***The Lightsaber Choreography Contest Begins***

If I can see THIS, I can die in peace.

20th Century Fox Presents...

A Watanabe Shinichi Film...

Ryan Wieber vs Zhang Ziyi

Written by Joss Whedon...

Photographed by Peter Pau...

Action Choreographer Wu Ping Yuen...

Visual Effects by Nate Caauwe...

Special Effects courtesy of DetFilms...

Balloon hats by Teague Chrystie...

Tits by Adam Bertocci...

Release thread by Christopher Spencely...

Squirrels by Zach Nichols...

With special appearances by:

• Ray Park


• Kitano Takeshi


• Konstantin Khabenskiy


• Gary Oldman


• Bill Nighy


• Geoffrey Rush


• Kate Winslet


• and Swimmerman91

Special Thanks to:

• The RED Consortium


• Arri


• J.L Fisher


• GlideCam


• The New York Film Commission


• George Lucas


• Basil Poledouris


• and Guiermo Del Toro

Head asplode. I would be cool with death, then. I really wouldn't care if there was an afterlife; nothing could possibly compare.

 

But... where's Scarlett Johanssen??

 

Ryan and Kate Winslet would make for an awesome couple for Titanic 2, I guess.

 

3 E's, man.


Spenceley.

 

That's what's bothering you?

 

That and he wanted the tits.

 

Huh? A script!? Are you talking about another project that may hinder you from the LCC or are you talking about a script for the LCC? Because I really don't think you need a script, let alone a producer for your script to do do a lightsaber duel.

 

Actually, I think scripted stories should be encouraged now that the rules give us a decent amount of time to set up the fight. I know I for one am definitely in the process of writing a script. Fights with a reason far exceed fights for the sake of fighting in my book.

 

[image=http://cindybarry.com/images/ROTFL110x85.gif]

 

@Whiteley79 - Touche

 

Normally I'd agree with you, but seeing as these are videos being created simply to be judged for their choreography, I find that when I'm watching them I'm uninterested in the story part. I'm there to watch the fight.

If you want to film a story, knock yourself out, but unless it contains a crucial fact to understand what's happening (which let's face it, it's a fight. we'll figure it out), I'd save that edit for your own release later. There were a few entries last year that had more story than fighting, and that's really not what the competition is about.
If the time spent shooting the story had been spent working on the fighting, they prolly could've come out with better results.

Eclipse still remains my favorite example of "just enough" story. Without the opening, you might sit there wondering why the master isn't really fighting back. The little bit of intro sets up the premise, and understanding that, the fight works.

 

I'm MODIFYING an old script to have just enough context for the fight to make sense, much like Eclipse. It's a short action piece I wrote last year with the hopes of actually producing it for a demo reel center piece showcasing my skillz.

I really should say "treatment". A script, as I use it, isn't just a screenplay for a story. When I write, I include a detailed character list (VERY important for choreography), a shot list (What equipment will I need to best show this segment? What will I need for this special effect? What will the VFX supervisor need to know for this shot?), and production schedule. I think that's why 90% of contestants drop out, is because they don't plan out their production. They think they can just go to a park, start making up choreography, and then perform it all in a series of takes to be rotoscoped later. Sounds simple right? That's when procrastination sets in. "Oh we got a whole two months before it's due."

Planning is key, and anyone who's ever gotten anything of note released, they'll tell you planning, and sticking with your plan, is crucial to success. That's why I haven't committed yet. Until I get someone to help with planning and can see that I'll have the money, time, and dedicated cast/crew to pull it off, I can't make any claims.

 

Again, touche. But I don't think money is THAT necessarily for a duel like this. Get some sticks and go at! Unless you are doing something ambitious!

 

I agree with you. I like swords, and I like sword fighting. I'm constantly skipping over dialogue and story to get to the good parts of the fight in most videos. However, I think if you want your audience to truly be invested in your fight, you need to give them a reason to care. When I watch those videos, I already know the story, but it's still needed for that first couple of viewings.

Choreography should be shaped to communicate and enhance the story, not necessarily the other way around. I don't believe this contest is designed to show who can swing a stick better then anybody else.

The reason I love Eclipse so much isn't just because the fight itself is engaging, but the struggle that the Jedi is going through is clearly the focus.


All in all, I think we are both still enjoying the same thing. I can't wait to enjoy the videos this year. I hope you find the means to enter this time around, Vaportrail.

 

You're right. Money isn't always necessary. But for what I'm doing... It's gonna be the g3at3st fight 3v3r!!!!11!1!

 

If I'm honest, I don't see much of a point in making those contest duels too story-driven. After all, this is a lightsaber choreography contest, so if people actually want to make kind of a fanfilm with a lightsaber duel and dialogue and story, I wonder why they won't do this at any other time they want, without any restrictions, rules and what not.

It's a different story of course if you already have a film like that planned out and wanna use the chance to enter its saberfight in a choreography contest, but it doesn't make much sense for me to enter a fighting competition and stand up and say: "Okay, but I'm gonna make this a whole short film."

 

I think if people want to make a plot or story preface for their fight, fine. As Eclipse shows (the popular example) a small backstory can give a lot more drama and weight to a fight. In fact it can open the door to other kinds of choreography altogether. But only if it's executed well. And that's not always easy. But, if successful, adds kind of another dimension to the fight that they get to benefit from when it comes to judging. Alternatively, having two underexposed people in a parking lot with bad audio, giving a longwinded tale of betrayal, probably will not be doing them any favors. If the viewer is bored by the prologue (which, from what I can tell, could be longer than the fight), they're not heading into the fight with a good taste in their mouth already, and probably the entry will get judged more harshly. So it's kind of like an opportunity with risk involved. It can either help you, or hurt you, depending on whether or not your little story aspect is worthwhile/well done.

 

I always find story motivated action more rewarding. It's why despite my career I can never get into most hong kong kung-fu movies. I often get ridiculed for that. "Master of the Flying Guillotine" admittedly has some excellent fight sequences in it, but that's it. Without something behind it they get old very fast. Badly executed story elements can ruin an experience the same way ugly effects or bad acting can. It's a challenge to create story that the audience can invest in, but a rewarding one.

This is a choreography contest, but lets not fool ourselves. We'll still be influenced by the effects, the story, the production value, and the acting. If you can immerse us in your fight more completely with story, do it. We've seen in the past how production value and storyline can vastly improve an otherwise average fight scene. As an example, the last time I entered this contest, the winner didn't have a whole lot of fancy choreography, but the short looked beautiful, the acting was amazing and the story was enthralling.

 

Don?t get me wrong, I love all kinds of saber fights. Let me use the most popular as an example:

The Rvx series is great. The choreography is well thought out, the great effects serve a purpose while remaining flashy, and the camera leaves nothing to be desired. For all its success, I don't care about the two fighters or the outcome of their fight. The only reason I want to see it end is to see if Ryan will ever survive an encounter. The fight is so well done I want a story, as does everyone who watches it and comes up with theories about clones and whatnot. It's just fun to watch the fight, but I don?t care about it.

It's like watching mortal kombat with a bunch of friends to remember the old days when movies didn?t have to be good to enjoy them, or more recently watching The Happening to laugh at the horrid acting. It?s so much fun. (Note, I'm not in any way trying to say your stuff is as terrible as the happening. )

It?s not that I don?t like that style of lightsaber videos, I just personally prefer a story driven fight.


**Also, just to clarify, I?m not saying you should have a 20 min buildup to the fight in this contest; 2 or 3 minutes at the maximum.**

 

I think that's why I enjoyed "Art of the Saber" more than "Ryan vs. Dorkman". "Art of the Saber" had that snippet of story in the beginning and the payoff at the end was great.

But I would have to disagree that RvX doesn't have story. I think their story is told through the duel, especially "RvD2." It's a very simple story with a simple conflict, each character has a goal: kill my opponent. They did that in a very charming and entertaining way. Dorkman mentioned once that you can watch "RvD2" as a silent film and understand exactly what's going on. And really, you could.

My favorite duel out of any film/contest is the one between Yu Shu Lien and Jen Yu in "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon." What's especially great about that duel aside from its stellar, unrelenting choreography is that it tells a short story within the duel. It opens up with one simple line "Fine, the friendship is over." That's really all you need (even if you haven't seen the rest of the film). Two camera push-ins on both our fighters and we're into the fight. In the middle of the duel when Yu Shu Lien is starting to get tired and comes to terms that she'll never be able to defeat this bratty little girl as long as she holds the "Green Destiny" (a little bit like the Elder Wand in Harry Potter, hehe). Yu Shu Lien is giving her damned best effort but can't do anything. Then, Jen Yu touches the green destiny to make sure it's okay and Yu Shu Lien is like, "Don't you dare touch it." The little brat challenges her to take it from her but they both know it's useless. That conflict heightens the duel to such a different level and I honestly think you don't have to see the rest of the film to understand and feel the struggle.

So I'd have to agree with the people who like story to proceed and mix with the choreography because it really does heighten the stakes. But yes, most times the story in people's entries are simple pieces of exposition (like in a fighting game) which doesn't work and hurts the duel.

But I recommend everyone watch the duel between Yu Shu Lien and Jen Yu. Think about it as if someone submitted just those five minutes and there were lightsabers. One combatant has an unbeatable lightsaber and the other is trying to get through her defenses. It works so well. I don't know, maybe it'll help all you out with your own duels and the stories you might want to implement.

EDIT: Oh and don't forget to give your duels a beginning, middle and end.

 

I had high hopes for the Obi-Wan Anakin duel in ROTS, like I was expecting the anxiety of their second encounter, but for me it just wasn't there. I blame Hayden...

 

I enjoyed the Episode III battle but there was a bit too much stick bashing.

 

I think it was doomed to not meet the hype by the fact that everyone was expecting it. Had you not known Anakin was going to be Darth Vader and have an epic battle with Obi-wan, you probably would have been much more invested in the fight.

Not to say there wasn?t room for improvement, emotionally wise.

I was perfectly happy with the Choreography. I just think it was too fast for how close a lot of the shots were.

 

That's another thing, for most of those fast-paced moments the camera was right up in their face. It kind of ruined the epic scale setup by the other films. Maybe I expected too much from it. for what its worth the choreography was impressive at times.

 

... someday, I will actually film the dang fight. I wrote a script for LCCIV, and have been sitting on it ever since. I've watched every LCC since then roll past, each time thinking, "this time I'll film it!" I revise the script a little more each year, and now I think it's one of the smoothest, most polished things I've ever written. I have the props, the costumes, and plenty of willing potential partners.

Someday. Someday I will actually film it.

It's an example of the story-and-fighting blend, heavily inspired by Eclipse. The story and dialogue drive the fight, with a number of big reveals. It's very much a fight, though--there are all of three lines before the sabers are drawn, and one after the fight ends. The fight also dictates the fighting styles of the two combatants, which are drastically different, again a la Eclipse.

~Duk