**The Rendarian Backlash** Official Release Thread

Thanks for the QT 5 version!

My short review...

As others have said, the story was very good. It was very difficult to hear a lot of the dialog though, so at times I had to rewind and listen again so as to follow the story.

Your special effects were average. Your space scenes were effectively presented. There wasn't a ton of animation, but the use of movement and, more importantly, sound, made it very clear that a major battle was happening.

I do want to mention the editing. There were many very disconcerting edits in this film. "Editing should be invisible." Unfortunately, I noticed it a lot. For example, in one of the two final lightsaber battles you broke the 180 degree rule more than tem times.

All in all, it was a good effort. Your ability to actually bring a film this complex off is a tribute to you.

-tm

 

And this is what I get for being honest.

Fine, I apoligized for sounding "tact"-less, but you just don't let up do you!

Look, if you see my stuff, I expect "tact"-less responses from you because at least it's honest.

 

Thanks again to everyone who is watching the movie and sending there feedback. The server has been slammed over the last couple of days!

The two major complaints that I'm seeing are the sound and the camera. These are my two biggest pet peeves about the movie as well. The sound is very unbalanced. However, I also feel that the compression didn't do it justice. (we watched the master files in surround sound and it was pretty cool ) Oh well, yet another lesson learned. The camera was very bottom of the barrel. We didn't even have a fire wire port. Everything was imported through a Dazzle USB Device. As MattesKrymsod noted, the tripod was terrible. However, that's more my fault as editor because I should have cut the little shakes out. Technically, I was the director but I say "director" in the most basic sense. There were only four people on this team actually working behind the scenes. Basically, whoever wasn't in the scene was director or camera man. (Though unprofessional, it made it kind of fun because all of the scenes were shot through the eyes of different people.)

I think I'm most happy that people are liking the story. I knew that we didn't have great effects (all space scenes were done with blender and openfx, both free!). All the other effects were just some simple tricks. It seems that storyline seems to be the number one gripe about fanfilms these days so I'm happy that we are entertaining in that area.

Lunatic_Pandora1
The saber hilt that is seen most frequently was from Park Sabers. The ones that I used were made simply from chrome plumbing pipe and black stick on phone rubber for the grip (much more comfortable that the Park Saber.)
Many of the locations were on my college campus (The University of Texas at El Paso). It could be difficult because there were always people around (especially kids wanting to watch). The "sunset at the beach" shot (which is still my personal favorite) was actully filmed at the Rio Grande River. (sorta famous in the southwest ).

Tumble
I'm glad that you and the other version 5ers got to see the movie. As for the editing, I just want to reiterate that I really have no experience. This shows that Hasan's post, though not very tactful, has some merit. I don't know what a 180 degree rule is or how I broke it ten times. Needless to say I have much to learn. We'll just say I'm not even yet a padawan learner when it comes to filmmaking.

Honestly, this is a great learning experience. The most important thing is that I'm learning what NOT to do.

Keep watching and post away.
Jeff

 

"Fine, I apoligized for sounding "tact"-less, but you just don't let up do you!"

LOL! You did far more than apologize. You added a new group of flames in the post. Had you simply apologized, you would've received a far different response.

 

I've watched the film and found it quite enjoyable. It's nice to watch a film that has a plotline to go along with the special effects. Great effort for a first film. I am looking forward to more great work from you in the future. As for the "critic, ahem, flamer" in our midst, just remember that most Hollywood films have millions behind them and a huge crew to work on editing, lighting and audio.

Bravo on a job well done.

 

MoffJake mentionned this, but I would also like to recommend that you take out the 'squished' effect on the movie. (It looks as though you've taken 4:3 material at stretched it widescreen). Also, boosting the gamma of the entier film will help a lot. Because of the CG scenes, I'm getting the impression that the darkeness is not just related to the camera & lighting.
It's possible that if you're watching this on your TV or a reference montor, you're not seeing these problems as strongly.
I wached the QT6 version, which seemed a bit larger - congratulation on the story line and the use of locations.

 

Since the TRB page on the website isn't working, I thought I would add some of our short tests for the movie.

www.azraelite.com/ghost.mov
www.azraelite.com/lightning.mov
www.azraelite.com/test fight.mov
www.azraelite.com/hologram1.mov

These are in quicktime 6 (sorry didn't have time to change them for version 5)

Jeff

 

I liked the story, a very novel idea and when I saw the trailer I bashed my head against the table saying 'why didn't I think of this?'

However there were some problems.

#1 was the direction. The big problem was that the camera cuts were too unwieldly, making me wonder what I am looking at. Next time try to use 'master shots' instead of straight 'medium shots'. Masters show the entire area and let us know where you are while mediums just show the guy.

#2 was the sound. I am guessing that your camera didn't have very good audio capability because you used a good ammount of voiceover work. The voiceovers made it hard to discern who was talking sometimes since the voices came out of the speakers equally no matter what side of the screen the character was on.

But all in all I thought your film was very interesting. I LOVED the scene where the ATAT fires at the two guys in the field, brilliant. Then the 1st guy gets shot and the second checked him and then left... PERFECT! He didn't dwindle around the body but looked down as if to see if he was alive, then realizing he was not, ran for his own life. I really can not overemphasise how COOL that scene was. Also as previously mentioned, the lightsaber fight at the beginning of the 3rd part was great! The rest were okay but that one truely got my heart pumping.

Good job guys! If you make another one head the advice given to you (and get a better camera) and you will blow us away!

Thank you for your film

 

WhisperingDeath, thanks for the comments. Believe me, I am taking notes on all that needs to be done for the next project...

The AT-AT scene was shot on a whim one afternoon. That scene wasn't even in the original script.

As for the fight scene, that's actually an interesting story. The first half and second half of the fight were shot over 13 months apart!

I love all the input I'm getting everyone. Keep it coming

Jeff

 

Nathan, it seems to me a flame would include generalized words like "crappy", "stupid", etc. Harsh criticism can still be constructive; if he genuinely feels something's horrible, would telling the guy anything else be more constructive? And consider Niko's reaction; you seem to be the only one who really had a problem with hasan's original post.

But then, I've never done a fan film either, so I guess my opinions are as worthless on this forum as hasan's.

 

"But then, I've never done a fan film either, so I guess my opinions are as worthless on this forum as hasan's"

Coopra6000, I do not believe that anyone's opinion on this forum is worthless. Even if you haven't created a film, test or even drawn one lightsaber onto a single picture, your opinion is just as valid to me as anyone elses. I brought my film here for everyone to see and (hopefully) enjoy on one level or another. Even though fan films are only a hobby at this point, I still want to continue to improve for future projects. Personally, I want people with no film experience to watch my movie. Plain and simple, they can tell me whether or not it was entertaining. As it has been repeated many times before, you can have the best effects in the world but if it isn't entertaining then nobody really wants to watch it. I brought my film to this forum because I can get the input of from those with much more experience as well as those with none at all. I believe that my films will only get better if I heed the advice of the audience as a whole.

So please everyone, don't hesitate or hold your comments back. If you think something sucks, say so. If you like something, say so too. Just explain why and I'll have no problem it.


Jeff

 

Yo Hasan,all of your opinions are valid and most likely true, but what people are getting on you about is that they were written bad. What many people need to learn is that something that might not sound so bad when spoken can sound HORRIBLE when read. So what you need to do is have an equal ammount of good and bad comments and try to give some ideas to help next time. This forum was origionally very critical of fan films, then it went to incredibly non-critical where if I said i didn't like a film i was attacked by everyone. But now I think it has reached a happy medium so just learn our customs for reviewing films and you should be fine . Believe me, we don't want to shut you up, we just don't want the guy that spent over a year creating this film to get hurt feelings when you are too critical of his labor of love.

It takes more time, effort and money than anyone ever thinks to make a fan film, and the film makers recieve nothing but the satisfaction of finishing a film in the end. So courtesy is a must.

 

I don't like the fact that you used the ship from Knightquest. Some may say that its cool for one fanfilm to use a concept from another but it just didn't feel right to me. Its supposed to be a custom ship, right? Not everyone can have it... its textures were missing btw, how come?

Carl

 

I love it when 2 people argue and their posts dont contain profanity and have actual points to propose.

Back to the film.

Ok well man your heart was in the right place. The story i thought was well thought out. No plot snags or nothing. The score you came up with, was interesting. I enjoyed the variations from movie to movie as u used different tracks to display a different type of mood to the scene. The sound though when it came to mics could have used work. I remeber the first short movie i made, the sound was horrible. You counldt hear nothing. After that one. I bought mics. Mics make a world of improvement.
Now of course I hope everyone can understand that your budget would have been limited. A few things to work on though are sound and lighting. Everything else was perfect. A well thoughout movie. I hope to see more of these from you guys, that is if u decide to make ore which i hope u do. Once the current film im working on is done, i plan on makin a SW Fan Film. When i get it done ill post it and you guys can tear me a new one.

 

I'm actually suprised that the "Knightquest ship" comment didn't come up earlier. The model came from SWMA.net before it started having host problems. As I've stated earlier we used openfx for all of our cg animation. It was actually one of the models that worked well with the software. Believe it or not, those scenes were done when only the original Knightquest trailer was out. Had I known that it was going to be the main ship in their movie, I would have probably opted to use something else. Sorry if I stepped on any toes in using it (it was only a small part though ).

Jeff

EDIT: Oh the pain! Why must this camera haunt me so! Yeah this camera wasn't so hot. Sad as it is, I had a camera from the eighties that I could at least plug a mic into. We will have a different camera for the next project...

 

Wow, lots of response... it's been a while since I've been in here, but a new fanfilm always prompts me to check out the forums.

On the topic of criticism (just to add my 2 cents). I spend a bit of every day as one of the moderators on a fairly popular comics art site. This is a problem there as well, since as artists (and filmmakers) we need to be able to get (and give) fair and and unrestrained critiques of the material in question. That being said, when telling someone that they did a less than perfect job it behooves us to find a way to do so without sounding like a snobby jackass.

In case no-one else has mentioned it (I didn't see it in any posts) the "180-degree Camera Rule" (also known as "Line-of -Action) basically states that no two consecutive cuts should display a viewpoint that extends more than 180 degrees. Basically this means that if characters A and B are facing each other, with A on the right and B on the left, the NEXT cut should not suddenly and without warnig have A on the left and B on the right. This confuses the viewer and the scene by making it unclear where the two characters are in relation to one another and the scene. As an extension of this, if we have a shot of character A facing camera left, he should not suddenly switch and be facing camera right unless we've shown somehow that he has turned around. It's one of the most important rules in cinematography, and one that is often broken unintentionally by new artists starting out.

My only other critique as far as the shooting of the film was concerned is that unless you have a steady-cam rig (and not many fanfilm-makers can afford one of those) it's a good idea to placeyour camera upon a tripod or some other solid surface. If you want to have a moving shot, use a wheelchair or something similar. For one shot I did in class we placed our cameraman in a t-top Camaro and moved the car around the actors (a very effective trick, giving us a high angle with smooth motion).

That being said, I liked a lot of the fighting and the fx were certainly up to par, if nothing else. Good sound and good choreography (espescially in part 3) do a lot to make up for the lighting and camera work. I think this film would have looked much better with a more experienced crew and better equipment (and what fan film wouldn't), but the CORE of the film is quite nice, and I don't doubt that should you choose to create another fanfilm it will be even better.

And lastly, no matter what any critics may say, don't forget that you FINISHED... this means a lot, espescially when so many great films never get this far.

I very much look forward to your next undertaking.

 

Just for reference (I am asking this of all films that come out) aproximentally how long did it take before you had the finished script in your hands until it was compressed and made available for download?

 

Hmm. I didn't happen to catch if anyone answered the comment yet, but the ship from Knightquest . . .

If you're talking about the very sliverish ship that looks much like the KQ one . . .

That's the same ship as Bossk's Hound's Tooth. It's not original to ANY fan film.

 

I had the finished script in my hands by early November 2000. (note: because of personel problems, re-writes for certain scenes had to be done after the majority of the filming was complete.) The majority of the film was done last summer but it had to be shelved for approximately 9 months during the last fall and spring semesters because of school. Too make a long story short (too late), it approximately took 12 solid months of work to complete the movie.

Hound's Tooth, that's the name I was looking for. Thanks Nathan.

 

:uffs out chest::

ChronoKing to the rescue again!

 

Coopra6000, I do not believe that anyone's opinion on this forum is worthless. Even if you haven't created a film, test or even drawn one lightsaber onto a single picture, your opinion is just as valid to me as anyone elses.

I should hope so. I was being facetious, in response to this:

If you're going to slam someone's work, be damned sure you have something of your own out there to present to give you some kind, ANY kind, of foundation to stand on. Otherwise, you come off as just another punk with his head up his ass.

 

Cool , you guys have given a lot of input on how we can make our next production much better. Here is the run down of the notables that I'll be working on personally:

1. Fix the sound in every department
2. Get a mic (and no voiceovers)
3. Get (or borrow) a better camera
4. Work on my directing skills!!!
5. Don't break the 180 degree rule (especially now that I know what it is, thanks Inkthinker )
6. Try and raise a larger budget
7. Retire my compaq with intel celeron (I'm amazed it didn't die in producing a 30 minute movie [face_shocked])

I know there is much more. I'm back in school and my mind has already turned to mush. (Not thinking very clearly right now.)

Feel free to chime

Jeff

 

It is really cool to see a guy who takes our criticism and wants to make a 2nd movie based on it . And thank you for answering my time question

Also one thing to add to your list. You may want to considering to get someone to help you in one of these areas
1) Acting
2) Directing
3) VFX

In my opinion if you only do two of these your film will turn out a lot better since you don't have to do SO much work trying to get it finished. But that is just an idea, it is all up to you and your style that dictates how your film will get pushed through.

Now go out there and make us proud!

 

WhisperingDeath, I totally agree with you and I'm going to delegate out more of the duties with the next film. I've started by signing on an original composer to do the music for the next project. I'm also going to be looking for a visual effects artist (pm or e-mail me if anyone is interested )

Call me crazy, but I had tons of fun doing all that I did for TRB (rotoscoping became slightly tedious, still cool though).

Anymore comments on the film would be greatly appreciated.

Jeff

 

I thoght the film was pretty weak. I know it's been said over and over, but the sound, camerawork and film quality was really bad.

However, I didn't think all of it was bad. The lightsaber battle at the end (the two male leads' duel) was pretty sweet (love that martial arts spinning sword attack!) and the backstory stuff like the AT-AT attack was well done. I also liked the choice of music from Armageddon. I love Trevor Rabin's scores, Armageddon's was one of my all time faves. I'm starting to get really sick of hearing John William's stuff over fan films and a change of pace is greatly appreciated.

I mainly felt that the ending was a letdown. I was hopin gthat all that backstory stuff would come into play in the finale, but it didn't. Plus the female charcater being a Jedi came out of left field and didn't make much sense. Maybe it's just me not being able to make out the dialogue and I missed something. I don't know.

I hope that for your next project you learn from the mistakes made on the Rendarian Backlash. But it's not bad for a first timer, it just could have been so much more.