Discussion in 'Live Action, Clone Wars & Classics' started by barrissoffeefan, Jul 20, 2011.
Eh, at least it was something.
Where was she stationed when order 66 took place? And did she die? We should see more of her and Luminara next season.
She was on Kashyyyk aiding the Wookiee defense when an AT-TE blew her up from behind.
On Felucia, actually. The events leading up to her death were featured prominently in the webcomic Evasive Action: Reversal of Fortune. Which is sadly no longer available.
My mistake. Luminara was on Kashyyyk, not Barriss.
Ok thanks. So she was stationed there with Aayla Secura?
You know, considering we didn't see Barriss die in RotS I wouldn't put it past TCW to kill her in the course of the series.
I do hope she returns, though.
I'd like to see Barriss play foil for Ahsoka again. Barriss is one of the background Jedi who I think has alot of potential on this show.
I liked how they used her to highlight Ahsoka's flaws.
I liked that as well. I believe she is still very much relevant to Ahsoka's character arc. Would be interesting to see Barriss with he mature to the point of boring Ahsoka.
That was what was so great about Barriss. I miss her A LOT!
Perhaps we will see Barriss this season.
Any excuse to hear Meredith Salenger again.
Master Luminara decided that Anakin and Ahsoka were a bad influence on her padawan.
LOL, I'm joking, but if I were in Luminara's shoes, that would be my opinion. That seemed to be her opinion in Weapons Factory.
If the films have taught me anything, it's that there can never be more than one female main character in a story. Leia and a bunch of men or Padme and a bunch of men. Perhaps they thought that if there was a second female main character people would get confused. /sarcasm
Which leads to a lack of women kicking ass in the films and TV show
Principally I'd like to see just one female officer in the Republic navy (and/or aliens, non-whites, etc.). The monotonous, all white, discriminatory space-British ranks can come later under the Empire. But characters like Luminara, Barriss, and Aayla are also lacking.
1. Anakin - main hero
2. Yularen - reoccurring hero
4. Obi-Wan - main hero
5. Dooku - main villain
6. Palpatine - main "hero"/villain
7. Rex - main hero
8. Fives - reoccurring hero
9. Eeth Koth
11. Mace - reoccurring hero
12. Yoda - reoccurring hero
13. Plo Koon - reoccurring hero
14. Kit Fisto - reoccurring hero
15. Darth Maul - main villain
16. Savage Oppress - reoccurring villain
17. Even Piell
18. Grievous - reoccurring villain
19. Cad Bane - reoccurring villain
20. Bail Organa - reoccurring hero
21. Pre Viszla - reoccurring villain
22. Nute Gunray - reoccurring villain
23. Wat Tambor
24. Lux - reoccurring hero
25. Jar Jar
26. Poggle the Lesser
27. Clovis - reoccurring villain/hero (don't really know how to peg him)
28. Boba - reoccurring villain
1. Talzin - reoccurring villain
3. Ahsoka - main hero
6. Asajj - main hero/villain
7. Padme - reoccurring hero
8. Satine - reoccurring hero
9. Shaak Ti
10. Adi Gallia
11. Aurra Sing - reoccurring villain (several arcs/episodes, but absent for awhile)
I did a strike through the names of characters that only featured prominently in a single arc or so and then were reduced to background characters/killed/MIA. Around the same number of characters dropped and forgotten for having a much smaller pool of female characters to begin with.
A little off topic bit I'd like to see a female officer in the Republic navy or whatever. I said a long time ago on the temp board I'd like her to be a bit like Major Kusanagi from Ghost in the Shell who is one of my favorite ass kicking females in animation. I my opinion she's the strong competent female leader all fictional female characters strive to be. Yeah the Major is pretty under dressed but she just kicks ass. I actually look up to her a little in Stand Alone Complex. The Major is quiet and subtle. She's brilliant, a brutal and effective tactician. She's a cold leader and at the same time cares alot of about those under her command. She's an even colder fighter.
I'd prefer it if that discriminatory hiring policy never came at all. It's ridiculous, IMO, that the Empire would actively alienate such vast, powerful swathes of human society if it depends on it. I consider all the homogeneity in the OT's Imperial ranks to be only a "snapshot" of the Empire and GFFA at large, caused by filming limitations in the 1970s and 80s. Lucas himself even said that female stormtroopers are not few in number beyond the Death Star, and neither Lando Calrissian nor Bail Organa are shown to be treated as inferior because of their darker skin. However, I agree with your point that this homogeneity should absolutely not be seen in the ranks of the Republic military, particularly in light of the diverse, mixed human and non-human populations seen in the PT.
In general, the humans seen in TCW are not the most diverse of groups, even compared to the films. Onderon was better than most settings for the hints of human diversity, but all of the humans had the same body and face designs, albeit recoloured. The Naboo are ridiculously homogeneous in TCW compared to the films. The background Alderaanians seen in TCW are all many shades whiter than Bail and Breha Organa and they're more uniform in appearance than the damn clone troopers. You'd think that a company based in the San Francisco Bay Area would have higher standards, but apparently not.
By now, TCW's animators should have enough of a selection of faces, body parts and attires to create some passable kitbashes.
The relative lack of recurring female characters is unfortunate. TCW is superior to the films in this regard, what with Talzin, Ventress, Ahsoka, Satine, Sugi and Aurra having the roles they have. The imbalance is still felt, though, which is why a few more female OCs and returning established characters (such as the subject of this thread) would not be amiss.
Here are a few thoughts...
What if the line from "Maybe it is Dooku's new apprentice" were not for no reason!? What if the writers put that in as a hint that maybe Dooku's involved!? Where does the Dooku line from the trailer "Everything you thought for will be destroyed!" fit actually?! I doubt it is from the Clovis arc. I think Dooku is talking to Ahsoka about her struggle...
IMO Dooku will appear in the latest arc and it will turn out that Barriss has joined him for the same reasons he left the Republic and the Order. If it can happen once, it can happen again...
Barriss was wondering in an innocent way what would happen to the Jedi after war and she also was quoting Mace that she and the rest of the Jedi are not soldiers, but keepers of the peace. What if it is now not so innocent, but more of an aggresive protest from a former pacifist that does not want the Jedi to be soldiers in this war.
And even Anakin (I Love the guy in this arc, he is been written so great) talked about Krell and Dooku. It is not so hard to see a good Jedi go bad after all we know.
And if Barriss survives (cause TCW love death), I quote myself:
Shifting discussion to this thread.
Yes, Dooku could come out stronger from this, both IU and in terms of his character development. I agree that Dooku genuinely wants to reform the Jedi Order in his own (Sithly) way, and recruiting Jedi to his side would make sense in this regard. His offer to Obi-Wan was probably genuine.
To be honest, I'd have preferred an original character instead of Barriss to have been introduced as Ahsoka's close Jedi friend. Not only would such a character's creation avoid clashing with the Expanded Universe, but it would have allowed a completely different sort of character to be portrayed from day one. Barriss in S2 was very much her mild-mannered healer self, while an original character could have had a more apparent cold streak much like Dooku, which would be distinct from the hot-tempered Anakin and Ahsoka while also being borderline "dark".
Alternatively, who's to say that Ahsoka only needs one Jedi friend? With Brain Invaders, Weapons Factory and the Ahsoka/Barriss dynamic therein largely unmolested, another character (Padawan or Knight even) could have been introduced at some point in S3 or S4 before going dark in S5. Come to think of it, perhaps even the Onderon or Young Jedi arcs of S5 could have been used to introduce this character, or perhaps two of them. I'm thinking the Padawan could have joined Ahsoka as one of the rebels' Jedi allies, with the Knight joining Ahsoka in part of the Young Jedi arc as an additional mentor to the younglings. Then when the finale arc rolled around, it would have already been established that Ahsoka, Barriss and these other Jedi are a closely knit group. Ahsoka would contact Barriss and Barriss would seem to be the traitor for the same reasons as she did in the canonical To Catch A Jedi, but this would be a red herring and one of the other Jedi would turn out to be the culprit.
When Lucas and Filoni sat down with the other writers in 2010 or 2011 to write this current story arc, it was already too late. Ahsoka had few friends in the Jedi Order beyond Barriss. No OC had been introduced and to introduce a conveniently unseen before OC at the beginning of the arc just to turn dark and the end would have been contrived.
Now that Barriss is likely to be the traitor, it's possible that she'll have a good motivation. There are strong hints that Barriss has not morphed into Krell, and even that she might not be the true mastermind. I definitely wouldn't have gone with Barriss as my choice for a Jedi traitor, but it could justifiably work out.
@Seerow and others have regularly brought up personality and repression issues surrounding Luminara and Barriss.
On the topic of the Bechdel Test (ie. female characters who aren't subsidiaries of male characters), the current episode arc passes this with flying colours.
I watched Brain Invaders for real now along side this arc. Its very interesting. I don't know if the current arc had changed things retroactively.I have to say Barriss is alot colder than I remembered. Most of her dialogue with Ahsoka is actually pretty short and to the point. When they make conversation its interesting how Barriss doesn't say much about herself but allows Ahsoka to dominate that convo with stuff about herself. She is also really quick to turn vicious.
Barriss actually takes the leadership role over Ahsoka. Its her who jumps to hold the clone troopers are saber tip after the first round of attacks. While Ahsoka mainly disarms. Barriss killed multiple clones. She deflects one blast into a clone's face. She doesn't seem entirely sweet. Then as I mentioned before her last line of dialogue in the episode was wanting to be killed. In reverse, I think she would have killed Ahsoka.
I kinda have to wonder if Barriss might have been falling all the way back there. Its not very Jedi like to be so quick to kill or threaten with a lightsaber. I'm sticking with my idea that as my bro up there put it, Barriss has repression issues. Her Jedi Master is just as cold and that's rubbed off on a young lady who seems pretty shy and impressionable. I actually take back what I said about confidence. Barriss is bossy enough and and confident enough in her skills until she fails. Then it seems like she can't think outside the box real far when that happens despite being very smart. That's just a recipe for easy corruption.
Then we get to the current arc. Barriss still sounds cold although much more reserved. It does make her seem more suspicious. The line "Things will never change." makes more sense now. This is almost unnerving looking back to Barriss telling Ahsoka the Jedi are peace keepers. Ahsoka asks what will happen to the Jedi after the war and Barriss actually answers, "I'm not sure." Foreshadowing? Just as clones hunting Jedi in "Brain Invaders" foreshadows Order 66 and even them hunting Ahsoka prior to that in this episode.
Its interesting to see the reversal however in their convo where Barriss does more of the talking. She talks about wearing ones emotions on ones sleeve. She sounds almost condescending actually when she tells Ahsoka how good she is at controlling her emotions. However, Barriss is still bossy and Ahsoka seems to let Barriss boss her around. There is more in "To Catch a Jedi" where Barriss tells Ahsoka exactly what to do as far as not using the Jedi Comlink.
I'm glad I watched the episodes together because now I see that, much as I don't want it to Barriss and as much as I want to believe she is a sweet, unsure, naive girl. That Barriss is a pacifist and a healer. It is possible to look at her in a more negative light going back through "Weapons Factory" and particularly "Brain Invaders". I agree it would have been better for an OC to have been created in place of Barriss as far back as season 2 or introduced more recently and given a chance to develop. That would take us into my hated old rant about how TCW needs to introduce more god damn OCs that are worth a damn and reuse them. Unfortunately none exist and Barriss was the obvious choice given her previous season 2 appearance.
I tend to disagree with the idea nothing in this show is planned out however. Sometimes things connect together so easily it has to be intention. When looking at Barriss in that more negative light I'm able to see how it fits that way. I wish Barriss, if we can't get a stupid OC, had been used much more and we had a chance to get to know her earlier and better. To see her change more and to see more of the friendship of Ahsoka.
However, I can still see where this will pay off big time if Barris is the culprit and lives through it. She's not Krell although it is possible she has some bigotry toward the clones given how quick she is to kill them. Unlike Krell she has a plan that seem way bigger than getting noticed. More likely she's already been noticed by Dooku although I really hope that doesn't come up until the following season. It seems like given her "Things will never change line." her motives are to cause change and are acting out against the Jedi Order. Why she is going it whether anti-war or out of resentment is hard to say. If revolution is what Barriss seeks then that means she believes in her cause and is simply going about it wrong. That's what I want if we have to go there, that's deep and in the end I won't mind if its Barriss this is pulled off well. The biggest disaster would be to kill her off and waste it.
Come on TCW make it happen.
I have a feeling I'm gonna love Barriss a lot more by the end of this coming episode.
I'm thinking Evil Plans or even Shadow Warrior could have been sacrificed for an Ahsoka/Barriss/possible-third-Jedi-BFF teamwork or friendship story. I know those episodes have their fans, but they're ultimately quite redundant in the grand scheme of things.