The Official The Force Unleashed (Novel & Graphic Novel) Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Explosive Decompression.
It consists of two main facets, which are-
-Decompression
-That is Explosive!

No, seriously, I had to turn the game off for a while after that scene. There was just no way Starkiller should've been able to survive. And then Kota was still bloody alive, too! At least they had the common courtesy to imply that the man's eyes exploded like rotting melons.

If they were going to have Sith alchemy or whatever, you'd think they'd say something or mention it somewhere in the narrative, because otherwise the cognitive dissonance (as in, "Hey, didn't you get hurled out of a viewport into naked space?") is simply too overwhelming to overcome.

Gah!

 

As we've seen a number of times, vacuum in the GFFA is rather lazy compared to the version we have over here. Sound can travel through it, among other things.

It could actually be argued that the most common sci-fi description of what happens to organic material thrown into space is that they freeze solid (which is not really true...) and that seems to the general line in SW as well, see Clone Wars episode two for an example.

Otherwise, you could argue that Starkiller might be using the Force subconsciously to keep himself pressurized...

 

I'm sorry, but I didn't read the novel, and didn't look to see that the thread's title showing that the thread's about the novel and comic, not the actual game.
So if there's some narrative that makes it all make sense that's in those two media, but not the game, then I apologize for jumping the gun.
If not, then it's still sloppy storytelling, for making the reader/player jump through mental hoops to try and figure out how the plot hasn't come to a screeching halt.
....
I'm trying not to sound like a jerk-sorry if I am.
...
You know, since Starkiller got run all the way through by a lightsaber-meaning that there's a charred hole going from back to front-shouldn't his guts have been pulled out by the vacuum suction?
This story's gonna make my head explode.

 

No, this is one of the things that irked me as well. I kept waiting for some further explanation for this, but no such thing...
Since lightsabers cauterizes wounds, that part wouldn't necessarily be more exposed than anything else. His bodily fluids should start to boil and rip his cells apart anyway. But, as I said, it doesn't work that way is SW.

 

I cling to that Uli.
I hope that is the truth of it.
No more. No less.


Otherwise...


MAAAAAAAAAAJOR LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAME-Oh.

 

Those with problems with surviving in space should read this thread.

 

That's good and all but it doesn't fully explain it. And it's not just being thrown in outerspace, it's all his other injuries + being thrown in outerspace.
And yes the movies do show that a lightsaber trough the stomach is lethal.
Three jedimasters were killed by Sidious, one or two weren't even trough the gut, just a slash. Qui-gon died shortly after receiving his injury, which can not be compared with Starkiller, he was begging Vader and his body was broken in the following joy-ride(banging against walls,bending in different directions), all that + being thrown in space = dead.

 

Yes, he should be dead. Yes, jedi have died from injuries much less severe...

But remember that the one supposedly killing him didn't want to kill him, not even close! The entire thing was staged! Vader had every opportunity to direct his lightsaber past vital organs, hold back just enough with his Force pushes and most important keep salvage droids nearby to pick up the body.

 

True, it was all acting for Vader and Sidious, still Starkiller's screams did suggest that it still hurt like hell. And Vader's strike seemed to be right in a dangerous vital areas, not in the shoulder or something. Right trough the gut, a lightsaber leaves a big hole in your stomach, the organs it hits are destroyed. Either way i'm still hopeful that Vader has learned certain new Sith powers, it would add to his legend. And it does make more sense with the way it's told in the novel, Starkiller no longer having his past scars and such.

 

Sound can't travel through vacuum in Star Wars any more than it can here. Whether the explanation for why we hear it in movies is "aural sensors" or "extra-diegetic, like the music" is a matter of personal taste?I prefer the latter, personally?but as sources like Exile show, there isn't any actual sound there.

Also, the "explosive" in "explosive decompression" has to do with how fast the decompression takes; it's not a reference to what happens to the body. Kota was blinded because a lightsaber was shoved into his eyes.

 

Just to make it clear, "explosive decompression" is a myth, at least when it comes to going from one atmosphere of pressure to zero. Nobody is going to "explode" when thrown in space, and it's not that unlikely you could be revived after spending a whole minute or more in hard vacuum.

Also just to make it clear, Star Wars is and always has been cheesy space fantasy. Quite a number of things about the Star Wars franchise as seen on screen are either impossible or just ridiculously silly and unlikely. That is part of its charm, and what makes it fun. The EU has had wildly varying tones at varying times, and some authors have *tried* to write more "realistic" military sci-fi in Star Wars, and that, too, is charming (although part of the charm is how quixotic it all is, like putting lipstick on a pig).

So, y'know. MST3K Mantra. We should really, really just relax about these things.

And yes, I know the excuses for "sound in space". I know the heavy retcons that are done on these things in the EU, and the fact that you can make them kind of work doesn't make them not retcons. The description of the Kessel Run to fix Han Solo's "parsec" comment was a retcon fix. The description of Count Dooku's vessel so that the solar sail on it is nothing like and works nothing like a real solar sail is a retcon fix. All the brouhaha in one direction or another about the 3 million clones is a retcon fix.

And saying that the sounds audible in cockpits are some kind of computer sensor system -- a very, very cute idea, I admit, but still silly and ridiculous in terms of practicality -- is a retcon fix. Calling them non-diegetic isn't *even* a retcon, it's just making an excuse for the movie. (Like saying that the reason Boba Fett isn't dead is that no one actually caught Boba's "real" death on film and the Boba Fett death scene is a dramatization inserted by the makers of this "historical documentary".) And it does nothing to explain Jango's weapons in AotC that are clearly meant by the movie to be seen as sonic charges of some kind (and retconned out by EU writers worried about realism) nor the fact that Han and Leia walk around on an asteroid wearing only oxygen masks, despite the fact that it's completely impossible that this asteroid has enough gravity to walk normally or to maintain a pressurized atmosphere.

 

The sonic charges (or seismic charges, depending on what source you look at) got a pretty silly treatment in the EU, when the New Essential Guide to Weapons and Technology tried to explain their effects by saying that when they exploded they created a vacuum... in space.

Also, I forget if it's just fan speculation, but one possible reason why Han and Leia could walk around outside the Falcon was that the ship extended its artificial gravity out beyond the hull.

So, yeah. Plenty of retcons in the EU.

 

The artificial gravity is the least problematic part. The more interesting question is why Han and Leia aren't undergoing decompression (if not "explosive" decompression) because of the total lack of pressure around them. Unless the Falcon also pumps out gas to fill the gravity field whenever it lands.

 

Vacuum you say? Well now, put that together with sounds in space, and we have undeniable proof that there genuinely is air in Star Wars space!

Presumably nothing much stops Vader having been doing some Force wizardry to keep Starkiller alive either. Even if Starkiller himself was too beat up to maintain an air bubble when he flew out the window, Vader could have been doing it for him for all we know.

 

Could it be that seismic charges are primarly ground weapons not space weapons.

 

Yes. That is obviously how they are intended to work. The problem is that Jango Fett *does* use them in space and they *do* work in space.

And this means that any explanation of how they work that's based on physical vibrations (vibrations through the air if they're "sonic" charges, vibrations through the earth if they're "seismic" charges) is Bpants because in space there's nothing to transmit vibrations.

The retcon that they "create a vacuum in space" is... so totally the opposite of what a plausible retcon would've been -- like, literally 180 degrees in the opposite direction of what they needed to say -- that it almost feels like an intentional joke.

 

Well, those vibrations are clearly in subspace.

Magic technobabble I don't have much of a problem with. However, there are sources that confirm there isn't "really" sound in space; I mentioned Exile, which has the Falcon approaching a docking bay, and only once it enters atmosphere can Lando hear it.

I don't really have a problem with this, since the reason they're in there is entirely cinematic. There's no diegetic reason for them, it's simply that sounds in space are just cool. I don't think there's any more need to explain or accept them as "real" than there is for music, credits, or the opening crawl. I disagree that Boba's "death" is a good comparison, though; the characters interact with that, and it is clearly within the movie's universe.

I mean, there's a fine line here. On the one hand, it's silly to try to explain why Luke's saber looks so weird in the latest DVD release as something in-universe; on the flip side, though, it would be just as silly to say that Luke is wielding a blaster there and the lightsaber is just a movie convention. No one actually interacts with sounds in space, though, so I have no problem filing it away under "movie".

 

You know, we can solve both the "explosive decompression" and "how does this kid beat Vader AND the Emperor?" arguments by saying that everything that occurs in the game after Starky was thrown through the window was just the dreamings of his mind as he "walked toward the light." This is supported by the fact that the last thing The Apprentice "sees" is a blinding flash of light eminating from The Emperor's hands.

 

I highly suspected I would not like this book, and my fears were realized when I finally picked it up from the library. What an incredibly poor effort from an author I have enjoyed in the past. Perhaps Sean Williams is not completely to blame, maybe this is what LFL was looking for, a direct representation of a video game into novel form. Jumping from level to level like Mario brothers...its just certainly not what I am looking for.

I just don't have the words to describe how much I disliked the book, it boggles my mind And to think that Force Heretic:Remnant is one of my favorite Star Wars novels ever.....

Proxy, and his Kato to Inspector Clouseau persona was the only thing I actually enjoyed in the two hundred pages I read. Because I refuse to finish the novel I will be unable to give it a ranking in the review forum, but my score based on what I actually read would be 1 out of 10, and I've never rated a Star Wars novel that low, even stuff like the Crystal Star and Planet of Twilight would recieve way better marks than that.

Order 66 survivors are apparently abundant in the galaxy, and Vader knows where they all are. He trains a super-apprentice to hunt them down, which said apprentice does with ease, blasting Force lightning everywhere he goes because Sith learn that skill in grade school....Really though, even Sith guards can shoot and deflect the lightning with ease..its no longer a special skill, just an everyday thing any evil Force Using character can do

The characters read with no emotion, no feeling as the plot rushed from one battle scene to the next, because goodness forbid a chapter is taken to do some character development.

This makes me wanna go re-read the Glove of Darth Vader trilogy just so I can try and figure out which one I liked less....I just can't believe they published this book.

 

We've known this for ages, really (though I agree that it's sad that it's become such an easy technique). I'm more annoyed by the constant use of "Sith lightning" over "Force lightning" (the former being something I *would* like to see remain hard to do)... even when Rhett has ostensibly gone to the light side.

D'oh.

Everyone being able to deflect it is rather stupid though, yeah.

 

I was watching the TFU cutscenes yesterday, was wondering about a few things.
(disclaimer: I haven't own nor have I played the game. This is just from the cutscenes I've viewed on youtube.)
1) Do Bail and the others know they're on DSI? If they were thrown into a shuttle after being captured on Corellia, and don't see anything but the interior of the station before being rescued by the Rogue Shadow, what's to say it's just another space station to them?
caveat?
2) In the scene of Marek and Vader's duel on the DS, it looks like the superlaser was firing (green beams outside the windows)? Was this the destruction of Despayre?

 

One of the NJO books, and the ANH audio drama says that Star Wars ships use "audio interpreters"

Did anyone catch the part in the TFU campaign guide that says the Corellian Treaty was started in a secret meeting on Corellia and finished on Kashyyyk? That would seem to answer our question about that bit of continuity. They are aware of that problem and that is their answer.

 

the answer to your first question is we don't know. after the cutscene on corellia the next time we see bail & co is when the emperor is telling them that they will be executed.

in regards to the second, i don't think so. during the DS level we keep going through the firing tubes of the station, and they are firing at regular intervals. it must be some kind of test. the emperor was in the station so they must be making a demonstration.

EDIT: oh and add to that that we keep hearing an imperial officer on a p.a. system announcing some kind of test firing. don't remember the exact words.

 

Okay, that's what I thought. If he thinks its just another space station or moon base, it could be a possible fix for the "Bail being on DSI 2 years before he learns about it" situation;
but still does nothing for "Palps knows who the Reb leaders are but takes no action against them." That bugs me.

 

yeah i agree with you on the first one. about the second one i, in my personal canon, have him wait until the Death Star is complete to kill them all in one strike. even if some rebels escaped they wouldn't have the manpower to destroy it. Unless they robbed it's plans countless times. And had the son of the best starpilot in the galaxy flying with them