everyone here to conform to his religious views. I come here to discuss Star Wars, not to listen to a sermon.

    Which do you think he prefers? I'm sure he's just fine with people criticizing him for being too religious, as opposed to criticizing him for being too sinful.

    People say I'm too sinful and I'm going to hell all the time. I either ignore it or tell them to bite me, depending on the circumstances.

    His canon rules don't hurt me. Having to accept that the Solo kids got kidnapped every second day does.

    Amen to that. Let's see...with a mother who is leader of the New Republic, a father who is a former smuggler and has a Wookie for a best friend, and an uncle who is a Jedi Master, you'd think they'd be a little better protected. Who wants to kidnap the little brats anyway?

    Back on topic...
  24. Isbeth Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 28, 2001
    star 4
    Well then, Liz, you can always PM folks and give them links to your board of slash fan fiction. I know you see this as very NIMBY to you, but try and see it from Josh's point of view as, he is worried that something he has created and nurtured could be shut down if he did this. Then we all wouldn't be happy. :( Don't blame Josh, blame those people out there who are hostile to all things gay. If they didn't exist, this wouldn't be an issue.
  25. anakin_girl Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2000
    star 6
    What if the boarder did something personally offensive to you in this room?

    You mean would I allow a conservative who was always trying to convert me to his/her social beliefs to rent a room from me? Yes. Would I allow someone who didn't bathe to rent a room from me? Yes. Would I allow someone who insults Anakin Skywalker to rent a room from me? Yes.

    I can't think of anything that is "personally offensive to me" that I would stop someone else from doing unless they were actually hurting someone or, as in the case you mentioned above, could get me arrested.

    And if Lucasfilm is shutting down sites that allow homosexual fan fiction, they've got a long way to go before they reach this one.

    Are you going to start rallying against establishments that require certain articles of clothing because they infringe on your rights?

    No, because I wear a shirt and shoes in public anyway so I really don't care.

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