Discussion in 'Fan Films, Fan Audio & SciFi 3D' started by DaftMaul, Mar 1, 2002.
How much longer for the voting ???
Good to see you're as on the ball as ever JT.
Thanks Daft. You would not BELIEVE how many people mess my name up.
Thanks for adding the latest clip, I wish I could say it was done in Axogon, but it wasn't. I've never been very proficient with Axogon sabers, others are much better than I at it.
Clip 'N', as it is called, was done in AE with Ryan W's method.
when do we find out who did what?
Daft already posted a link to that (on page 6, I think).
[link=http://www.theforce.net/theater//postproduction/saberresults.html]OFFICIAL LIGHTSABER COMPETITION RESULTS[/link]
I'm so surprised how anyone was able to make AlamDV look that bad - no really!
A few of our users told me about this competition and its a great idea. Some of the effects here are just as good as those in the StarWars films. I was just really shocked by the AlamDV entry, it looks terrible. You can set the glow to whatever value you want and for some reason in the movie it is se to like 5 pixels when it should be about 15 to 20 like the others.
I would really like the chance to show that our program can create fantastic lightswords. People can visit the Cinema at www.Alamdv.com for 100's of examples but I would like to go further.
If you (the person running the competition)could send me the sample footage I will add the effects and send it back to you within 30mins. Or, if you would like, I will ask one of the 100's of AlamDV users to do it over night.
I understand the competition is over and I respect the beautiful work done in fantastic programs like AfterEffects and Photoshop.
I would just like to be able to show the normal (not even the best) level of output from AlamDV and how quick it is compared to other methods.
That would be good. At the moment poor old ALAM DV is looking a little sad compared with any other offerings (no offense StupidFilms ). [link=http://www.stormahead.com/images/TFN_promo.mov]Here[/link] is the clip you need. PM me when it is finished or just post the URL on the thread here (probably easier) and I'll get it posted on the competition thread soon.
Wow, you guys are quick. I was just off to bed so I checked and BOOM
It would seem that there are some AlamDV users online in our chat room - I'll ask them if they feel like a challenge!
I downloaded the clip and tried rotoscoping it for fun, my only problem is because it's at 15fps, when I make it a filmstrip, it becomes really jumpy. When I looked at the rotoscoped clips they are still 15fps. How did you guys get it so its not really jumpy?
thanks for any help.
An AlamDV user here.
I would've had my own version of it uploaded by now, but unfortunately Premiere is being particularly uncooperative tonight. It wouldn't accept the TFN_promo.mov file...
However, the actual effects work in AlamDV took about 15 minutes, which I thought was pretty painless.
The clip will be uploaded ASAP, once Premiere has stopped having a strop.
We all had a go, but Tarn was the quickest at 15mins. I've put his movie on our server so check it out - I might finish mine but I'll wait to see how the other AlamDV users did first.
Still 15mins must be some kind of record - well done Tarn!
[link=http://www.csb-digital.com/alamdvquicktest.mov]Tarn's Lightsaber Movie[/link]
Always annoying when other people are better than you in the program that you created! Heh
Yeah...that's more like the ALAMDV work I'm used to seeing. Thanks for posting that clip up!
That's more like it.
As can be seen, ALAMdv does quick work of reasonable quality if you know how to use it.
Still, the control is lousy. In around five frames the tips of the effects fell short of the tips of the stunt props -- in one or two of the frames, this was the case with BOTH sabers. The feathering on the glows is almost nonexistent, it just kind of stops.
There were also a few examples of a phenomena I've noticed with ALAMdv that doesn't have any logical reason for it. The white core extends the full length, but the glow stops, leaving maybe a quarter or fifth of glowless core starting with the emitter.
The cores display an odd sort of serration. I'd like to blame that on post-roto compression, but I've seen it before with ALAM so I'm not sure that's the case.
The width and intensity of the glows kept changing.
In the last frame, the glow doesn't go all the way around the tip of the blue saber.
Better, but could still use work. The idea behind it is good, and I have to admit the work gets done pretty quick, but a lot of quality gets sacrificed for speed and cost-efficiency (remember the triangle? Pick two). For backyard duels, just stuff for poop and giggles, ALAMdv all the way, sure. Once you get serious about spending time and money on something you really want to do up right, ALAMdv just won't cut it anymore.
Maybe someday it will reach that point, but it's far from it at the moment.
That looks a bit better. Any chance of someone posting a clip with one blue saber and one green saber? Then I'll post another ALAMDV clip along with the others.
Thanks for the comments.
As for the problems noted with my clip by Dorkman Scott, they are indeed all due to the speed with which I did it. I just wanted to put something together as quickly as possible (hey, it was about 3am, ok!).
If I were doing lightsabre effects for either a proper project, or if I had been entering the clip for the competition, I would have taken a little longer to do it than 15 minutes.
However, for quarter-of-an-hour of non-intensive work, I think the results are pretty damned good.
Hopefully somebody else will spend longer using AlamDV on the clip and show how good the program can be when used to its full potential.
Regarding the effects falling short of the stunt props - well, that's entirely my fault, due to my dodgy eyesight, nowt to do with the program!
And one of the major plus points of AlamDV is that these kind of things are very easy to fix once you've spotted them.
I'll see if we can get one done today in the other colors. I didn't think the competition was about how exactly the lightswords were placed - just the quality of the lightsword.
If we use the same colors we can make it look exactly like the Photoshop examples. The sabers look a little dead without clashes and/or sparks - both of which take only seconds to add in AlamDV. With all these effects included, and fine tuning the lightsword to perfection the whole clip would take under 45mins.
It depends if you want to spend hours in AfterEffects or Photoshop. The AlamDV1/2 movies are normally more fluid than Photoshop ones, and AlamDV2 can do much of the tweening for you (although the frame-by-frame method is still the best if you ask me).
One thing is for sure - the quality of lightswords in fan films is getting damn good. Its great to see everyone giving George a run for him money. If you would like to see some people that have taken their time with our lightswords then visit our web site http://www.alamdv.com and the cinema section.
There is also another point I would like to make. If you don't like our lightsword then you can just change the image files they are created from - make the glow more smooth, change the shape of the saber tip. So you can make your perfect lightsword then use AlamDV to place them in minutes, not hours.
We are also online in a chat room on the web site constantly to try and help you out in creating better lightswords. Come and see us, tell us what you want changed and we will do it.
We made AlamDV for Fan Film makers - if its not quite right then we will change it straight away. We also have other sorts of lightswords effects (flickering ones and odd colour combinations) come and check them out and tell us what you want.
That's pretty good then considering. Obviously as this competition was to choose the forums 'favourite' clip it is all important that the finished results look as good as possible. This time there where no prizes for finishing first. I hope one of the other ALAM DV people can create a clip (using blue and green sabres ) that really shows what ALAM DV can do, rather than what ALAM DV can do really quickly.
15 minutes is very impressive though, it certainly seems to be a package to look at if speed of completion is your number 1 priority.
EDIT: ALAM posted inbetween Tarns post and mine ALAM, personally I didn't think that green and blue where the ideal colour combination either, but it was important to create a level playing field so people can compare results like for like. As I said, if one of your forum members could spend as long as they like creating their best effort (without contact flashes) then that would be great, obviously speed is important in reality, but not in this particular 'competition'
I look forward to seeing another (green and blue) clip soon.
I've checked my mail box this morning and it would seem a few AlamDV users have given the footage a try.
The one that is most like those in the competition is from our longtime user AverageJoe. He was trying at the same time as Tarn, but finished about 10mins later.
Still, not bad for 25mins work.
Hope this is ok for the competition.
[link=http://www.csb-digital.com/lightswordtest2.mov]New Lightsword Movie Test[/link] by AverageJoe
wow thoes 2 new clips restored my faith in alam DV.
the only nitpicky thing i have to say about it now is that if you look closley it sort of bleads into the background, espicaily over the wondow. the blade looks to get slightly thicker over the grey parts. but you really cant notice it till you slow the footage down.
all in all good work.
Good, I'm sure that was worth doing. I assume the latest clip was done using ALAM DV 2? I have posted the results along with the other clips [link=http://www.theforce.net/theater//postproduction/saberresults.html]here[/link] for you.
Now that's the type of quality I keep hearing comes from ALAM DV, but haven't seen!
I still think I'll stick with Axogon, however, since the results still work well, and, plus, it's free.
You know what ... I gotta say something.
Although StupidFilmsInc's lightsaber contest submission may not have been the best one of the bunch, I think it was kind of inconsiderate and rude of AlamDV to come out and say "I'm so surprised how anyone was able to make AlamDV look that bad - no really! . . . . . I was just really shocked by the AlamDV entry, it looks terrible."
I mean .... at least someone thought enough of AlamDV to give it a TRY.
Moreover, StupidFilmsInc should not be insulted like this ... especially considering her took the time to actually ENTER the contest. Granted, the sabers could have looked better, but I mean, c'mon ... give the kid a break. You could have said something like . . . I would like the chance to deomnstrate AlamDV's full potential - or something along those lines.
Look ... I FULLY understand that member, AlamDV has a vested interest in demonstrating the potential of his product ... and I support that. I just think that he could have shown a little bit more courtesy to StupidFilmsInc for giving it a try and utilizing the program in the first place.
No hard feelings either way ... just my constructive opinion.
I have to agree with my learned collegue here. I personally was anxious to have an ALAM DV entry in the competition, and I thanked him for being the only ALAM DV user to actually make the effort to complete a clip on time.
Sorry if I said the wrong thing. I was just shocked when several users all ran over to tell me what was going on.
Different people animate lightsabers in different ways and StupidFilmsInc could have made the lightswords glow like that for a good reason. I just wanted people to compare like for like, fat glow for fat glow
Sorry StupidFilmsInc if I have insulted you in anyway. Thanks for giving AlamDV a contender here from the start. I think you have used AlamDV1 in your footage which means you either don't like AlamDV2 or you got it free on a magazine promotion. If the latter is true then please accept a free copy of AlamDV2 as a way of an appology for me rushing in head first.
Thanks for the positive comments. We will probably be releasing an new version of AlamDV1 as a free download in the near future so keep an eye on the site.
Please post some method that I can contact you by so to give you your serial...