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The Official The Clone Wars Series Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by HedecGa, Jan 30, 2008.

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  1. Havac

    Havac Former Moderator star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 29, 2005
    Well, for one thing, "It's happened before" isn't a justification for it happening again. It's an excuse, which isn't the same thing at all. But on the topic of your question, I think there are a couple ways this is different. For one, I don't think anyone really expected the PT to line up perfectly with the old EU. We knew something would get trampled on. It came with the territory. This, however, is different, in that it's EU pushing aside pretty much brand-new EU. It lacks the "Well, of course George hasn't read I, Jedi," factor. It messes badly with the way people thought things were, and it messes with the brand new bill of goods people thought they were sold with the Clone Wars multimedia blitz. It's like taking the NJO and going back in and adding Luke's super-special apprentice Floyd behind the scenes and wedged into the cracks. That's another aspect: it reeks of Mary Sueness, and that's not a word I use lightly. Oh, look, it's Big Hero Anakin's cute, scantily-clad adolescent apprentice! What, Anakin and Obi-Wan weren't enough? There weren't enough stories to tell in the Clone Wars? You had to invent a cutesy character to follow the heroes around for six months despite never being seen anywhere before? It just begs the question of why? Why invent this character to shoehorn in when there's no real pressing need to do so and it throws the fundamental nature of what we knew about Anakin, Obi-Wan, Anakin's relationship with the Council, his status as a Jedi, his mindset, his motivations, into turmoil?

    Like I said, I'm willing to give it a shot, but this just seems like a rather shallow, silly decision that's going to screw with a lot of the dynamics established by the existing canon, and I've seen nothing to contradict that impression. I mean, it would be one thing if she were Obi-Wan's apprentice, taken on after Anakin graduated. That would be a weird insertion, but it wouldn't have the same effect of reshaping the context we see a character in (which I think can be a good thing, when handled well, but I've yet to see evidence that it will be handled well and I think worrying here is legitimate). I don't think panic is warranted, no, a
     
  2. Jango_Fettish

    Jango_Fettish Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 17, 2002
    Well, at least now Vader's secret apprentice doesn't seem like such a silly idea anymore :p

    And we may as well throw out the notion of Anakin being knighted 6 months before ROTS. This series has long been expected to take place around mid war, at least that has been deducted in past threads going by what we have been shown. I believe the presence of Phase I clone armor makes it earlier than 6 months, anyway.

    Maybe Anakin takes on a Padawan while he is still a Padawan himself [face_cow]
     
  3. QuentinGeorge

    QuentinGeorge Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 12, 2003
    I don't think you're correct. In nearly every single retcon in the EU, the retcon is the one that throws out the least established EU lore. In other words, the existing timeline will remain, but it will be fudged a little and some things "explained".
     
  4. IcePirate

    IcePirate Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Jul 13, 2005
    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/RX-24 :D


    :eek: spoil3rz! jk.

    i'm trying to imagine what that kind of lovechild would look like... knowing that the ese is human... or really human looking, holmes can't be that kid.
     
  5. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    I'm not exactly thrilled about this, but even if it all ended up being a big, glaring continuity hole for the foreseeable future...so what? I'm past the point where I can conceive of anything being the "last straw" continuity error - as if the books on my shelf will all burst into flames someday. They never did explain why Anakin thought Ventress was dead in Obsession if he ran into her in the Boba Fett books - and from the look of it, will probably be seeing her again in the TV series - and I've been sleeping just fine, thank you. Obnoxious as they are, there will never not be errors, so we might as well get better at ignoring them.

    And now, on to the more important question - during exactly what span of time was Jabba a lady??
     
  6. Tam_Elgrin

    Tam_Elgrin Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 1, 2004
    And now, on to the more important question - during exactly what span of time was Jabba a lady??

    [face_laugh] Odds are he's some sort of sub-race of Hutts who can breed, or something silly, if the whole "Jabba's son" thing plays out in the end.

    Much like Havac said, the whole Anakin had a padawan! thing is silly, but has potential and isn't the end of the world. Stuff like Anakin becoming a Knight in the middle of the war and so on (yes, I know these are only rumours at this point.. ) are slightly more worrying, but hey, what can we do? I know the high-ups'll say "imagine as if you're seeing the story through a foggy window", but I wish they'd at least try to give us something unified behind the window.

    Maybe they can retroactivley (and discreetly) stick an Infinities sticker on this series, if it causes a whole lotta mess :p George'd never have to know..

    Ah well. It was the last Clone Wars series that drove me to the pick-n-choose continuity ghetto (I say pick-n-choose, I just ignore most of Clone Wars season 2), and I think it'll be this series that makes me glad of it.
     
  7. QuentinGeorge

    QuentinGeorge Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 12, 2003
    Sub-race? I thought all Hutts could breed. They just needed to grow breasts and get their feminine side going on.
     
  8. LtNOWIS

    LtNOWIS Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 19, 2005
    The same reason they never mentioned Ventress, or Durge, or Jabiim, or anything else from the Clone Wars EU?
     
  9. SuperWatto

    SuperWatto Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2000
    Which brings us to the next question.

    Why does LFL keep introducing doomed characters?
     
  10. Tam_Elgrin

    Tam_Elgrin Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 1, 2004
    I thought Hutts got magically pregnant and then turned into a woman after giving birth?

    And here I sound like a toddler trying to explain where babies come from. Hutt babies. [face_blush]
     
  11. Jmacq1

    Jmacq1 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 20, 2005
    None of those people were Anakin's Padawan.

    Why is it that people suddenly seem to think that having a Padawan is just a casual, ships-that-pass-in-the-night relationship?

    We know Anakin has severe attachment issues.

    We know that a Master/Padawan relationship is by design a close bond.

    Unless they're seriously altering Anakin's character, having a Padawan and losing a Padawan should be deeply affecting for him. If she dies, he'd take it as a serious personal failure, regardless of whether it was his fault or not. The kind of thing that would haunt him at least until he flips to the Dark Side, and maybe beyond.

    Unless he has about the most uncaring master/student bond in the history of the Jedi Order (which would again be pretty out of character for Anakin), this should be a Really Big Deal(tm) for Anakin no matter how you slice it. We're talking about adding someone to that very short list of people that Anakin considers the "important people" in his life (Padme, Palpatine, and Obi-Wan prior to this).

    I'm not saying that it's impossible to retcon this in. I'm just saying that it's going to ring hollow if she is in fact officially Anakin Skywalker's Padawan Learner. It's a slighly bigger deal than technicalities about who taught who. They're introducing a major new character into a segment of the timeline that's been fairly well-defined and laid-out already. Yeah, there's a fair amount of "open space" in the three years of the Clone Wars, but there ain't that much.
     
  12. SuperWatto

    SuperWatto Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2000
    Hey, for the people who can squeeze Allegiance and Mindor into an era that has been documented for over 25 years, anything is possible.
     
  13. Obilieveinme

    Obilieveinme Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2005
    The Clone Wars spread people very thin...Obi-wan and Anakin are a team that can't be torn apart. I think he just couldn't be with her so a bond wasn't forged...Kind of a one day I will get to work with my master type of thing.

    Was Obi-Wan done taking a Padawan.
     
  14. Arawn_Fenn

    Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 2, 2004
    How do we know these things didn't happen just because we didn't see them on-screen?
     
  15. Jango_Fettish

    Jango_Fettish Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 17, 2002
    The fact that Yoda refers to all the students in his class in AOTC as Padawans, as well as Dooku, implies that Yoda sees all students in his classes as his Padawans. And besides, Ben said in ESB Yoda instructed him. Yoda instructed all the Jedi at one point when they were younglings, so thats close enough. We get an on screen indication.

    Still, I feel that most people are jumping the gun. I mean, TOS says that Ahsoka is trying to prove herself to Anakin. Maybe Anakin doesn't want an apprentice (fearing too many close people to him risks exposing Padme) and he just doesn't like the girl. So what ever happens to her he just never thinks about her.

    Or everyone could wait and see how this all plays out, but that is asking way too much of SW fans ;)
     
  16. Arawn_Fenn

    Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 2, 2004
    They are padawans. Still, this does not preclude the possibility that Yoda trained a few older students ( namely Obi-Wan and Dooku ) during the years immediately preceding the prequels.

    If Anakin is to be given a padawan, they had better make it clear that this happens after he is knighted.[face_worried]
     
  17. Fichu-Sorrenessi

    Fichu-Sorrenessi Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    May 19, 2006
    In the trailer over at Starwars at the very end there is someone sitting next to Anakin in the co-pilots seat just as they go into hyperspace. Could that be his apprentice? Her head is just visible above the seat and if I had to guess at it I'd say that's a Togruta. Anyone else notice that!
     
  18. TalonCard

    TalonCard •Author: Slave Pits of Lorrd •TFN EU Staff star 5 VIP

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2001
    If Ahsoka really is Anakin's Padawan, it's true that it would kind of grate against what had been previously established. But then, no one would have thought Vader had built C-3PO either. In ten years, I'm sure we'll have all maner of retcons, flashbacks, etc., and it will be an accepted fact and virtually a non-issue. Ahsoka is the new Padme, in that she's a major character who has never been mentioned before, but will soon be so well integrated that new fans will have a hard time grasping the fact that Anakin, at one time, seemed to have never had an apprentice.

    Mind you, I may have to keep reminding myself of this fact, but we'll get through it...hey, the show might even be good too. ;)

    TC
     
  19. Quinnocent-Till-Sith

    Quinnocent-Till-Sith Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jul 21, 2004
    [image=http://images.wikia.com/starwars/images/c/c5/Rik%27s_Cantina2.jpg]

    The Circus Horrificus Picture Show at Jabba's Palace? ;)
     
  20. LtNOWIS

    LtNOWIS Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 19, 2005
    Well, it doesn't need to be a "real" master-padawan relationship. It could just be like with him and Ki-Adi-Mundi. Remember, Anakin has known a lot of dead Jedi in the Clone Wars. It weighs on him greatly.
     
  21. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    Just because she's not mentioned doesn't mean people didn't know she existed. So, she doesn't come up in conversation...so what? Perhaps part of the reason Anakin assumes he'll be made a master is because he's trained a padawan, already.
     
  22. jedimasterED

    jedimasterED Moderator Emeritus star 4 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 10, 1999
    I agree, Matt. Everyone, read my sig. I rest my case. ;)
     
  23. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    My point exactly.

    Obi-Wan's statements of Yoda being THE Jedi that instructed HIM, not a Jedi instructor in general, seems to imply a closer relationship. However, as another poster said, it's "good enough." We're willing to accept an explanation that doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense because, well, it's the only one we have. Obi-Wan never served Bail Organa, but they have a loose association, so okay, it's "good enough."

    Why are we suddenly unable to take Ahsoka in this same vein?
     
  24. Darth_Sabith

    Darth_Sabith Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 17, 2006
    Actually it goes

    Yoda-Doku-Qui-con-Obi-wan- Anakin....
     
  25. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    Let's do the Kessel Run again!
     
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