The Movie & Television Character Draft 3: Nothin' or Double - congrats, EF

Discussion in 'Archive: Census and Games' started by Zizz, Jun 4, 2008.

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  1. Mikaboshi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 6
    What's the alternative? We can't really just give one person a win and the other a loss, and as you said if we just randomly have them fight other people that isn't really fair either.

    The only other option really is to remove the Forfeits. Do what you feel is best, I trust you.
  2. DarthIntegral Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    Just my $0.02 here, but here's what I'd do:

    Rewrite history. Give Data and Imhotep wins over forfeits, and make this a trump vs. trump match.
  3. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    ^^That's me.

    That seems like it would work Inty, but I think it would put D1 at a disadvantage in a sense. He went into this match 3-3, and if we rewrote history as you're suggesting, I'm pretty sure he'd be walking into this match 2-4.

    Hang on, lemme see...

    1. Vegeta (Jason Lee Scott > Li Chang/Lightning/Jones)
    2. Despised (Drake > Robocop)
    3. Not yet called
    4. Not yet called (to be trump vs trump)
    5. Vegeta (Data > Cody forfeit)
    6. Vegeta (Nick > Durza)
    7. Vegeta (Vida > Beast)
    8. Not yet called
    9. Despised (Imhotep > Frozone forfeit)
    10. Not yet called


    I'll sit on this one for a while I guess. Sorry about this fellas.
  4. Mikaboshi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 6
    Hmm, what a mess. Damn trumps. :p

    I am not opposed to redoing my numbers I guess, it is up to Vegeta I suppose.

    I still have Voldemort yet to be called, and if Cody would have landed on a forfeit and won this probably would have ended up in teams (if Voldemort wins). Though, if McGonagal had won this round because she landed on a forfeit it wouldn't have mattered if Voldemort won because I would have lost 6-4.

    I don't really know what to do, but what ever is decided is cool with me.

    EDIT: PS, when #5 was called it was Data (prep) v. Cody and Ba'al (prep) rather than against Cody (forfeit). I won that match IIRC.
  5. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    That list would be what the round would look like if we used Inty's revisionist plan. Have both Imhotep (who beat a trump) and Data (who lost to a trump) go up against the forfeits, and have the trumps face each other. So that would mean that the way we had the numbers:

    Imhotep vs Frozone/McGonagall
    Cody/Ba'al vs Data
    Forfeit vs Forfeit

    Would turn into this:

    Imhotep vs Forfeit
    Forfeit vs Data
    Trump vs Trump

    The way things were, you won both non-forfeit matches and end at least 2-1 in these three matches. In the new plan (still to be decided upon), you end up either 2-1 or 1-2, depending on who wins in that trump vs trump match.

    I don't really want to use that plan. It's the easiest, but it's not exactly fair.


    Here's what I think we'll do. I would have both of you resubmit your numbers - unfortunately Vegeta just left for Japan, and she said she probably won't have internet access for the foreseeable future. Obviously it would be unfair to have D1 redo his numbers and not Vegeta, especially since Vegeta's original numbers are now almost all completely out in the open. So instead, I'm going to take the numbers you both originally sent me, and simply randomize the order for both lists. Hopefully we'll be able to keep the original number order for this round, and get through it as quickly as possible. I apologize again for this guys - slip-up on my part. I know they don't happen very often, but when they do, I like to make certain that they're colossal. :p
  6. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

    Manager
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    Jul 20, 2002
    star 9
  7. Mikaboshi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 6
    That sounds fair to me Zizz, randomizing our original entries seems like it would work out good.
  8. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    Alright, on the third try I actually managed to get two sets of numbers that didn't involve a forfeit vs forfeit, while keeping the same number order. This really blows, but hopefully it won't take too long.

    No fancy colours. Start with 5.


    Vegeta vs Despised

    Frozone (The Incredibles) TRUMPED w/ Minerva McGonagall (Harry Potter) vs Drake (Blade)


    Decent match, but I say trump. Drake is the fastest, strongest, and most durable character in this match, but he's against a duo with powerful (and complimentary) abilities. Frozone's ice will definitely neutralize Drake enough to avoid Prof M getting owned right off the bat. From there, Minerva can (literally) work her magic and together they'll eventually beat Mr Drac.
  9. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

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  10. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    Thanks for sticking around Nat.


    Vegeta (1) vs Despised (0)

    Robocop (Robocop) *Prepared* vs Davey Jones (Pirates of the Caribbean) TRUMPED w/ Ni-Chang (The Forbidden Kingdom) TRUMPED w/ Lightning (Big Trouble in Little China)
  11. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

    Manager
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    star 9
    Of course [:D]

    I would say that the trump would take it, but Jonnes can't be on land so he's pretty much useless. The other two are martial artists, but I'm not sure they could stand against RoboCop's more modern way of fighting (aka with guns). Plus, he's metal, so I'm not sure they could really hurt him.

    So I'm leaning toward RoboCop at the moment.
  12. Mikaboshi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 6
    In regards to the first match, Frozone is useless in that one. His attack ability is nowhere near fast enough to even come close to hitting Drake, who was shown in the film to be able to dodge bullets at point blank range. Plus there is that limitation of his, if he gets a bit dehydrated he becomes nothing more than a dude in a blue costume.

    McGonagal is the only one dangerous in this fight, and it is arguable how effective her spells would even be. She isn't prepared, and Drake has durability on the same level as the Beast (the only real difference is that Drake is about 100 times faster than Beast)....and the Beast won the match against this same trump.

    McGonagal not being prepared means she probably isn't going to start off with her most powerful spells right off the bat (especially if Drake is in human form), and as soon as she hits Drake he is going to hurt her bad. Frozone doesn't have anything close to the speed or reflexes needed to hit him and is a complete non-factor in this fight.

    I don't see how Drake loses that.

    As for the second match, no way does Robocop win that. He has 3 people to fight, and even though Davey is on land he is not useless. IIRC that weakness becomes moot in the draft, he can fight on land for draft purposes just as well as if he was on his ship...the only difference would be that he can't phase through stuff like he does on his ship.

    Robocop has to contend with Davey, who would be able to take a lot of physical punishment. Bullets won't really stop Davey would they? Sure I think they would hurt, but it is going to take a lot to stop him. He also has Ni-Chang who is IMHO nothing but fodder, but skilled fodder none the less. Lightning is going to be really hard for Robo to stop, seeing as Lightning was shown in the film to be 100% unphased by bullets. Robo has 2 opponents here who aren't really going to be hurt by his brand of weaponry, plus another fast and decently skilled distraction. Could he wipe out 1-2 of them? With prep sure, but in the end I am thinking Lighting is going to fry Robo's circuits and put him out of the fight, especially since bullets won't stop him before he gets the chance.

    (Lightning shows up at 4:15, and as shown guns won't be a problem for him)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGLinT-Pdyo
  13. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

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    star 9
    If Jones is able to walk on land for the purposes of the match, then RoboCop loses. Against just lightening, maybe.
  14. Shadow_of_Durron Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 2, 2003
    star 6
    For the record, my vote would've gone to Drake. While I don't think Frozone would be anywhere near as useless as implied, like when they fought Imhotep (when did this trump fight the Beast), I'm just not sure I see Frozone as doing anything more than slowing Drake down. I just don't see the ice beating him. And nor will any of the standard stunning spells that McGonagall is likely to try off the bat. Drake may or not get hit by something like that at the start of the match. Maybe he dodges, but more likely, with attacks coming at him from two fronts, he probably gets frozen in place and then takes a stunning spell to the face. And then... yeah. The only thing, and I do mean the only thing that's going to do is piss him off. Big time. And then he'll bust out of the ice with total ease, and then the trump is going to be scrambling for their lives. That is, they damn well better. And with Frozone's underestimated speed and McGonagall's teleportation (that she almost assuredly has), they can, but... Drake can catch them. It might take a while, and maybe McGonagall tries (and likely fails) with some different spells here and there, but I think she's gonna get caught and then get a fist through her torso. Or maybe it'll be Frozone first, but either way, once Drake has a grasp on what these two can do, it's his match to lose. And he doesn't have to worry about figuring out a strategy with a person he's never met while an extremely powerful and fast vampire is trying to tear him to shreds, because, hey, he is that vampire. :p

    But seriously, I don't see what it is, exactly, that the trump is going to do that'll put Drake down for a ten count before he takes one of them out. And if one of them goes down, then the other won't be far behind. With prep and knowledge of who they're facing before the match, sure. I give it to the trump without thinking twice. But they don't have that.

    But... okay. I guess the trump wins. *shrug* But the trump definitely wins the current match. I see Ni-Chang getting beaten, and, depending on how it plays out, Jones might fall as well. But Lightning is the key player for the trump. Immune to most of what Robo is likely to bring, and his main form of attack happens to be one of Robo's biggest weaknesses.
  15. JediVegeta Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 20, 2000
    star 4
    I just got the message. So you just randomized everything?
  16. Mikaboshi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 6
    My bad, Beast didn't face Frozone and McGonagal...he faced Vida. I don't know what I was thinking, maybe a earlier match against some other trump? :oops:

    Vegeta, we did randomize the matches. Seemed to be the easiest and fairest way to go about it. Hope you are enjoying Japan, back in '93 I spent an entire year in country and loved it. It was the single best travel experience I have had to date.

    So, anyone want to reconsider that first match? [face_whistling]
  17. Shadow_of_Durron Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 2, 2003
    star 6
    By the way, as we're catching back up with these two teams, some discussion on Sirius vs. Selene couldn't hurt.

    For the record, I'm leaning heavily towards Selene. And a lot of my reasons why have a lot to do with why I think Drake should've won his match. Only Sirius is alone and let's just say that I think a fight between Drake and Selene would be extremely tough to call. I see her pretty much laughing a stunning spell off and it shouldn't take more than one solid punch from her to end the match. So if you think I'm way off base with that...
  18. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    The Drake match was close but still clear cut in my mind. I'm not sure why you would think that they wouldn't have much of a shot at taking him down. Frozone is a huge nuisance in this match. Drake may be able to break out of the ice easily, but it'll still be coming at him in full force. And this match doesn't take place in a fire, so Fro most likely won't be going dehydro very quickly. McGonagall hasn't shown much, but she's still got a vast array of magic at her disposal. A stunning spell would be useless, but she's got other tricks well known in the Potterverse.

    I lean towards Selene as well at the moment. Were Sirius trumped with Bobby though... lol
  19. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

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    star 9
    What Zizz said about the first match.

    However, one is over and the other hasn't happened yet, and I'm not going to come back and find Selene v. Sirius arguments on this page when it's time, so arguing that now is useless. Current match: Zizz, what's the ruling on Davey's abilities on land?
  20. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    It'd be lame to rule that he can't be on land and still have him in the draft. And I'm the anti-lame. So he's fine on land.
  21. NYCitygurl NSWFF Manager

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    If he's fine on land, then even with Robo prepped, I'm going with the trump. Two of them aren't going to be too hurt by bullets.
  22. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    Robo's got quite the arsenal besides bullets though, especially with the prep. Rockets, grenade launchers, miniguns, jetpack, etc.

    I think I might actually take Robocop in this one with the prep. If he thinks it over clearly during the 24 hours, he'll understand that Jones and Chang pose literally no threat to him whatsoever. Unprepped, those two bring nothing to the match that can touch him. So that leaves Lightning - and that's the target Robocop should go for first. And while Lightning is really durable, I don't think he'll be able to withstand the onslaught of weaponry that Robocop will fire. And he's definitely not quick enough to dodge it.

    No, I think if Lightning does survive, it'll only be barely. The other two will be easy enough to take out. Bullets might not do much against Jones, but a grenade will blow him to bits. Chang is dog meat. Yeah, with the prep I've got to think Robocop has this one in hand. Good match and he'll have to execute well, but I have faith that he'll come through.
  23. EmpireForever Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2004
    star 8
    Sadly, it's a bad week for me to argue. The only thing I can think is that Sirius lost against Michael already, so whatever. However, I'm not sure if Selene has the same kind of speed as Michael. That's about the only difference I can think of here.
  24. Mikaboshi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 12, 2005
    star 6
    Can you please explain how? What is Robocop going to do to Lighting? His weaponry isn't going to do squat to Lightning. Again, there is nothing to indicate from the film that modern weapons would do anything to him, and strong evidence that they will do nothing. All Lightning has to do is hit him once with a shot of electricity and that cyborgs circuits are fried.

    Serious, can a judge please give some solid reasoning to the vote being made? "Robocop is prepared" just doesn't seem to be overly convincing.

    Even with the prep time he is facing 3 people, one of which is highly skilled fodder that will take time to kill (Ni-Chang), another of which can be killed with a lot of punishment but definately won't go down simply by being shot (Davey) and even though he doesn't have anything but a sword...Robo has been shown to feel pain and if stabbed in the face he would be hurting, and one who not only is immune to Robo's main form of attack (guns) but also has a highly effective attack of his own that works especially well against robotic types (electricity).

    On to that first one. Drake would never lose that match. Go back and watch Frozone again if you have "The Incredibles", sure he isn't useless against most opponents, but against the speed and power of Drake he won't be anything at all. Same goes for McGonagal, her reflexes and speed are of the standard human variety. If she doesn't kill him right off the bat, which is doubtful since the trump isn't prepared, Drake is going to rip her apart. Top that off with the fact that this trump isn't familiar with each others abilities, and will have to figure out how to best work with each other at the same time that Drake is doing this.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=df5D5TgMHao
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxb8PGa0u3M&feature=related
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFEVEfDkqyg / This one has the bullet dodging feat right at the start, notice how slow the bullet seems to go as he moves out of it's way with plenty of time? You seriously think Frozone is much of a factor at all here?

    Now, I could understand if the trump was prepared. Then the trump could put together a plan, know the powers of each other and their opponent, and also McGonagal would know to bring out the biggest spells in the first seconds of the fight (curses, which she is loath to cast anyway...and even then it is arguable that they would be really effective against Drake).

    What does Drake have to do to win? Just one punch for each. They don't have any special durability...like drake does. They don't have the ability to quickly regenerate from wounds...like Drake does. They don't have the speed to avoid someone who moves at the speed of Drake...like Drake does.

    Please explain how they win here, please?
  25. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    Explanation for the first match is above. I'm happy to hear your counter to it though.


    You make good arguments for Drake, but the (rather obvious) factor that you seem to be ignoring is the fact that he's taking both trump members on at the same time. He's not going to be able to walk up to McGonagall and punch a whole in a her head without getting a faceful of ice with a second from Frozone, and he's not going to grab a hold of Frozone without Prof M stepping in with a nifty charm. What about a simple Confundus charm to mess with Drake's mind? He's powerful and it wouldn't leave as serious of an effect on him as on a regular human, but he's certainly not completely immune. Jelly legs perhaps? There is a spell that causes a blindfold to appear on an opponent. Petrificus Totalus? She's got more in her bag of tricks than a frickin' stunning spell.

    I've seen all of those clips plenty of times. Drake is very fast and agile. Against either of the trump members by themselves, there's no way in hell he loses. But together, they're going to be able to protect one another's backs throughout the match. Drake has excellent reflexes, but he's not invisible to the naked eye like Sing. Both members of the trump have ways to irritate and slow him down, enough to the point that they'll be able to devise a killing (or at least KOing) blow - most likely to come from McGonagall.


    Edit: You know what, let me sleep on this one. I may be coming around to your view, as odd as that may sound coming directly after this post. Drake does have more speed than I remember, and I'm not just talking about reflexes.
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