Lit The Official Darth Plagueis Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Rogue_Follower, Jan 3, 2012.

  1. Havac Former Moderator

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2005
    star 7
    Yeah, I'm pretty sure the Gambit books give up on pretending they're different people.
  2. _Catherine_ Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    It's also blatantly apparent in Shadow Hunter and that one comic where the Jedi tell Palpatine they're going to test the Senate's midichlorians and then in the next scene Sidious knows about this somehow. Also that one YA Boba Fett book where Palpatine tells Boba that he knows Dooku is Darth Tyranus for some reason.

    Oh, and YDR when Sidious says he know Dooku won't go back to the light side or something and then immediately afterward it cuts to Palpatine sending Anakin and Obi-Wan to Vjun. I think there's also a pretty big hint that Palpatine is, at least, kind of a huge jerk in one of the Clone Wars Adventures digests where a bunch of clone troopers sacrifice themselves on a mission to retrieve some package they think is vital to the Republic then it turns out to be a box of candy that Palpatine wanted.

    I know that Wild Space doesn't bother keeping up the ruse. Pretty sure at least some of the others don't either.
  3. Havac Former Moderator

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2005
    star 7
    Yeah, there are a ton of books that are like, "Well, technically I'm not saying they're the same guy, but, you know . . ."

    The list of books that discard even the wink-and-a-nod charade for the idiotic hobble that it is, though, is disappointingly few, but I'm guessing it'll get larger as we go longer and longer with the reveal officially made and writers realize that the charade isn't actually getting them anything.
    Last edited by Havac, Jan 6, 2013
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  4. Lugija Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 3, 2009
    star 4
    I'd like future novels to keep up the ruse. There's something deliciously campy in the way Doriana first talks to Palpatine, then goes all the way to his apartment to have a secret holo meeting with Sidious in Outbound Flight.
    And it's fun to guess what he might be thinking when talking to people. But of course, if there's ever a Darth Tyranus or Darth Sidious novel, those are different animals.
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  5. Havac Former Moderator

    Member Since:
    Sep 29, 2005
    star 7
    Well, Doriana being a patsy is its own kind of fun -- but there's no need for books to refuse to separate Sidious/Palpatine POV, or refuse to use it, just to keep up the ruse, or to have characters like Dooku who should know refuse to mention it in their POV, or whatever. You can certainly continue to exploit the fact that other people don't know, just . . . don't refuse to exploit the fact that the reader knows.
  6. Lugija Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 3, 2009
    star 4
    Well let me rewrite my opinion. Of course there should be no rule to disallow authors to make connections in POVs or even in narration. Dooku certainly shouldn't hop around the fact when he thinks of Palpatine and Sidious.

    Perhaps I just feel like it would be jarring to suddenly go from "Palpatine thought about Neimoidians when he went to visit Chancellor Valorum *wink wink*" to "Palpatine took off the Sith cloak and went to visit Chancellor Valorum" if that's not what the book is about.
  7. SaucySarlaac Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2012
    star 1
    Me too.

    It makes sense that this event would be thought about by Plagueis, he would consider this to be a victory in the fight with the force. In order to conquer the Jedi, the Sith must also wrestle with the force.

    Throughout the novel we hear about how the force has a will and the Sith sought to dominate it. This particular confrontation was handled well I thought, two sith, meditating on Sojourn in the Fort in Plagueis little bedroom was a good way to show the raw power of the two sith
  8. BoromirsFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2010
    star 4
    Does this novel get better once Palpatine is a major character? I stopped reading at the Plagueis stowaway adventure part. The book was extremely boring, but the stowaway section did pick things up.

    But I did expect this "greatness" of Darth Plagueis to set in a bit earlier....
  9. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    In my opinion, it really picks up once he finds Palpatine. His search for an apprentice is also interesting, but they all pale in comparison to Palpatine. He's almost even more of a main character than Darth Plagueis.
    BoromirsFan likes this.
  10. Darth Xalfrea Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2013
    star 3
    While the inner workings, musings and solo adventures of Plagueis are interesting in their own right, once Palpatine enters the picture, that's when the novel gets really interesting. That's not to say that Palpatine steals the show; Plagueis gets some other really great scenes in the book. But let's face it, we're finally getting into the backstory of the big man Palpy himself.
    ---------------------------------
    Listening to the audiobook again, I gotta comment on how it was a really neat idea that Plagueis and his interaction and opinion on humans doesn't come in until Plagueis heads to Naboo. Until then we're surrounded by aliens and near-humans.
    BoromirsFan likes this.
  11. SaucySarlaac Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2012
    star 1

    Interesting also that in The Tenebrous Way Darth Tenebrous explains how he chose a Muun species specifically because they have the qualities/attributes he needed in an apprentice.

    Plagueis did similarly, noting the fallibility of humans.
  12. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    When was the "tone poem" for Darth Maul with "fear attracts the fearful", etc. first released to the public? 1999? Because the last time I watched it I noticed that when Maul says "the corrupt" we're looking at an image of Palpatine. Kind of gives the game away right there...
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Feb 13, 2013
  13. Danz Borin Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 16, 2012
    star 1

    Wow.

    Do you give up on all novels so quickly?
  14. BoromirsFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2010
    star 4
    Wow. Do you always jump to conclusions so quickly?

    I haven't given up. I merely stopped. When I have more free time I will continue reading Plagueis.

    I would much rather read the books for my classes right now because I NEED to!
    Last edited by BoromirsFan, Feb 13, 2013
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  15. Danz Borin Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 16, 2012
    star 1
    Generally saying you 'stopped' reading something, means quitting. "I stopped smoking." Ie. "I quit smoking." Their not exacts, their similars, and generally taken as reference to mean the same.

    The Plagueis being stranded part and returning back to civilization is less than 30 pages in, if I remember correctly. It's honestly pretty much the very beginning of the novel, and its far from boring even that portion. There's far worse REAL world novels as well as STAR WARS novels in their first 30 pages, some of which even get better after those 30 pages (and some of which get worse after them).
  16. Danz Borin Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 16, 2012
    star 1
    You also never mentioned about the NEED to read other novels, so one doesn't know about your NEEDS or class requirements, one only knows what you told us, which was that you stopped at pretty much the beginning of the novel.
  17. BoromirsFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2010
    star 4
    I don't care about your NEED to get more information before jumping to conclusions. I said that I stopped reading , not that I gave up reading. I was just posting my impressions of the first 50 pages (paperback).
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I did feel very bad for that crew Plagueis encountered. This section was nice, I felt a sad foreboding that things would not go well for them. Despite my hopes of them breaking with Plagueis cleanly, they did not!
  18. fistofan1 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 8, 2009
    star 4
    I'm rereading this novel and it's even better than I remembered. Please, please can we get a Darth Tyranus follow-up?
    Last edited by fistofan1, Feb 13, 2013
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  19. Darth Xalfrea Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2013
    star 3
    I'm all for a Tyranus/Sidious followup. Especially if it overlaps with the movies and goes into detail on the various things in-between like what the Plagueis book did.

    But first I need "The Plagueis Way". Just what was Plagueis thinking during his drunken murder?
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  20. Sir Cronal Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Feb 14, 2013
    @Darth Xalfrea, I completely agree.

    A Tyranus/Sidious followup would be fantastic. I especially liked how in Darth Plagueis, Luceno managed to tie his novel to other existing EU materials such as Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter, the Jedi Council: Acts of War comic or the Bounty Hunter video game. One of the strongest elements of the Star Wars Universe is continuity and I can only wish for a Dooku/Palpatine novel written the same way as Darth Plagueis. Just imagine reading a longer conversation between Sidious and Dooku when they meet on Coruscant at the end of AOTC.
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  21. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    Oh holy shistavanens we have a "Sir Cronal" now too. What is this forum coming to?

    And I'm all for more Dooku. TCW is ruining his character -- it's like they've completely forgotten he had once been a Jedi. If it's ever so much as mentioned it's only hollow lip service.
    Last edited by Barriss_Coffee, Feb 14, 2013
  22. BoromirsFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2010
    star 4
    Definitely hoping for a Luceno Dooku book
  23. Fleab88 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2012
    star 3
    When one says they got really bored within the first 30 pages of the book and stopped reading without giving more details such as being busy with school, it would seem odd to get frustrated when someone else naturally assume you quit reading the book. Makes sense that you needed to stop reading because of textbooks, but you never even hinted at that. You pretty strongly implied you simply quit reading because you got bored.

    To answer your original question, it does pick up a good bit, but there are a lot of slower paced parts like the first thirty pages. I loved the whole book, and absolutely loved the set up. My guess would be you would continue to be pretty bored at parts, if the first 30 pages didn't catch your interest.
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  24. fistofan1 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 8, 2009
    star 4
    Agreed 100% on Dooku. When the show began, I was excited to see an evil, dark side Dooku. Now, I wish the writers would step back and make his character a little more ambiguous like in AOTC. Less dark side maniac, more mysterious wizard.
  25. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    But there's no point to him being mysterious or ambiguous now. We already know he's a Sith in league with Sidious. As far as forgetting he had once been a Jedi, the show referred to his tutelage under Yoda. What else is it supposed to do, show flashbacks to his Jedi days?