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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

A&A The Official Kathy Tyers Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Literature' started by The Gatherer, Feb 21, 2002.

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  1. Jedi_Liz

    Jedi_Liz Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    please do not use this thread to bash Kathy Tyers writing. That is not nice.



    *ignoring Shelley's rant*
     
  2. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    This is a thread about Kathy Tyers' writing. If it is permissible to criticize other people's writing (see Barbara Hambly's thread), then I don't see why Mara...er, Kathy...Tyers should be treated with kid gloves.
     
  3. Jedi_Liz

    Jedi_Liz Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    Critiquing is one thing, but bashing is another.



    I think Kathy did a very good job with Balance Point, but then, I enjoyed the book and have no problems with it.
     
  4. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    No one bashed Tyers. They critiqued her. Tyers is a writer and is surely used to far worse criticism than that--otherwise she wouldn't be a writer.

    Some people didn't like BP, and others liked it but had a problem with Tyers' blatant favoritism toward Luke and Mara, and objected to passages such as the one I listed.
     
  5. Jedi15

    Jedi15 Jedi Youngling star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 1999
    Critiquing is one thing, but bashing is another.

    Where exactly in Shelley's post did she bash Kathy Tyers?


    I think Kathy did a very good job with Balance Point, but then, I enjoyed the book and have no problems with it.

    That's your opinion. Obviously, Shelley didn't like BP. That's her opinion. Just because she didn't like one particular book written by KT doesn't mean she's bashing the author.

    Making personal insults or flames toward the AUTHOR herself would be uncalled-for bashing. Criticizing her work isn't. That's why these author threads are here in the first place.
     
  6. Jedi_Liz

    Jedi_Liz Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    you have a point, but in my opinion, you are interpreting the book different from other people.


    Even I had a problem with Leia having her head shaved and stuff, but I am not criticizing the writing itself.


    At least we found out that Malinza was safe, that's one reason to like Balance Point.
     
  7. ChildOfWinds

    ChildOfWinds Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 7, 2001
    Shelley, can you please provide a page number for your quote? I don't remember reading that in BP. I did a quick skim and must have missed it, because I couldn't find it. I'd like to read the quote in context.

    Thank you!
     
  8. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    Even I had a problem with Leia having her head shaved and stuff,

    "And stuff"? You mean being brutally, sadistically, graphically tortured because she's so incompetent with the Force that she can't save herself? Tyers admitted that torturing Leia wasn't the plan. Jacen's family was supposed to be captured, but she changed it so only Leia was captured AND tortured. She said she was surprised that Del Rey let her torture Leia so much.

    Oh, and Tyers made pointed references to Leia being a bad role model for her kids because she "ignored her training" or some such rubbish. Funny how Mara ignored her training far more but was still declared a Jedi Knight and a Jedi Master, and suddenly became incredibly strong in the Force.

    but I am not criticizing the writing itself.

    And criticizing the writing is perfectly acceptable. We are here to discuss the writing of Kathy Tyers, which encompasses criticism.

    If you don't like it, too bad. Criticism of other authors' writing is permitted. Why should Tyers be exempt?
     
  9. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
    I feel I owe an apology to Ms. Tyers; the quote I posted on the previous page actually isn't in BP. I was told about it by someone, who said it was told to her. Obviously it's one of those quotes that gets passed around and distorted more with each telling, or else someone along the line made it up.

    Nonetheless, I do feel BP is slanted toward Mara and Ms. Tyers goes out of her way to demean Leia.

    It's too bad, because I actually like Tyers' writing more than most EUthors'.
     
  10. ChildOfWinds

    ChildOfWinds Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 7, 2001
    Shelley:
    I feel I owe an apology to Ms. Tyers; the quote I posted on the previous page actually isn't in BP. I was told about it by someone, who said it was told to her. Obviously it's one of those quotes that gets passed around and distorted more with each telling, or else someone along the line made it up.

    Thank you for letting me know, Shelley. It didn't sound like something Kathy Tyers would write about Leia and I knew I didn't remember it. I even did a quick search through BP, but couldn't find it. I'm glad to find out for sure that it doesn't exist.

    I really liked both BP and TRUCE AT BAKURA. Her FIREBIRD trilogy is great too!

     
  11. Doo-Kimmie

    Doo-Kimmie Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Oct 22, 2001
    Let's talk about Kathy's work and *not* about the other stuff that someone was talking about. That sort of stuff does not belong in a thread that praises Kathy's work.

    Where does it say that this is a thread that "praises" Tyers' work? It's a discussion thread... a discussion can either praise or critique.

    I liked Truce at Bakura well enough and really liked Gaeriel. Balance Point, in my opinion, was nowhere near as good.
     
  12. Jades Fire

    Jades Fire Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 1998
    Very Interesting! This fake passage is very interesting. Makes me wonder what else... nevermind.

    Anyway, for anyone who likes Kathy's SW books, I suggest trying out her FIREBIRD trilogy series. For someone who isn't the natural audience for these types of books, I really enjoyed them. The first one, "Firebird", is my sentimental favorite, though I think the second one, "Fusion Fire", is better. The third book, "Crown of Fire", was a bit of a let-down for me. I felt it was preachier than the first two, and was almost too frenetic, too packed with plot, almost as if more than one book's worth of material was packed in there.

    Doo-Kimmie. I like the first line in your sig.
    Farscape. RIP. :(
    Hopefully the fans can rescue it.
     
  13. Podkayne

    Podkayne Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2000
    the quote I posted on the previous page actually isn't in BP. I was told about it by someone, who said it was told to her. Obviously it's one of those quotes that gets passed around and distorted more with each telling, or else someone along the line made it up.

    This is a rather involded passage to have just been passed around by word of mouth, I don't think, like Topsy, it just grew.
    I'd say someone made it up.

    It sounds an awful lot like some of the Mara/Tyers bashing that was going on a while ago at the Soul of the Jedi forums. Some of the phrases are exactly the same.

    Perhaps someone there was getting a bit creative?

     
  14. Doo-Kimmie

    Doo-Kimmie Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Oct 22, 2001
    Jades Fire, great... bum me out! ;)

    I just found out about it yesterday from Virginia Hey! I've been writing letters of protest all morning.

    Back on topic... I haven't read any of Kathy Tyers' other work. Maybe I will check out one of her Firebird novels.
     
  15. Aunecah_Skywalker

    Aunecah_Skywalker Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Mar 25, 2002
    Balance Point. Well here's my review:

    Balance Point is supposed to be about Jacen Solo (I suppose), but there are ample amounts of Mara in there as well. Tyres's writing style is interesting and somewhat simple but it definitely isn't anywhere near the best. The book was very boring for me. I didn't finish reading it the first time I started it. I only finished it because I told myself I would read all the books of a series even the book happens to be poorly written.

    I liked how she portreyed the inner conflict in Jacen. I think she did a very good job of it. However, I think she did a very poor job with Han and Leia's reunion scene. I thought there would be more to their reunion than Leia hugging Han, and Han asking her to forgive him.

    I didn't like her characterization of Jaina. I don't think that Jaina should go confiding in Mara, complaining to Mara about her mother. Until the NJO, Jaina very much respected Leia. Her attitude can't suddenly do a major reversal - it isn't realistic.

    I didn't like the fact that there was very little of the story told from Luke's POV. [face_plain] Half the book was from Mara's POV. She isn't the only Skywalker.

    I don't like Mara in general, but I thought she was written better in the BP. :) I still didn't like how Mara treated Luke in the book.

    I also read Truce at Bakura. I like Gaerial Capiston (sp.?) I felt so sad when she didn't ... erm ... (for the lack of better words) love Luke back? However, I lost my interest in the TaB, just like in BP, somewhere in the middle.

    I think Tyres is an okay author. She can write a tale without dropping occasional blunders in there.

    I'd give the book a 6/10. I would have given it a 3 if it didn't include the pre-birth issues of Luke's son. :D 8-}

    Aunecah
     
  16. LawgSkrak

    LawgSkrak Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 23, 1999
    Does Kathy stillcome on here at all?
     
  17. Excellence

    Excellence Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2002
    Kathy's foray in the Star Wars universe wasn't so bad, although it would be great if she indulged the reader a bit and actually described important elements a bit more.

    In Bakura, the Flurry was a key warship. As such, it should have been decsribed: overall shape and armament, just to give readers an idea. We know in hindsight it was a Quasar Fire-class Carrier, its guns, and what it looks like.

    The only major gripe about her SW novels is that storylines set on one planet stiffles creativity. It's harder to move your cast around, to go places. If the planet is created, no problem. As was the case for Duro, with artificial cities in orbit or groundside, what can you do to describe such restricted interior?

    And BP was unbelievably boring. Randa returns; having concluded the Han/Droma partnership, the Ryn's further continuation was odd; and the plotline of course predictable. Once Kenth Hamner tells us Duro is getting no military help, how did you think the book would end?

    At that time, we get yet another dark, repetitive New Rep defeat to taste.

    And Jacen's duel with Tsavong was utterly no big deal. You think it's hard for a Jedi to combat Vong warriors . . . but see how little times someone has bothered to hurl objects at the enemy. Nooo, they go straight for hand to hand sparring, where they have no advantage at all.

    Levitate something heavy above Tsavong, drop it down hard, and the armoured Warmaster dies then and there.

    But nonetheless, Kathy hasn't written any glaring inconsistencies in characters or backgrounds, which is more than other writers have "accidentally" done. I don't like BP, but Bakura was great. Overall, she's good penning emotional arcs.
     
  18. Jedi_Liz

    Jedi_Liz Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    I think Kathy is very busy writing a new book for her Firebird series (I think that is what its called) so she hasn't been able to be here for a long time.
     
  19. Excellence

    Excellence Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2002
    Firebird, eh? Any ideas what that's about?
     
  20. Jedi_Liz

    Jedi_Liz Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    not sure if that's the correct name, but i think its a christian series of some sort. There is probably more information on her website.
     
  21. Excellence

    Excellence Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2002
    Oh. I was under the impression it was some sort of sci fi series.
     
  22. Obi-Wan's Apparition

    Obi-Wan's Apparition Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2000
    If I recall correctly, it's more of a fantasy/Christian allegory. I have wanted to read them for a really long time but haven't gotten around to them. I hear that they are really good.
     
  23. Jaya_Jade_Durron

    Jaya_Jade_Durron Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2002
    I just got done with the first two book in the Firebird series, and i think that they are great books. it is cuse of her Firebird books that got me to read BP. i enjoy Kathys work and i am glad to hear that she is writing another book for the Firebird series.
     
  24. LianaMara

    LianaMara Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2000
    Kathy's Firebird trilogy was really intriguing. It is sort of sci-fi/Christian allegory, but nothing that's really banged over your head through the whole book. Basically, the main character of the Firebird books is Lady Firebird Angelo, the wastling of the Angelo family. In Netaian culture, the wastlings (3rd and 4th children) are only allowed to stay alive until the oldest child has 2 heirs. Then, they're forced to seek an honorable death (their geis orders).

    After Lady Firebird receives her geis orders, she is sent as a fighter pilot to the Verohan system. Things happen, and she has to deal with her problems with Netaian society, and her problems with new cultures. Quite intriguing.

    Right now, Kathy's working on a novel called Sun Dust. I haven't heard much about it, except the rumor that it might be published sometime in late 2003. But that's just a rumor. :)
     
  25. jhc36

    jhc36 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2003
    i have to admit that truce at bakura was the better book by far. balance point on the other hand... well quite frankly it sucked. this is not kt bashing its my opinion of the book. at times it was confusing and without direction, and the plot was much to be desired. but then again other people loved it.
     
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