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Discussion The nuances / ingredients that make a Star Wars film

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Sequel Trilogy (Released Films)' started by phatdude1138, Nov 3, 2012.

  1. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Sep 2, 2012
    The Wilhelm Scream!
    Original Oatmeal and DarthBreezy like this.

    FRAGWAGON Jedi Master star 4

    Nov 3, 2012
    If the dialogue is not a little corny, a bit clunky, it's not Star Wars. Arndt should be able to write this stuff, but he ought not be able to say it.
  3. DarthBreezy

    DarthBreezy Force Ghost star 6

    Jun 4, 2002
    Then name it something other than 'Star Wars' - Maybe, "Battlestar Galactica" or "Star Blazers" or what not - If they intend to do a full fledged 'reboot' (Hey, we can even make Han Solo a GIRL!) I want a LOT of advanced warning so I can completely avoid it...
    Original Oatmeal and Air Jedi like this.
  4. Darth Chiznuk

    Darth Chiznuk Superninja of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Oct 31, 2012
    Owen is a pretty common name as far as I know. I can name a few off the top of my head like the actor Owen Wilson, the Houston Texans tight end Owen Daniels, the wrestler Owen Hart. Dexter is probably less common but is definitely Earth-based. The two that I can think of right now is the former linebacker Dexter Coakley and the title character on the show Dexter. :)
    Original Oatmeal likes this.

    FRAGWAGON Jedi Master star 4

    Nov 3, 2012
    Spielberg was right. Star Wars' naivete, innocence is what attracts people to it. It's really a reflection of George Lucas.

    The minute Star Wars becomes 'cool' it will lose all it's luster.
  6. Lazy Storm Trooper

    Lazy Storm Trooper Jedi Master star 4

    Sep 18, 2012
    No more Sith please...
    Vespasian likes this.
  7. Jedi Comedian

    Jedi Comedian Jedi Knight star 2

    Oct 27, 2012
    The word "Sith" was never mentioned, but the Sith concept - two powerful dark siders, a master and an apprentice, clandestinely running the galaxy, scheming against each other and trying to corrupt promising young Force users - is at the core of the trilogy. Forget the Imperial military, it's the Sith who are the real threat.

    I agree when it comes to the EU - there's no need to upstage the films when there are so many other potential villains.

    However, when it comes to the ST, we need a threat that logically builds on the storyline of Episodes I-VI. If it's not the Sith, then the only other way you could go would be an external enemy the Sith/Empire were keeping at bay (as was hinted with the Yuuzhan Vong in the EU).
  8. gregvader123

    gregvader123 Jedi Padawan star 2

    Nov 16, 2012
    Really big government, as long as it's in the background, like in the OT.
  9. Anakin's Daddy

    Anakin's Daddy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Aug 13, 2002
    You're dreaming. There will be sith, guaranteed. If you don't want them I'm preparing you for the disappointment.
  10. Binary_Sunset

    Binary_Sunset Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Oct 28, 2000
    Hello, Jabba. It's been a long time.

    In terms of a Star Wars movie (but not EP 7 specifically), I think you could get rid of most of that. I've long regreted that 1978's Splinter of the Mind's Eye and/or Brian Daley's Han Solo novels from the late 1970s were never used as the basis for Star Wars films. I'd certainly regard such movies as SW films, and they have only the following in common:

    Droids in general
    FTL interplanetary space travel
    Really big government
    Mixing of human and mostly humanoid intelligent species

    For that matter, ESB (outside of Chewbacca and the ugnauts) is almost entirely human.

    Further, I can imagine the ST having a weak and ineffective Senate. ("Hey, remember the bad old days when we had a strong galactic government? Remember what it did to Alderaan? Let's not go there again.")

    Thus I'm left with droids, FLT travel, and John Williams's title theme as the only essentials on your list. I'd go so far as to say that John Williams would be the single most important ingredient, since I regard his music as the single most important element of the magic of Star Wars.
  11. Lars_Muul

    Lars_Muul Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Oct 2, 2000
    I'm wide awake. The return of the Sith would make Anakin's sacrifice pointless.

    - The oppression of the Sith will never return!
    - Only now, at the end, do you understand.

    Darth Chiznuk likes this.
  12. the_sinister_hologram

    the_sinister_hologram Jedi Knight star 3

    Nov 3, 2012
    1. good story
    2. likeable characters
    3. deep emotions
    4. space battles
    5. epic adventures
    6. lightsabers and blasters
  13. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Jan 3, 2013
    While I can see where you're coming from, that didn't stop the EU, and I suspect it won't stop the ST people much.

    And I would characterize "lightsaber duels" as one of the fundamental elements under discussion (or a lightsaber duel, at least - ROTS probably overdid it with five), so if not the Sith, then with who?

    DARTHLARS Jedi Master star 4

    Mar 12, 2002
  15. Lars_Muul

    Lars_Muul Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Oct 2, 2000
    Jedi who struggle with their dark side?
    Old, forgotten, former Jedi who have abandoned the ways of the Force but will use their lightsabers when they deem it necessary?
    Extremely tough warriors with no ability to use the Force but still able to hold their own against Jedi (bounty hunters, pirates, cyborgs)?
    We'll see.

    I'm not saying that the Sith will definitely not happen, though. Anakin did bring balance to the Force by significantly diminishing the power of the dark side, but that doesn't rule out the possibility that the Sith will try to retake control of the galaxy.
    I sincerely hope, though, that it won't just be a case of history repeating itself. There should be a real point to the existence of this trilogy. It should expand the saga by adding something significant of its own.

    - He is like my brother. I cannot do it!
    - You cannot escape your destiny.
    Darth Chiznuk likes this.
  16. Jabbadabbado

    Jabbadabbado Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Mar 19, 1999
    yes it has!

    Agreed about Splinter of the Mind's Eye. The first EU novel I ever read and the only one I ever really respected. A little bit off the reservation in terms of Force mythology. But I'd far rather have that in the canon than midichlorians.
  17. Anakin's Daddy

    Anakin's Daddy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Aug 13, 2002
    Agreed. And Anakin's sacrifice was not pointless. He did destroy the Sith, bringing balance to the force. ...Until they rise again. Nothing lasts forever.
  18. frodopwo

    frodopwo Jedi Youngling

    Mar 25, 2011
    10. Style HEAVILY borrowed from historical films like westerns, noire, Kurosawa.
    9. Storyline and characters taken from Jungian Archetypes and epic lore
    8. Some side plots are key to help build each individual character.
    7. Dialogue that rarely wonders. Lines revolve around the task at hand.
    6. Only one major clear and real threat that drives the plot with a MINOR Jedi plot line.
    5. Escape from this, rescue him/her, blow that thing up. Its usually that simple.
    4. Only 3 planets: one for each act.
    3. Made for the love of story telling and not special effects.
    2. Wit, Humor, Drama equally balanced.
    1. Totally disregard the prequels when calculating the building blocks for a Star
  19. fenton

    fenton Jedi Master star 4

    Nov 29, 2001
    I think one of the most important things they need to remember is KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid.

    The original trilogy (espically ESB) was very well written but also simple. Evil Empire (with Dark Side users) vs Good Rebels (with Light Side users). A main character becoming the "super powered hero". It was clear who was the villian, who was the good guy and the two sides came into conflict. The PT lost this simplicity and suffered for it. The Jedi weren't the good guys anymore (at least not int he same way - they didn't want Anakin trained which put them at odds with the main character and audience etc....), the main bad guy was running the government the good guys supported, villians were killed off constantly forcing others to be introduced etc... The main hero was turning evil but for good reasons.... It didn't have the straight forward plot and themes that the OT did, which made it harder to follow and the characters harder to connect too.

    The ST doesn't need and shouldn't have multi. layers of story happening all at the same time, its too much (not just for Star Wars, for most movies. Its why Dark Knight Rises suffered, way too many things going on). They need firmly established good guys and bad guys, a conflict between them, some individual conflicts for the main characters, and thats it.
  20. Pfluegermeister

    Pfluegermeister Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Jun 30, 2003
    One thing's for sure: each of the previous trilogies ultimately came down to a climactic moment in which the main character was confronted with having to make a moral choice: to kill or not kill someone who was unarmed and already beaten. The decision each character made determined their fates from then onward: Anakin killed his helpless opponent and began to charge headlong down the path of ruination; Luke refused to kill his helpless opponent and salvaged his soul - furthermore, he inspired Anakin to intervene to prevent someone else from killing a helpless victim.

    I can't possibly state that they'd do another variation on this theme for the third trilogy, but I think I could make a case that it's definitely a fundamental building block of, if not a Star Wars movie per se, then that of the arc of a Star Wars trilogy overall: a character, at first young, innocent, and untested, must enter the world and discover that life can be monstrous; he must take wounds, suffer losses, acquire scars - the necessary lessons of life for an individual; the test at the climactic moment is how this character chooses to answer life back - he has an opponent prostrate before him, someone that he has a legitimate reason to hate, and the scars to justify it - and no one would question him if he chose to kill this opponent. The entire galaxy's convinced this opponent is a mortal threat. There's even a man right there, the highest authority in the land, telling you to do it. When everyone around you tells you that to commit murder against an unarmed and helpless victim is correct, when even the scars on your body insist it to you loudly, who do you trust to help you decide if that's so?

    You trust your instincts, not authority. Anakin refused to listen to his instincts and instead listened to authority, and Dooku died; his scars he considered but a thing to be avenged. Luke chose to refuse authority and listen to his instincts instead; his scars he considered a lesson, a warning of what the consequences would be if he chose wrongly; Vader lived, and became inspired to himself look to his instincts over authority, and to directly intervene against authority to spare another's life; Sidious died, but Luke lived.

    This probably could be considered a building block theme; but don't ask me to guess who the characters involved would be, or what consequences would be at stake.
    Sean Sinclair and Valairy Scot like this.
  21. fenton

    fenton Jedi Master star 4

    Nov 29, 2001
    Pfluegermeister - thats a good point and tie between the two trilogies.

    The moment came at different points in both. It was Lukes final decision while it came earlier in Anakin's.

    It would be interesting to put that moment right up front, and then have the character deal with the consequences for the better part of 3 movies.
  22. phatdude1138

    phatdude1138 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Feb 2, 2005
  23. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian New Films Thread Reaper and Rumor Naysayer star 6 Staff Member Manager

    May 25, 2000
  24. Sith_Knight087

    Sith_Knight087 Jedi Padawan star 1

    Sep 5, 2012
  25. Sith_Knight087

    Sith_Knight087 Jedi Padawan star 1

    Sep 5, 2012
    Ah, the iconic and legendary Wilhelm Scream.... It's a MUST!!