The Mace Windu Debate

There has been much discussion lately about whether or not Mace Windu did in fact die in ROTS. At first I supported the idea that he survived, but now, I have changed my mind. OK, here's the deal. Though I have wished that canon would prove that he didn't die, I cannot come to that conclusion based on what has been given in the official continuity. Lucas' and other actors' statements cannot be taken into account if we only base Windu's survival on official continuity. The producers' remarks have no bearing on the sory, in less they actually write these ideas specifically into their stories. Based on the levels of canon, I have concluded that Mace Windu did in fact die in ROTS. Here is why:

FACTS SUPPOTING HIS SURVIVAL:

-ROTS did not specifically mention, nor show Windu's death, it only implied this. The Jedi as well, do not discuss the fact that he died. They seem to forget it.

-In the CW animated series, he was able to jump and fall extremely high distances.

-In AOTC he was able to do the same (ending CW battle)

-In AOTC, the Jedi (Anakin and Obi-Wan) were shown to be able to slow themselves when falling, and grab on to nearby objects. They both had a method in which they slowed themselves, by fully extending their bodies, to slow the fall

-Mace was considered one of the greatest jedi next to Yoda, not just some regular jedi, but more powerful than most.

-Mace had learned to master the force and fighting so well that he created his own fighting style, Vapaad. This fighting style was a balance between the dark and light sides. He was one of the few who could master it without falling to the dark side. This is what allowed him to go up against and nearly defeat Sidious by himself. Without Anakin, he possibly could have defeated Sidious. Whether sidious was simply faking his defeat when Anakin walked into the room is still unknown, however.

-He could have possibly went into hiding, reallizing the threat the empire posed to the jedi, and knew what would happened if he returned. He could have went into hiding and become one of the Jedi who hid and were on the run from the empire in the lost years between ROTS and ANH. Windu could have been killed during that 19 year time period, only the future EU works will reveal this!

FACTS AGAINST HIS SURVIVAL:

-The ROTS novelization states clearly that Mace did in fact die.

-He does not appear in any later episodes, or in the rest of ROTS for that matter.

-He has yet to appear in any official in-continuity Expanded Universe works.

-The Jedi as well, do not discuss the fact that he died. They seem to forget it.

-Mace, in just a few seconds had his fighting arm cut off, was shocked with force lightning, went through extreme pain due to the force lightning, was likely very shocked mentally that he had been shocked physically by force lightning and had had his hand cut off, and finally, he was thrown far out a window into the coriscant traffic.

-Being thrown into traffic, Mace ran the risk of being hit by a vehicle, or quickly crashing into a close object before being able to save himself through the force and using the special powers he had been shown to have.

MY EXPLANATION:
Despite his great abilities shown in the official canon, Windu was overtaken by the combination of the sith lord, Darth Sidious, and the soon to be sith lord, Anakin Skywalker. Windu could have likely survived without Anakin's intervention. Through extreme shock and pain he was thown out a window. At this point, the debate beins. Yes, based on official sources he died. All except one. Now, the movie never explicitly says that he dies. It only implies it. So, it never says he does or doesn't survive. It leaves it ope. However, according to the levels of continuity, the movies take precedence over the books. Well, since the movie never says "yes, he died" or "no, he didn't die," the book does. The book answers that question. It says he dies. Since the movie never says. The book does, it says he dies. Since it says that, he did. storywise, continuity wise, he did. And sin

 

On Mace's databank entry on the official site starwars.com it says he died also.

 

Wow you even threw in the racial thing. This is an eppy III post that's gonna get locked.

 

I wonder who picked up the body?

 

Did you get this from OT.com?

 

I'm the guy who put it there. I had originally posted it to the IMDB. I have put it several places on the net. And... with the racial thing, yeah the admins block every chance they get.

You know, I wrote this because, for me, an answer from Uncle George isn't good enough. I had to find answers strictly in the continuity. So, what most people just assume, I proved in a way above.

 

ah, right sorry. I just dont like people stealing other peoples work.

 

Yeah, you're "Ell the Ewok" over there. As 3PO says, "nice to see a familiar face."

 

I was right with you and enjoying the read until you had to play the race card. What does that have to do with anything?

Lest we forget, Sam Jackson wanted -and specifically asked for- a great death.

 

Too bad he didn't get one.

 

Satisfied me just fine. And it satisfied Jackson. Since he was the one who asked for it, he gets the only vote.

 

I am baseing my opinions only on what Lucasfilm has given in their official continuity, not on what outside sources say. You have to let the story tell itself and just assume things.

 

I really think we should let Mace Windu stay dead. Let him get just that much respect. Unlike Palpatine.

Edit: Nothing more to say.

 

I am the one suuporting Windu's death, by the way. As far as Palpatine goes, he doesn't deserve the respect.

 

Yes Mace is dead unless GL decides to bring him back but I don't think GL will and besides would you rather see Mace in the Live Action TV Series or another minor Jedi from the PT or a completely new Jedi?

 

I would rather see Mace Windu in the TV series than a new Jedi.
Yes, a lot of times it's the black guy who dies, so well, it could have been worse, he could have died in the first movie.
I think Alien Vs. Predator is the only movie made by Hollywood in which it starts with a bunch of people, and the last person standing is black. The movie's bad, but still, there's something to be said for that part of it.
I say, that from the official view, Mace is dead, but if people want to believe that Mace is alive, that's fine with me. I like people to use their imaginations and think how they want to think -- and pay no mind to those mini tyrants who get all over you for not thinking "right." Star Wars is JUST a movie, it's entertainment, and if thinking Mace is alive gives you more entertainment, then feel free. you're going to encounter a bunch of people who say, "you're wrong, you can't think that way" and they will argue and argue, because they're sheep, and they want everyone to be sheep as well. They perpetuate the status quo of the masses, that is, that we all must see things the same way, we all must be non-thinking receptacles filled with junk.

 

I would rather see another Jedi besides Mace because I never really liked his personality.

 

Reservoir Dogs; Pulp Fiction; Jackie Brown; The Matrix Re-Exploded or whatever the last pne was.

But anyways, I'm sure there are better places to attempt to prove how racist Hollywood is than a baord for the Star Wars TV show.

 

Exactly. Those are the ones who never actually think, only assume.

 

Every Star Wars character that you don;t see specificaly die they make a rumor that there still alive it pisses me of.

 

There wasn't a black guy in Reservoir Dogs


Was there

 

Yup. He was the cop that was the boss/mentor guy to Mr. Orange. And of all the characters in the movie, at the end he was the only one not dead.

 

I don't know where you people see a racial problem.

Mace was the leader of the Jedi! Yoda was the oldest one, but Mace was the leader of them all. The boss. Even Yoda looked at Mace, when there were decisions to be made (TPM!!!).

Mace died in ROTS. The lightening killed him, it was not the fall. The lightening was intense, much stronger than the one which hit Luke. It was similar to the one that finally caused Vader's death in ROTJ.

 

I'm sure Lucas never intentionally followed the black-guy-always-dies cliche, but the point is, he did.

 

Lando was alive and well at the end of ROTJ...

And Windu even defeated the ultimate bad guy, before he was betrayed by one of his brothers!

Windu was on of the greatest Jedi-Knights. Sam Jackson said it himself, that years ago a black character in a leading position was unthinkable, and now Lucas made a black man the leader of the Jedi!