Arena The Official ATP Discussion Thread - now discussing the U.S. Open

Discussion in 'Community' started by Anakin_Heartbreaker, Dec 28, 2007.

  1. tom Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2004
    star 6
    i was really hoping for nadal/djokokovic but a federer/nadal final is always fun.
  2. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Federer taking it to Nadal so far. Not really pleased with the new tennis ball that they're using this year-- it really undermines some of what makes Nadal great. Then again, the slower Wimbledon courts of today may have had the same effect for Nadal, equalizing things to some extent.

    Speaking of Wimbledon, the referee today is the same as the 2008 Wimbledon epic, Pascal Maria.

    Edit: And just around the time I posted that, Nadal seems to have flipped a switch. He's started pushing Federer around the court, and scored a tremendous point just now. He's about to serve for the first set. If Federer can't hold here, I look for Nadal to wipe him out in the second and third sets.

    Edit 2: Nadal is destroying Federer right now.
  3. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    The problem with the new balls is that it lessens what makes clay tennis. Big hitters can now strive on clay and just ball bash rather than having to use tactical court strategy which used to be the staple of clay tennis.


    Roger trying to make a push here in the 2nd.
  4. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Nadal overcame a poorly timed rained delay to take the second set. The title seems inevitable now.
  5. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Rafael Nadal wins his sixth French Open title. It wasn't the demolition of 2008, and he looked more vulnerable than ever before against Federer on clay, but in the end, the result was the same.
  6. tom Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2004
    star 6
    so satisfying when nadal beats federer, and every time it makes the "greatest ever" debate that much more interesting.
  7. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Mary Carrillo put it best: How can someone be the greatest of all time when they can't be the greatest of their own time? Federer may look back on this one the way McEnroe does to the 1984 French Open (where both his and Djokovic's streaks came to a halt, by the way). He could have all but sealed the deal on being the GOAT. Instead, Rafael Nadal now owns ten Grand Slam titles, and seems capable of winning several more. I know Djokovic has played out of his mind, but things are shifting to grass now, and Nadal is more than capable (obviously) of winning another WImbledon title. If he does, that would be his third, matching grass court greats like McEnroe and Becker, among others.

    Part of what makes me a big Nadal fan is that he is clearly a masterful strategist, able to change things up on a dime during a match. He analyzes things and will alter his play if necessary. He dialed up his serve in the fourth set, which helped him break Federer down. I bet a lot of people assume that because he's a highly physical player, he must not be all that smart or intellectual like Federer. Nothing could be further from the truth.

    Remember when Nadal was thought of as just another clay court specialist? People laughed when he said he wanted to win Wimbledon. Ha ha ha, they said. He's now a four time Wimbledon finalist, with two titles, and is probably the second best grass court player since Sampras retired. The best players know how to keep evolving.

    I remember when Nadal was just emerging, back in 2005. Federer was running wild in those days, seemingly unstoppable. Then along came this player whose game seemed tailored specifically to not just handle Federer, but actually overwhelm him. It was unbelievable to see a player accustomed to manhandling opponents all over the world, particularly in Grand Slams, at the mercy of someone else.

    Novak Djokovic is a great player for sure. I'm sure he'll win several more Grand Slams. For my money, though, there is no more compelling story in tenis than Roger Federer vs. Rafael Nadal.

    When it's all said and done, they'll be remembered together:

    [image=http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ZfS1RF1hXso/TBvrUcnGq0I/AAAAAAAAAaI/qzo50tQFGNc/s400/federer-nadal-wimbledon2008.jpg]
  8. tom Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2004
    star 6
    yeah, i think that's it. they are both great, but as unbelievable as federer's career has been nadal i think has already achieved equal status, mostly because of their record head-to-head. he still needs to win a couple more majors that aren't the french but i think that's pretty much a lock at this point. but if he wins a bunch more and pulls even with or ahead of federer then obviously he will stand alone. it's very possible, considering that he's younger now than federer was when he won his 10th.
  9. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    Federer's record may not last long. People thought Sampras's 14 would last for generations and just 7 years after his retirement it fell. It would be crazy, but its possible that Federer'd could last even shorter. There still seems to be the sentiment that Nadal does not have that long left because of his physical style of play. But what if his body does not fail him? What if he continues this until the age of 30?

    However you also can't assume that Nadal will just continue to pile up the majors. Tennis history shows that soon an anti-Nadal will emerge, just like he was the anti-Federer. I think Del Potro could be that guy if he stays healthy. His height and style of play is the perfect recipe to beat Nadal as shown by his 6-2 6-2 6-2 beatdown in New York in 2009.
  10. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    But Del Potro hasn't done much overall. I know he's had injuries, but that's part of the game too.

    I agree, though, that nothing is a given. We can't reasonably assume that Nadal will go on winning Slams from here until some undetermined date. Sometimes things dry up all at once, like they did for Tiger in golf. Most observers took it for granted that he would pass Nicklaus, and now it's highly questionable as to whether he'll ever win a major again. Popular history will record his domestic issues as a primary reason, but sharper people know that his knee started giving out on him, and and then other parts of his game started falling apart as well. He's hit an age where few golfers win majors, and so there you have it.

    What I think will be fun to watch will be Federer and Nadal's twilight runs to a Slam. Someday, they're going to be clearly over the hill (not just past their prime, as Federer now is), and they'll summon the old magic for one last title run. For Nadal, that will almost certainly be a last French Open title, as he uses an incredible amount of experience to make up for a fading physical advantage. For Federer, it will likely be at Wimbledon, but I can see it happening at the US Open or even in Australia. Watch him poke fun at fate by doing it at Roland Garros, with Nadal out of the way for one reason or another. John McEnroe reached the Wimbledon semifinals in 1992, before he got blown off the court by a much younger Andre Agassi. Pete Sampras had that last title run in Flushing back in 2002, when he won in four sets over Agassi. It will be interesting to see.
  11. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    Wimbledon already upon us. Draw is released on Friday.
  12. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    my wimbledon analysisby section (# indicates seed, Q=Qualifier,WC=wild card,LL=Lucky Loser)


    1 Rafael Nadal vs Michael Russell
    Ryan Sweeting vs Pablo Andujar
    Giles Muller vs Tommy Haas
    31 Milos Raonic vs Fabio Fognini

    It will be interesting to see how the young Canadian Raonic does here. He has a bomb of a serve and his game should be very good on grass. But he does face the most interesting tennis player in the world Fabio Fognini in the first round. Could be a battle. Nadal should waltz through here and into the 4th round.
    -
    24 Juan Martin Del Potro vs (Q) Flavio Cipolla
    Olivier Rochus vs (Q) Kenny De Schepper
    Frederico Gil vs (WC) Dudi Sela
    15 Giles Simon vs (Q) Eduardo Roger-Vasselin

    Open section. Del Potro does not play well on grass but he has a bunny draw here, with only Simon being dangerous. Pick: Del Potro
    -

    10 Mardy Fish vs Marcel Granollers
    Phiipp Kohlschreiber vs Denis Istomin
    Robin Haase vs Pere Riba
    21 Fernando Verdasco vs Radek Stepanek

    Fish should take this scetion as his game matches with grass well. Watch out for Dutchman Robin Haase, he has a big game that can bither Fish should they meet. I am discounting Verdasco in this part. Pick: Fish
    -

    25 Juan Ignacio Chela vs (Q) Marinko Matosevic
    Donald Young vs Alex Bogomolov Jr.
    (Q) Ruben Bemelmans vs Julien Benneteau
    6 Thomas Berdych vs Filippo Volandri

    Last year's runner up Berdych begins in an east section. I don't believe in him to make it deep but if he does not get out of this ection I would be shocked. One of my favoirte players Donald Young needs to capitalize on this soft draw and make the 3rd round. Chela is a clown on grass.
    -

    4 Andy Murray vs Daniel Gimeno-Traver
    Tobias Kamke vs Blaz Kavcic
    Sergiy Stakhovsky vs (WC) Daniel Cox
    27 Marin Cilic vs Ivan Ljubicic

    Mr.Murray beginds his attempt to appease of Britain. He won't do it, way to much pressure. In most tournaments the home crowd helps but it actually hurts in Wimbledon, its more pressure than support. He should walk through this easy section though. Murray
    -

    17 Richard Gasquet vs Santiago Giraldo
    Igor Kunitsyn vs (Q) Igor Sijsling
    (Q) Martin Fischer vs (LL) Simone Bolelli
    14 Stanislas Wawrinka vs Potito Starace

    Gasquet and Wawrinka look to be headed to a 3rd round show down. That will be a very good match. Qualifier Martin Fischer actually has a good grass game. could be dangerous. Pick: Gasquet
    -
    9 Gael Monfils vs Matthias Bachinger
    (LL) Grega Zemlja vs (Q) Lukas Lacko
    (W) Arnaud Clement vs (Q) Lukasz Kubot
    23 Janko Tipsarevic vs Ivo Karlovic

    Hard section to pick. Monfils is not a grass court player. Karlovic is always a factor with his massive serve. Tipsy is also a threat here. Pick: Tipsarevic
    -

    30 Thomaz Bellucci vs Rainer Schuettler
    Feliciano Lopez vs Michael Berrer
    Jaroslav Pospisil vs Victor Hanescu
    8 Andy Roddick vs (Q) Andreas Beck

    Andy Roddick makes his return to grand slam tennis after missing the French Open. Lopez is always tough in grass. Not an easy section for Roddick but he will probably still advance through it.
    7 David Ferrer vs Benoit Paire
    Ivan Dodig vs (LL) Ryan Harrison
    Carlos Berlocq vs Karol Beck
    26 Guillermo Garcia-Lopez vs Andrey Golubev

    Another open section. Ferrer is not a grass courter. Young American Ryan Harrison gets a lucky loser spot and has a decent draw. I will go out on a limb and pick the volatile yet powerful man from Kazahkstan Golubev to take this section.
    -

    22 Alexandr Dolgopolov vs Fernando Gonzalez
    (Q) Rik De Voest vs Ruben Ramirez-Hidalgo
    Grigor Dimitrov vs (Q) Cedric-Marcel Stebe
    12 Jo-Wilfried Tsonga vs (LL) Go Soeda

    Tsonga all the way here. He is a darkhourse to win it all this year. Perfect game for grass with powerful serve and forehand and deft volley touch for a big man.
    Gonzalez returns from injury, the former grand slam finalist plays young starlet Dolgopolov in what should be a great match.
    -

    19 Nicolas Almagro vs Jarkko Nieminen
    John Isner vs Nicolas Mahut
    Somdev Devvarman vs Denis Gremelmayr
    18 Mikhail Youzhny vs Juan Monaco

  13. darth_gersh Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2005
    star 6
    John Isner vs Nicolas Mahut
    8-}
  14. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Why the Nadal dislike, Jeff? He's the natural heir to Agassi for me, and Agassi is my favorite athlete ever.
  15. LAJ_FETT Tech Admin and Collecting/Games Mod

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 9
    Yep - they're at it again..

    You would think the organizers would have learned from the last time and started it earlier.. :p

    Edit - 1 hr 49 min so far..
  16. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    I have never really been a big fan of him. I don't mind him winning the French because he is a clay warrior but I would prefer someone else to win Wimbledon(not Federer). Honestly my Tsonga pick is just pure hope because I want some more spice in mens tennis at the moment.

    I greatly respect Nadal and he has adapted his game to be great on every surface
  17. Darth McClain Arena Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Feb 5, 2000
    star 6

    What a let down compared to last year. :p

    Isner should be able to have a much better second round match, though. He's going going to be physically and emotionally drained.
  18. LAJ_FETT Tech Admin and Collecting/Games Mod

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 9
    Listening to the comments about them on the BBC coverage was interesting. Since their match-up last year they have remained friends and keep in touch with each other. There's also a plaque commemorating the match on the court where it took place.

    Edit - not sure how much play they will get in outside of Center Court today. It's been chucking it down with rain off and on here since around 11:30 am and there's a chance of thunderstorms as well.
  19. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    Dissapointed to see Raonic retire at 3-2 in teh 1st set to Muller. I was looking forward to seeing how he did against Nadal
  20. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Nadal is just a lot of fun to watch on the court, at least to me. I see him as being as much of an artist with the racket as Federer, but in a different way.
  21. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    I'm not a Federer fan either.

    Match of the day tomorrow is Isner vs Almagro. I expect Isner to win this in 4 or 5. Will be some good shotmaking though.

    Anderson is no pushover for Djokovic tomorrow. Big servers are always tough on grass.
  22. LAJ_FETT Tech Admin and Collecting/Games Mod

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 9
    Conditions at Wimbledon will probably be about the same today as yesterday. It's sunny right now but the dark clouds have already started to gather. Forecast is for showers starting around noon and lasting through til around 4pm.
  23. LAJ_FETT Tech Admin and Collecting/Games Mod

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 9
    Nadal must be doing something right. He's playing on Court 1, slips a couple of times, goes off for a medical check, and the rain starts. (And the forecast is for heavy rain this evening and tonight so I don't know if play will resume there today. Weatherman said once it starts it will probably continue.)
  24. MarcusP2 Games and Community Reaper

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2004
    star 6
    Tomic beats Soderling in straight sets...Soderling did look a bit off though.

    Time for the media here into Australia to go into meltdown!
  25. rechedelphar Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2004
    star 6
    The Big 4 youngsters are starting to make their move. Raonic got hurt and had to retire. But the others all made moves. Dimitrov pushed Tsonga to the brink in a very entertaining match. Harrison took Ferrer to 5 and the biggest story is Tomic who is still alive in the Round of 16.