Saga The prophecy of the Chosen One...

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Polydroxol, Feb 14, 2014.

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When did Anakin/Darth Vader bring balance to the Force?

The Jedi Purge. 1 vote(s) 1.9%
Killing Darth Sidious. 29 vote(s) 55.8%
Both, they equally contributed to the Force being balanced. 18 vote(s) 34.6%
Other 4 vote(s) 7.7%
  1. Polydroxol Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2014
    star 2
    It is pretty well agreed on that Anakin Skywalker was the Chose One to bring balance to the Force. However, when did he balance it?

    According to the Jedi, any existence of the Dark Side "corrupted" the Force causing it to be unbalanced. This would support the theory that Anakin only balanced the Force when he was redeemed and killed Darth Sidious, and that the Jedi Purge was unneeded. However, there are many who consider the Light and Dark sides of the Force as two equal sides of a coin. With this viewpoint, the Jedi purge would be necessary in order for usage of the Light and Dark sides of the Force to be equal and "balanced." Some think, that both events were in-fact needed to bring balance the Force. What do you think?
  2. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 7
    EU tends to have "the imbalance of the force" not be to do with the existence of the dark side - but the activities of the Sith. In the Darth Plagueis novel, for example.

    The Dark Side and Light Side have existed as long as sentient life has. But the Sith, shortly before TPM, unbalanced it, causing the Dark Side to ascend - and blinding the Jedi to the future.
  3. WAC-47 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 8, 2014
    I always consider what Yoda told Luke.
    "If you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny."

    I don't think we should consider a Master Jedi like Yoda to be prone to hyperbole and meaningless ramblings. I believe that should be taken literally, invalidating any other `redemption` from the Dark Side in EU as an affront to Star Wars canon and the legacy of Anakin Skywalker. When one turns to the dark side, one does not come back.

    My own take, for my own satisfaction, is that if Anakin did not turn to the Dark Side of the force, and help the Emperor hunt down the Jedi Order, he would have been killed with the rest of them during Order 66.
    It was the will of the force and a path only Anakin would be strong enough to take. To be burned, to be physically destroyed, to lose everything, and finally to be at Endor, as Anakin Skywalker, the return of the Jedi.

    Say what you want about Sith holocrons or future Jedi turning to the dark side, without a true Sith Master, the ancient ways of the Sith would be lost. There might be pretenders, or dark siders claiming to be Sith, but with Anakin Skywalker destroying the Emperor and Darth Vader, how could the Sith ever truly return? The secret ways of the Sith were passed down through a lineage, and without a true Master, there could never again exist a true apprentice.

    So for me, the prophecy was revealed in Anakin Skywalker, greatest of all the Jedi, taking a road that only he could take, to destroy the Sith forever and bring balance to the Force.
    Last edited by WAC-47, Feb 14, 2014
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  4. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    The Jedi have never expressed such a view in any source I'm familiar with, and certainly not in the films.

    The balance of the Force is not the same thing as a balance of usage of the Force.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  5. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 10
    "The first film starts with the last age of the Republic; which is it's getting tired, old, it's getting corrupt. There's the rise of the Sith, who are now becoming a force, and in the backdrop of this you have Anakin Skywalker: a young boy who's destined to be a very significant player in bringing balance back to the Force and the Republic.

    In the second film, we get into more of that turmoil. It's the beginning of the Clone Wars, it's the beginning of the end of democracy in the Republic, sorta the beginning of the end of the Republic, and it's Anakin Skyalker beginning to deal with some of his more intense emotions of anger, hatred, sense of loss, possessiveness, jealousy, and the other things he's coping with.

    Then we will get to the 3rd film, where he is seduced to the dark side, which brings up to films four, five, and six, where Anakin's offspring redeem him & allow him to fulfill the prophecy where he brings balance to the Force by doing away with the Sith and getting rid of evil in the universe."

    --George Lucas, The Star Wars Trilogy VHS Boxset 2000.


    The sad thing is Padme says there is still good in him and Luke says in ROTJ there is good in you. Its recurring. There is good in him. And that will bring balance to the force. He needs to get rid of the Sith and bring balance to the Force."

    --George Lucas, ROTS DVD Commentary.


    "It really has to do with learning," Lucas says, "Children teach you compassion. They teach you to love unconditionally. Anakin can't be redeemed for all the pain and suffering he's caused. He doesn't right the wrongs, but he stops the horror. The end of the Saga is simply Anakin saying, I care about this person, regardless of what it means to me. I will throw away everything that I have, everything that I've grown to love- primarily the Emperor- and throw away my life, to save this person. And I'm doing it because he has faith in me; he loves me despite all the horrible things I've done. I broke his mother's heart, but he still cares about me, and I can't let that die. Anakin is very different in the end. The thing of it is: The prophecy was right. Anakin was the chosen one, and he does bring balance to the Force. He takes the one ounce of good still left in him and destroys the Emperor out of compassion for his son."

    --George Lucas, The Making Of Revenge Of The Sith; page 221

    "I think it is obvious that [Qui-Gon] was wrong in Episode I and made a dangerous decision, but ultimately this decision may be correct. The “phantom menace” refers to the force of the dark side of the universe. Anakin will be taken over by dark forces which in turn destroy the balance of the Galaxy, but the individual who kills the Emperor is Darth Vader—also Anakin. The tale meanders and both the prediction and Qui-Gon are correct—Anakin is the chosen one, and he did bring peace at last with his own sacrifice. Luke couldn't kill the Emperor himself, but he could make Anakin reflect on his life and kill the Emperor."

    --George Lucas, Cut Magazine interview, 1999
  6. MOC Yak Face Old Films' Curator

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 6, 2004
    star 4
    The dark side will always exist and I don't recall ever hearing a view in SW to the contrary. The Sith brought the dark side into dominance and skewed the force. When the Sith were destroyed the dark side didn't cease to exist, it merely ceased to dominate and therefore balance was restored.
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  7. BenKenobi1138 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2013
    Well I think @darth-sinister pretty much summed it up there, although there are many people on this site who to prefer to believe the opposite of whatever George Lucas says. I however, am not one of those.
    Andy Wylde, Bob Octa and DanielUK like this.
  8. only one kenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 2012
    star 4

    Well..that rather depends on when he said it. He changes his mind, you see. Has done a fair amount of that, as most of us do. What is was not always thus. To be honest, I couldn't give two figs about what the prophecy is meant to be, it simply isn't an aspect of the Star Wars that I relate to (and so what was, at some point in time, has remained for me).
    Last edited by only one kenobi, Feb 27, 2014
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  9. SarlacsDinerParty Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2014
    star 1
    Always thought that happened With the Death of Sidious.
  10. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    I never understood why the Jedi wanted the force to be balanced: two Jedi, two Sith?
  11. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Balance of the Force, not balance of the Force-users.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  12. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    Balance of the force: Half light:Half Dark
  13. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    End of ROTJ: 0 Sith, 1 Jedi ( not counting ghosts )
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  14. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    So no more balance.
  15. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Balance of the Force, not balance of the Force-users.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  16. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    Could you explain, I don't remember that being in the films.
  17. PiettsHat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 1, 2011
    star 4

    Honestly, people who say killing the Jedi = balance don't understand the concept of homeostasis.

    That's like saying if the Sith are a cancer and the Jedi are your immune system, your body is in homeostasis when your cancer grows enough and your immune system is decimated enough.

    That's not how it works at all.

    A healthy body, one that is in balance, should have no cancer and a strong immune system.

    The Jedi of the PT might have been a tad auto-reactive, but almost completely wiping out your immune system is NOT a good idea. Getting rid of cancer is.
    Bob Octa likes this.
  18. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    That's the whole point. The films never speak of a balance of Force-users and don't concern themselves with such a thing. Because neither of the two factions would want such an outcome to occur.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  19. PiettsHat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 1, 2011
    star 4

    "It was said that you would destroy the Sith, not join them! Bring balance to the Force, not leave it in darkness!"

    According to Obi-Wan, Anakin decimating the Jedi =/= bringing balance to the Force, it means leaving the Force in darkness.

    What exactly is it that you don't understand again?
  20. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    They should explain it if they want people to get it.
  21. PiettsHat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 1, 2011
    star 4

    They did. In the immortal words of Christian Bale, "Think for one ****ing second!"
  22. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    That wasn't what the prophecy said in TPM. Or AOTC. It just said "Bring Balance to the Force." Episode III changed it to "Destroy the Sith."
  23. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    How and where did they explain?
  24. PiettsHat Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 1, 2011
    star 4

    TPM:

    QUI-GON : A boy... his cells have the highest concentration of
    midi-chlorians I have seen in a life form. It is possible he was conceived
    by the midi-chlorians.
    MACE WINDU : You're referring to the prophesy of the one who will bring
    balance to the Force...you believe it's this boy??

    AOTC:

    MACE WINDU: Remember, Obi-Wan. If the prophecy is true,
    your apprentice is the only one who can bring the Force
    back into balance.

    TPM and AOTC make it clear that the prophecy means that Anakin will bring the Force back into balance. It's ROTS that clarifies that this meant "destroy the Sith, NOT join them" as this would "bring balance to the Force, not leave it in darkness."

    Honestly, the film freaking spells it out for you exactly what the prophecy says by the end of ROTS. What in the world don't you understand? Joining the Sith is exactly the opposite of what the prophecy says -- that Anakin would destroy them and thus bring the Force back into balance. It's not that complicated.
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  25. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    How do you know that? Where in the prophecy did it say the "Chosen One" had to be a Jedi?
    Last edited by Garrett Atkins, Mar 2, 2014