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Lit The Official The Old Republic: Revan Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Rogue_Follower, Nov 23, 2011.

  1. AlyxDinas

    AlyxDinas Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 2010
    Haha. Fair enough. I mean, I can't say that sitting around and arguing whether or not discussion about if something is "ugly" is too fruitful. Ugly being a subjective thing anyway. For me, I definitely think the root of the issue is the "Meetra" part. Oh well. What is, is.
     
  2. Arawn_Fenn

    Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 2, 2004
    [image=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/61/Djangofilm.jpg]
     
  3. Genghis12

    Genghis12 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 18, 1999
    Lucas made the right decision there. See, J'mee sounds stupid. But Jango works. Maybe the Old Republic should have followed Lucas on its use of "Mee" names.
     
  4. GrandMasterKatarn

    GrandMasterKatarn Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 8, 2008
    The name "Meetra Surik" took away the mystery that was Jedi Exile. Now, she's just random over-powered Jedi #666180. Yeah, I read the book and I still don't like the name change or anything about it. It was too short, nothing seemed logical (Revan marrying Bastila for one) and it was way too rushed. I felt sorry for Jedi Exile. Her death was meaningless and seemed like Drew just swept her under the rugs cos she outshined Revan in a better game.
     
  5. Zorrixor

    Zorrixor Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Heh... a review I just read on Audible made me chuckle.

    It complaints about how "the Jedi exile comes out of this book as the heroic character that Revan should have been". [face_laugh]

    Talk about the total opposite reading to most people here. :p
     
  6. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Who cares? Point is that ?Luke Skywalker? is a standard for Star Wars names that serves to undercut the notion that any given author is straight-jacketed into coming up with something particularly alien, exotic or otherwise "different" for a "SW feel".

    Despite your earlier insinuation, "Alison" -- or some variant thereof -- is just as suitable a name for SW as "Meetra". (I wouldn't go with either for the Exile, mind you)

    "Alison Smith" would, I think, be going too far? but ?Alison/Alyson Antilles? would look no more out of place than ?Owen Lars? or ?Ben Kenobi?.

    I really don?t care whether or not the name fits the universe. It sounds crap to my ear and looks horrible on the page. I "protest" (it's hardly the end of the world) on those grounds and no other.

    If the link to the vedic "Mitra" was deliberate then I can certainly appreciate that genuine thought went into it... but it still doesn't work for me as a whole.
     
  7. Shadowstalker

    Shadowstalker Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Jul 5, 2001
    Mind you, Alyson Antilles might have been better, but the whole feel of the story would be different:

    "Alyson's back in her most exciting adventure of all. Watch as Alyson Antilles joins with two men and a Droid to do the Sith Empire. Watch as her latest outing features hot Jedi-on-Sith AND hot Sith-on-Sith action. You'll watch the climax over and over again as Alyson finally takes it from behind. Don't miss it!"

    If that's the route then what about Destiny Way, Dana Darkside, Jenna Jangos, or Jenna Haazen?
     
  8. Zorrixor

    Zorrixor Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    While it's far from my favourite name, I'm not particularly put off by Meetra, personally.

    When we've previously had [link=http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Meeba]Meebas[/link], [link=http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Meebo]Meebos[/link], [link=http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Meego]Meegos[/link] and [link=http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Meekah_Hozard]Meekahs[/link], there's very little that surprises me anymore. :p
     
  9. Manisphere

    Manisphere Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 25, 2007
    Meetra is nowhere as bad as Javul. Javul Charn is the holostar in Shadow Games. The woman sounds like a shovel.
     
  10. Zorrixor

    Zorrixor Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Ja wohl.
     
  11. CeiranHarmony

    CeiranHarmony Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2004
    some names only sound bad when spoken in english language :p pronounce them with foreign accents or language as basis and they suddendly become pretty cool!

    still, I too dislike Meetra as a name but get used to it.
     
  12. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    i think her death could have been written better, certainly, but we can't blame the author for killing her, nor for revan's fate; i think it likely his hands were tied by the backstory developed for the upcoming MMORPG in both cases; i daresay in the game we will run across the exile's force spirit

    what really shocked me was that the latter half of the book was less than a year after KOTOR2 and the Jedi Council had ALREADY been re-established on Coruscant! [cf. meetra's comments that she had left HK-47 in their custody after KOTOR2, and he had escaped]

    hearing Kreia's prophecy i had the impression re-establishing the council would be Mical's ultimate, distant fate, an accomplishment after years of work; yet apparently in a few months this little padawan ACCOMPLISHED MASTERHOOD and so did 11 other jedi...huh?
     
  13. Zorrixor

    Zorrixor Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    I always used to think the same thing, too. In retrospect, though, now that I think about it, someone had to run the show and put Humpty Dumpty back together again, so I can understand why it makes sense for Mical et al to quickly establish an interim council until the Jedi Order was stable again, rather than just leaving everybody running around like headless chickens without any idea what to do.

    I can see the benefit of them basically having gone back to Coruscant as soon as they could, sending out a message to all surviving Jedi still in hiding that the Jedi Temple is open for business, and for them all to please return home to rebuild. Without any existing chain of command, I can picture a sort of informal "round table" kind of thing to start with, with them only sorting out electing a Grand Master or whatever a few years later once they'd sorted the basics out and fixed the roof from falling out.
     
  14. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Hopefully the "grand master" comes a couple of centuries down the line, after they're again falling into their silly "no attachment" ways. That the Jedi have a "Grand Master" in any sense beyond an honorific is one of the worst decisions ever made. Curse Dark Nest.

    Though it's useful in that it provides a quick, easy way in which to judge whether or not a particular incarnation of the Jedi Order isn't working properly.

     
  15. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2000
    Theoretically, that's the way it works. Yoda gets overruled in TPM after all.
     
  16. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Yoda is an example of "Grand Master as an honorary position", though, where it's clear that he's just the first amongst equals. There's very little sense of it being particularly formal.

    Luke, conversely, is Jedi Dictator. It's absolutely atrocious and flies in the face of what the Jedi should stand for. (In DNT, at least, he acknowledges this. In FotJ, he's all giddy at the thought of Ben one day being Grand Master. It's sickening.)
     
  17. Manisphere

    Manisphere Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 25, 2007
    It doesn't come off as bad as it probably should because his Jedi actually need him badly. Look how they function without him. I do wonder though if Luke thinks the Jedi depend on him for far too much. He hasn't really gone into that with his flock. Personally, I didn't think of him as "Jedi Dictator" until both Anakin and Jacen were gone.
     
  18. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    That's why it's a problem. Like I said, it serves to underscore that his order is a failure. His Jedi need him badly... because they're written to need him badly. Which means they're written really badly.

    And I say this as a crazy RL monarchist who generally loves benevolent dictators in fiction. :p
     
  19. SuperWatto

    SuperWatto Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2000
    It's all relative. As a Dutchman, I always snigger whenever I read about Riina Kwaad (angry) and Dromund Kaas (cheese).
     
  20. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    You've just ruined Kaas City for me.

     
  21. SuperWatto

    SuperWatto Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2000
    Ha, ha.
    Kaas city!
     
  22. Genghis12

    Genghis12 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 18, 1999
    ::Holy Crap:: It all makes sense now that one of the greatest Sith Lords ever was named. . . Shira Brie

    Cilghal & Zorrixor...
    Remember... [face_thinking] there is another possibility for our favorite disciple... errr, historian... errr, medic:

    "If he leaves this place, he will leave all that is Jedi behind him at last. A heart can only handle so many betrayals before turning away entirely.He will become a Senator on one of the Mid-Rim worlds, and devote himself to the people there. He will be a wise, steady ruler - and he will not call upon the Force again. But his rule will grow to be a cold one, and he will find that the code of the galaxy pales in comparison to the failures of the code of the Jedi. He cannot help but love you, in his way. It is a pure, ideal love he holds, strengthened by your presence and your actions."

    One interesting thing is that remember that TSL is nowhere near as cut-and-dry as KotoR was. The first had but two endings. The sequel had a multi-axis Light/Dark vs. Bad/Good vs. Influence spectrum of various endings for its different game aspects, including locations, plots, and characters. Where the first game, "Light Side" meant only one of two choices where everything was defined by it; the second it's essentially meaningless but for maybe a couple major plots and traits for the Exile. Does "Light Side/Female" explicitly mean that she was a paragon in all things, choosing Light Side for every single possible choice -- even if it meant foregoing important influence and therefore losing out on Paths of Destiny? Or is there an implicit "cheat" for the canon plot that gives the Exile maximum Light Side (taking Light Side for every possible choice), and simply ignores the in-game impact on influence? Or does the canon truth recognize you can actually be a real son-of-a-gundark, doing a lot of Dark Side actions, and still finish the game on Light, and even on paragon-Light if you're really min-maxing choices. We don't necessarily know all the fine details yet.

    Which is why a KotoR: Revan, or KotoR: Exile novel would be a great idea; written under the umbrella of the KotoR games rather than the TOR umbrella.
     
  23. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    jedi path made quite clear the head of the council wasn't always the grand master either
     
  24. Stymi

    Stymi Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2002
    Has a lit. review thread for this book been posted yet? I can't seem to find it?

    Please feel free to make fun of me if it has been (but also post a link to the thread or something).
     
  25. Sock2008

    Sock2008 Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 15, 2008
    At least Luke doesn't have a throne, like the un-named Jedi Grand Master before whom Yoda is seen reporting about the expedition to the first Chunthor's wreck on Dathomir in 400 BBY or so in CoPL.

    The Ben thing is just the authors building up DR's New Young Main Hero, I don't think they have really understood - or if they have, then they don't care about - the implications of a Jedi dynasty. I assume they just want to show how grand piece of Skywalker Ben is, that already when a teenager he is clearly seen set to be a future Grand Master. No early death or fall to the Dark Side for him.

    As fatalistic Luke said about Alema Rar's and Jacen's fall to be inevitable, so Ben's accession to Grand Mastery seems inevitable too.

    Considering that the NJO needs either Skywalkers or OJO relics to lead it, I agree that it is a failure, perhaps likely set to fall without those crutches, and that re-founding of the Jedi in 3950 BBY was much more succesful and natural. NJO seems to me in the light of the DR and DH EU as an artificial extension of life to the Jedi Order, whose natural lifespan had apparently - if you would take the need for those crutches seriously ;) - come to an end.

    I get a kind of Jedi Dictator vibe from Satele too, not overt use of power, but that the final word, the one that decides, is always her's to take take if she so wishes.