***The Official "Is Palpatine Sidious?" Debate Thread***

Yes, Undomiel. The story is about the fall and redemption of Anakin. If a few jedi die along the way, those are the breaks.

Watching the bad guys paste the Jedi is great simply because it makes me want to jump up, clutch my fist, and shout "YES" whenever Vader throws Palpatine down that shaft.

Odius, I won't make them watch it in that order. I just think they will.

 

Everytime somebody brings up the Sith clouding the Jedi's minds and subverting their powers I think of Sidious sitting in a room twiddling his thumbs and grunting (no I don't mean that). I don't think it is like that.

I think Mace Windu and Qui-Gon tricked Poof into joining Dooku. Then Zam impersonated Sifo-Dyas and killed Aurra Sing and stole her speeder. Oh, and then Yoda.....

I'm done.

 

When is this supposed clone revelation to take place. Probably at the end of the movie, correct. But we would need some sort of explanation for the reasons for having a clone. The end of Ep. III has to cover a great deal of topics,: Anakin becomes Vader, Luke and Leia hidden, the duel to end all duels. The twist would have to be a climactic event. But in a movie that needs to use this valuable screen time, where would their be time to explain this stuff. And it does need explaining.

Remember the "I am your father' line had to be explained and was explained via ROTJ. However, we no longer have the luxury of another movie to tie up loose ends. There are already a lot of loose ends to tie up and it doesn't seem possible to create another loose end and tie it up in the same movie. I don't think that there is going to be much screen time to make this possible.

BTW hello everybody, I like the new thread. It looks nice, I especially like the carpeting. Who did the interior decorating? Need some drapes, though...

 

Hey, have a seat. Do you need an ottoman?

Actually, I picture it happening earlier than the end. I think the truth will be revealed earlier on, and the last part of the movie will be the struggle by the jedi to salvage what they can, and the conflict involving padme/obi/ani/sid(yoda can come, too, if he wants).

 

from Yaddle12:

"Has anyone noticed that in RotJ, the Emperor holds his hands in front of him, loosely, with his fingers dangling. Darth Sidious does the same thing, it is very obvious. But, Supreme Chancellor Palpatine does not. Any comments on this?"

I found this on the Main Board under a different thread, but I found it interesting.

It was also brought up that Palpy DOES hold his hands like Montgomery Burns when he is speaking with Anakin alone in his chambers.

Could this just be a habbit Ian has, or do you think it is another small clue George is laying out there for us to over analyze?

 

I was just thinking, we may get an answer to all of this when the AOTC dvd comes out. I know many don't consider commentary canon but if George makes it painfully clear, I want to see the sad attempts on this thread to keep the clone theory alive.

It's bound to be amusing.

 

Palpatine does hold his hands like that. Watch the Palpatine/Anakin scene in AOTC again. It's cool.

 

Rogue,
"Sad attempts"?

You do realize that post two here gave me the right to call you a weenie whenever you make a post like that.

Weenie.



Just kidding you. You know that I actually think they will be one and the same, don't you?

 

RogueTrader:

I don't think it's that useful to argue the point about Palp/Sidious on the basis of what a person thinks is good story telling.

GL has already shown himself able to put stuff in the movies that doesn't make sense or isn't necessary to the main story. Leia is Luke's sister. Anakin made C-3PO.

It's all about execution anyway. Any goofy plot twist can be made plausible with the right writing. Ep3 could easily be written to show that the future Emperor, Sidious, is such a badass that he was able to take over the Republic by putting a clone in charge.

This Palp/Sidious debate should be about *facts*.

 

This has been posted before, either in this thread or others similar to it. But just in case people missed it, here it is. (this should settle the debate even for the most die hard non-believers that Palpatine is Sidious.)

From the starwars.com databank:

"... With spoken regrets, Palpatine accepted the new
mantle of power. He promised to return his absolute
authority to the Senate after emergency subsided.
What no one realized was that the galaxy would
undergo further upheaval, and that a state of crisis
would ensure Palpatine's authority for decades.

Palpatine instituted a military build-up unprecedented
in galactic history. He created the New Order, a
Galactic Empire that ruled by tyranny. The Jedi
Knights, his biggest threat, were extinguished by
his greatest dark side pupil: Anakin Skywalker, who
had become Darth Vader.

During the Galactic Civil War, Palpatine ruled with an
iron fist. He disbanded the Imperial Senate, and
passed control down to the regional governors and
the military. During the Hoth campaign, Palpatine
expressed to Vader his concerns over Luke
Skywalker, a young Rebel powerful in the Force.
Vader suggested that the two convert the youth to
the dark side of the Force, an idea the Emperor seconded.

The Emperor was a scheming ruler, planning events
far in the future, using the Force to foresee the
results. Palpatine allowed Rebel spies to learn of
the location of the second Death Star, and foresaw
their strike team and fleet assault. Palpatine crafted
an elaborate trap that was to be the end of the
Rebellion. He also concentrated on converting Luke
Skywalker to the dark side of the Force, even at the
expense of sacrificing Vader. In the Death Star,
high above the Battle of Endor, Luke refused the
Emperor's newfound dark side power, and so
Palpatine used his deadly Force lightning to attack
the young Jedi. Luke almost died in the assault, but
his father, Darth Vader, returned to the light side of
the Force, and hurled the Emperor into the Death
Star's reactor core, killing him.

Palpatine was a gnarled, old man. An
ancient-looking human, he had pale skin, and
searing, sickly yellow eyes. He wore a heavy dark
cloak, and carried a glossy black cane."

 

Roguetrader, you appear awfully alone with your views here. But we all appreciate them. Really.

Anyway, I don't see something like this taking that much time in Episode III. I see it almost being along the lines of "It was I who allowed the Alliance to know the location of the shield generator...Oh...I'm afraid the deflector shield will be quite operational when your friends arrive....<snicker>" in ROTJ. I -really- don't see this taking up more than a few minutes....

 

No actually he(netslave) is not alone, but you (Mr. Bungle) can think whatever you want...

 

B1LL, Read the second post. Case in point: in what you quoted, Vader killed all the jedi. Yet, the movies prove this wrong. Obi wan and yoda live.

 

DarthOT,
No need to be harsh, he was just kidding.

 

Darth_OlsenTwins:

OK, how about "grossly outnumbered"?

 

Lukeduff

Luke being Leia's brother has a lot to do with the story. It has to do with the Force creating Luke's destiny. It guides him to find his father and it guides him to find his sister as well. This is the basis of why Luke met Leia in the first place. It was the will of the force.

About C3PO. He is a main character in all of the stories. The original OT was basically all witnessed by the droids. They play an integral part of the story by having gone through many of the events within them.

These points are very necessary to the main story.

 

Ian Mc Diarmid uses two different body languages when he plays Palpatine, or the evil Darth Sidious. He also speaks differently, moves his lips differently, ...
(when he talks to Tyranus at the end of the movie, he sounds exactly like the Emperor from ROTJ).

In the scene where Anakin and Palpatine are together, ian chose to walk and hold his hands just like Darth Sidious. Anakin and Palpatine walk exactly like Vader and the Emperor in the death star docking bay in ROTJ. Creepy.

Sidious *always* walks slightly ahead of his apprentice (maul in the balcony scene, Anakin/Vader in AOTC/ROTJ, Tyranus in AOTC), looking to the horizon, his hands held in front of him. He sometimes turns to look at his apprentice as he finishes his sentences.
The apprentice remains respectfully behind Sidious.

It is clear in that scene that the good chancellor is the evil Sith Master.

What I like in this scene is that Anakin really behaves like if he was Palps' padawan/apprentice. Definitely creepy.

Ian is such a good actor.

 

FOTR,
I agree, acting wise, he is great in the PT.

 

I like cheese

 

Darth_OT,
I can agree with the importance, although I think 3po's is somewhat less than the Leia one. At the same time, if memory serves me correctly, when Luke meets Leia in ANH, Lucas had no intention of them being siblings. So it wasn't actually a story line he planned on taking advantage of, but an option he decided to use when he finally saw it. Another case of George changing his mind.

George sculpts his movies as he goes, as opposed to having a strict story he sticks to his guns on, IMO.

 

Remember in TPM, when Amidala leaves to return to Naboo. The look on Palpatine's when she exits looks exactly like Sidious (or what we can see of Sidious). The facial expression near the mouth is very creepy. And then he gets that partial smile on his face. Not proof or anything, I just thought it to be creepy.

 

Yes. Regardless of the outcome, that dude is great at being sinister.

 

Yes the most infamous words in Star Wars-dom,

"I love democracy."

 

When is the next movie coming out?

George is a sadist. He tortures us with waiting for the last time we get to see the jedi in all their glory.

This is gonna drive me crazy.

BTW, did I mention that Palpatine is a clone of Darth Sidious?

 

Speaking of Mr. Burns, did anyone else notice at the end of AOTC where Palps is watching the clone army go off to war standing on that balcony, that in profile, he looks a lot like Mr. Burns? If they ever do a live action Simpsons movie, they need to hire Ian to play Mr Burns. "Excellent!"