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The *Official* Duchess Satine Kryze in The Clone Wars Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by ZEM, Jan 29, 2010.

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  1. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 16, 2005
    As I've said before, "she's dead, son, accept it." Mourn her and pay her tribute, just stop finger pointing while you're doing it (not to be callous...but you seem to be fishing for a consensus that Satine's death is partially to be laid at Obi-Wan's feet. Truth is, you should point your finger at Maul, the actual murderer).
     
  2. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    I never except anything better from Maul, but Obi Wan is her...close friend and I never said it's just Obi Wan's fault. Satine was also killed because she's a "friend" of Obi Wan.

    Oh yeah, I don't understand why did Obi Wan try to taunt Maul when he was choking Satine.
     
    Order66Survivor likes this.
  3. Kualan

    Kualan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 4, 2008
    He wasn't so much taunting him as he was standing his ground in the face of an opponent who clearly wanted him to break down and give into his emotions, namely fear (for his "friend"). Imagine Anakin in the same situation if it was Padme being strangled by Maul. Pretty safe bet to say Skywalker would have reacted how Maul was hoping Kenobi would.
     
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  4. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    It made Maul more angry when he mentioned Maul's past, which Maul didn't want to hear about. What's more important? Your emotion of the life of your friend?
     
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  5. Kualan

    Kualan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 4, 2008
    The difference is that Obi-Wan wasn't intending to make Maul mad by mentioning his past. He was trying to establish an understanding with him. To reach out to him, as any true Jedi would. Jedi are guided by their compassion - it is why Obi-Wan tries to reach Maul, why he cares for Satine's plight - but they are ruled by their discipline. And a disciplined mind in that situation would reason that, whatever you do, don't do the one thing your arch-nemesis wants you to do. Why? Simply because they want you to do it.

    So going berserker mode wasn't an option for Obi-Wan, so he did the next best thing and tried to get to Maul on an emotional level. It backfired certainly, but that doesn't mean Maul's reaction is Obi-Wan's fault. Maul is a sentient being. He chose to ignore Obi-Wan and kill Satine.

    Also, as a courtesy to other forum users could you put a spoiler disclaimer at the top of your original post please? Not sure everyone will have had the chance to see it yet.
     
  6. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    Understanding with someone like Maul and he knew Maul hates him a lot? Yes, nobody asked Obi Wan to go angry, but he also didn't need to say those words as well. Just remain silent, or pretend to go a bit darker like Maul said, so Maul would find his idea was working, he won't kill Satine right way.

    If he really wants to understand with Maul, he should tell him he understand how powerful Dark Side is rather than "NO NO NO Dark Side is bad and weak, you didn't make the choice". That's not a way you should do against some Dark Side worshiper since he was born in the beginning. Of course as a Jedi he could not say it, so why not remain silent or try other methods?

    Sure, wait I cannot edit it anymore.
     
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  7. Kualan

    Kualan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 4, 2008
    No way Obi-Wan could have known that though, that's the thing. As far as he knew, Maul might have responded to his attempts to empathise. Just as Darth Vader might have responded to Luke's attempt on Endor (before they go up to the Death Star). As viewers, we have the kind of 20-20 vision and benefit of hindsight that the characters don't.
     
  8. Paparazzo

    Paparazzo Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2011
    I really wanted Obi-Wan to say "me too" before she kicked the bucket.

    She was a great character. :(
     
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  9. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    I mean Maul is devout Dark Side believer since he was born, attack his belief certainly is not something will make him happy. Not to say he hates Obi Wan like hell.

    Of course, it's not too big of deal compare to he refused Anakin's help, while he could have done better. But I just don't understand someone said that was good simply because Obi Wan didn't get affected by his emotion, no it didn't but that caused Maul to enrage and killed Satine.
     
  10. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Surely you're not implying you are filled with the Dark Side and so intuitively understand how to reason with a Dark Sider, are you? (Sorry, couldn't resist - this is a joke)

    Even if you are 100% correct, Satine was still going to die - if in fact as you believe Obi-Wan pretending to give in to his anger (how far would he have to go?) would have delayed Satine's death, it would have only delayed it a few minutes. And who's to say that Maul wouldn't have gleaned that Obi-Wan was only pretending in order to buy time, and decided to cut the charade short by killing her sooner?
     
  11. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    Well, it could be better than attack the belief of a devout worshiper, if he could not do it, remain silent would be better.

    Yes Maul will kill Satine by some point for sure, but maybe not too soon if he's not enraged since he was using her to torture Obi Wan mentally. The only thing he could do is to try to make Maul do it as late as possible so as long as Satine lives, there is still hope.

    I'm no Jedi, so maybe I judge such situation differently than Obi Wan, I think the most important thing is to save her life, since you can control you self again if you once lost it, you can even turn back from Dark Side if you did. But if life is lost, nothing can get it back, Plagueis is dead and his ability is lost.

    I think Obi Wan might have to think about the Jedi discipline and the life of Satine at the same time. Of course it's not too big of a deal compare to bring Anakin with him.
     
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  12. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
  13. Paparazzo

    Paparazzo Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2011
     
  14. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
    Which is why Slowking is supposed to ask a mod (there is almost always one online) to unlock it.
     
  15. Paparazzo

    Paparazzo Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2011
    [​IMG]

    Forgive me.
     
  16. The Hellhammer

    The Hellhammer Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 4, 2012
    To be honest, never liked her.
    I couldn't wait for the Mandalorians to debut in this show, and then we got...pacifist Mandalorians?!
    No way.

    Sorry to all fans, nothing personal, but I am simply glad that for once the "good guys" don't save the day at last minute.
     
  17. Coric

    Coric Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 19, 2011
    No problem! :p
     
  18. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    It's just a few pages, and I wrote a lot, why not just use this thread?
     
  19. QuangoFett

    QuangoFett Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Nah, merging seems like a better solution.
     
  20. Seerow

    Seerow Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 7, 2011
    agreed. Opened old Satine thread and merged this one into it.
     
  21. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    Oh yeah, so now you watched it and understand why was I so mad about it right?
     
  22. Seerow

    Seerow Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 7, 2011
    I have not gotten to watch this episode yet. My DVR is across the state from me as are my internet browsing devices that support flash. Hopefully I'll see it and post my thoughts on "Lawless" late tomorrow night or Monday morning EST. Good thing I'm not spoiler free not that I could be if I tried or something like that.
     
  23. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    Also I don't understand that super secret of "sisters" is for, except they want to introduce a Obi-Katan romance?
     
  24. Kualan

    Kualan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 4, 2008
    I will stake my profile picture that an Obi-Katan romance never happens except in the "shippers"' minds.
     
  25. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    I hope so, while he did similar thing after Siri's death.
     
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