The Official Dark Nest III: The Swarm War Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by The2ndQuest, Nov 27, 2005.

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  1. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

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    Apr 19, 2005
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    I can't recall any prior example of such mind-numbingly precise concentration on the spur of the moment while being shot at.:rolleyes:
  2. Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare

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    Really? What do you think combat pilots do, then?

    It's just the same, only with the expanded consciousness/situational awareness of a Jedi...

    - The Imperial Ewok
  3. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

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    I don't think they active sieze control of enemy fighters in the middle of a furball, I don't.o_O
  4. Master_Keralys Sometime Technical Aide and Erstwhile Lit Mod

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    They do, however, have considerable fine control and reaction in combat. Precisely the kind of mind-numbing concentration we're talking about here, except that in the case of the Jedi, that concentration is expanded along with their awareness to a much wider zone of the battle.

    I think it should perhaps have been a bit more work for Jaina to do what she did, require a bit more concentration, but I certainly don't think it's impossible... [face_thinking]

    - Keralys
  5. Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare

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    Thanks, Ker: but I'd put that the other way round, actually: it's precisely because she's not in a state of clear-minded thought that Jaina is able to do that - she's in an altered state of consciousness and awareness; "in the zone", to use the phrase from VP, taking part in the "dance" from Traitor (Killik cosmological/metaphysical references are, of course, appropriate)...

    :D

    - The Imperial Ewok
  6. Master_Keralys Sometime Technical Aide and Erstwhile Lit Mod

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    Oh, you're completely right. There is a fundamental change in the state of consciousness when you're in that mode. I've been there at a few different times - playing football, writing music, doing certain kinds of math problems (yes, I'm strange, moving along... :p). But mind-numbing concentration is actually a pretty good description of that sensation; it's like the rest of the world kind of goes gray and silent and in some ways almost ceases to exist, while only the thing you're focused on it in place. And, as has been mentioned, there's the implication that the Killiks might have helped a bit; directly or not, there was undoubtedly influence given the whole nature of the mind meld; if nothing else it probably allowed her a bit better ability to split her tasking the way she did... [face_thinking]

    - Keralys
  7. jedisolosticks Jedi Master

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    Jul 28, 2005
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    sorry double post
  8. jedisolosticks Jedi Master

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    Jul 28, 2005
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    It took my mind too many times to get what you wrote!
  9. jedisolosticks Jedi Master

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    I understand that but the way it was written Jaina was cut off regardless of the killiks. She was having to resort to what she referred as the clumsy jedi mind meld. I thought she already had taken a step down being away from her nest. But it is an interesting point though. You could be entirely right, however I do think that Jaina has much experience in multitasking in difficult times. But this leads to more questions. I can't remember why the killiks are so special? And could Jaina, for example, be able to feed off of other force sensitive beings now that her brain has been physically realtered. (Mr. Denning may have left this open at the end on purpose because it didn't say they were cured.) Zekk and Jaina spent so much time with the killiks. Lowie and Tesar were still joined after considerable time away, not to mention very little time there. I do remember the other jedi masters wanting not to kill Raynar because he was so strong now. They thought it would be an advantage to have him alive. Could the jedi affected (joiners) be a whole different breed of jedi (jedi force sucking vampires!) Maybe the beginning to a different jedi order.
  10. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    >>I can't recall any prior example of such mind-numbingly precise concentration on the spur of the moment while being shot at.<<

    besides the combat-situational-awareness aspect people are pointing out, it's really not much different than calling a lightsaber or blaster to one's hand or force-shoving a carbonite chamber control switch or even a battle droid or person (size matters not).
  11. Tiershon_Fett Jedi Grand Master

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    Oct 25, 2000
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    I consider Jaina's skills to be part of the Killiks still controlling her. Just as with Lomi Plo. They wouldn't be that powerful by themselves.
  12. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

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    Apr 19, 2005
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    Not in theory, perhaps, but at the same time, the object in question is being manipulated in exactly the opposite direction by humanoid hands and myriad fly-by-wire systems, without a doubt...

    Hey! Where's Charlemagne? This would be right up his alley.[face_thinking]

    Oh that? I do it all the time.:confused:

    The problem here is that you're both thinking in terms of expanding awareness, when by rights, in order to accomplish such a task as pulling a pilot's stick out of her hands, she'd actually have to narrow it.
  13. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    >>but at the same time, the object in question is being manipulated in exactly the opposite direction by humanoid hands<<

    Like gravity? ;)
  14. barabel_humour Jedi Master

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    Nov 14, 2005
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    Well, couldn't she be expanding her awareness but narrowing her focus? [face_thinking]
  15. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

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    Thanks. Now I have two factors to oppose Jaina's Force-frummery.:D

    That's rather like working smarter, not harder, isn't it?:p
  16. Master_Keralys Sometime Technical Aide and Erstwhile Lit Mod

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    Actually, if I remember right, gravity would have helped Jaina's "Force-frummery," as you so eloquently put it... :p Indeed, I believe that that was the thrust of T2Q's post - though please correct me if I'm wrong, T2Q.

    - Keralys
  17. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

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    Conceded, but isn't a fly-by-wire system supposed to negate the effects of gravity (among other things) on the stick and control surfaces?:confused:
  18. Master_Keralys Sometime Technical Aide and Erstwhile Lit Mod

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    I suspect the point was more that gravity was on the side of the way Jaina wanted the craft to go. Namely, down. In other words, just giving it a good push and letting gravity do the rest pretty much solves the problem. At least, I think that's what was meant. But T2Q isn't clarifying at the moment, so who knows? :p

    - Keralys
  19. Drew_Atreides Force Ghost

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    Apr 30, 2002
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    I wouldn't even give him "Star by Star" (in my opinion, among the most overrated of the Star Wars books. Heck, it's right up there with the X-Wing series when we're talkin' overrated by the fans!)

    The man cannot write action to save his life. I HATE his books because in ALL of them there is at least one extended sequence where i am unable to picture exactly what the heck is going on in ANY way.

    The whole Zekk-Jaina joiner thing alone should cement this guy's place among the worst of the Star Wars authors. Seriously, anytime i get to a bit that involves Jaina/Zekk, i contemplate just giving up. I haven't felt this way since the mishandling of Han's character in "The Courtship of Princess Leia"!

    If the writing and stories don't get better in the early going of LotF, i'm gonna have to drop these novels again till things improve.
  20. Darklord07 Jedi Master

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    Aug 4, 2005
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    I am so late in getting this book. Well I didn't even get the book book, unfortunately I got the Audio tape, but hey at least now I know how the names are pronounced. I am liking this book/tape/whatever! I just wish it had more than one person read when they speak, its weird hearing some guy reading Maras part, and Leias part. C3PO sounds funny. Anyway I am sad that Danni, and Tenel left, that sucks!
  21. barabel_humour Jedi Master

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    Nov 14, 2005
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    Personally, I'm more sad that I didn't enjoy this trilogy and even sadder that Denning is writing 1/3 of LotF than I am about Danni and TK leaving the Order. :( [face_worried] [face_frustrated]

    It had such potential...
  22. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Actually, the point I was going for was pointing out gravity is a force that needs to be counter-acted against levitating/force gripping things like sabers and blasters the same as a pilot's hand would have on the flight stick...but you're point works too ;)
  23. Master_Keralys Sometime Technical Aide and Erstwhile Lit Mod

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    Ah, well, okay, that works too. :p Glad to have it clarified, though, because I was starting to confuse myself just thinking about it. [face_hypnotized]

    I didn't care for Jaina overall in the DN trilogy, though, especially this book, QM, so we're in agreement on that.

    Jacen, on the other hand, is an awesome character. Not necessarily good, but definitely fascinating. There's a lot of unplumbed depth there, methinks... [face_thinking]

    - Keralys
  24. Darklord07 Jedi Master

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    Aug 4, 2005
    star 4
    I am soo lovin this book! Leia and Han and Mara and Luke, Jaina are soooo kick ass!
    Awesome fights, funny ewok moments, and its so exciting! I am already on disk 4, only one disk left, nooo!
  25. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

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    Apr 19, 2005
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    Umm, and?

    No kidding. She's downright... painful, even to think about.:oops:

    Looking forward to whatever this big secret he reveals in LotF is, so long as it's not an announcement that he the new Sith Lord and Ben is his apprentice.:p

    And does anyone else think that the person that Han is going to lear "dark truths" about is Leia?[face_thinking]
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