RPR Archive The RPF Community Council

Hello to everyone!

I'm thrilled to be on this council, and look foward to working with such an awesome group for the betterment of the RPF community.

I'm assuming that items may be added to the agenda through PMing the Chair? or will we have a secretary to maintain the agenda and summarise discussions? I believe we have a fair bit to get through.

 

Well...first I would like to say thanks. Thanks to those who nominated me, and NaboosPrincess for selecting me as one of the Council members out of a large group of talented individuals here in the forums. It is truly an honor.

Anyway, I am sure most of you have at least seen me around, but I will post an introduction, as most of the others have. I am, of coarse, darth_nemisis, spelled with two I's, not E's. I did not mistakenly mispell it, just so everyone knows...I prefer it this way. I have been apart of the RPF for over a year and a half, and am loving it! I will continue to post on this forum until either this place dies, or I die. Um...I was voted as best Role Player in the Winter 2005 Awards, which was a huge suprise, and a great honor. Um...I can't really think of anything else...except that I participate in the IBoP RPG, and am a co-founder of the Sith Trials RPG, a once thriving RPG. I think that's all I have...

Now, now, no playing favorites!

 

Eh? I nominated spacelady, dumbdumb And Tyi is my long lost son ... so there

 

Well thank you for having me as your favorite.

 

you owe me

anyway, congrats all. now, let's get on with it shall we?

 

Ok, well... I'd like to get the thoughts of everyone my RPF DANGER ROOM concept... is this a good idea and why??? (Refer to the RPF reforms thread for the details)

 

Alright, let's get down to work, shall we? I'm NP, your resident Moddess, so very pleased to be working with all of you.

I've seen some great ideas hashed out in the forum discussion thread. The discussion was going so well over there that I didn't want to move it over, but it had to be done.

I would like to do the following things (in this order!):

1. Continue the discussion regarding reforms to the RPF Adoptions Program

2. Set up a committee on this Council to manage and maintain the program (let's give some thought to keeping milney on as an "Advisor-to-the-Council" or somesuch, to help in the transition)

3. Launch new program. Consider ways of spreading the word: forum announcement in the header, word-of-mouth, PMs to newbies, etc.

We'll discuss #1 for a few days or weeks, whatever it takes, then move down the list.

 

As a brief introduction, I am AdmiralNick22, former Faction Leader and Sub-GM for the New Republic Faction of Integrated Balance of Power. It is a pleasure to serve on this council and I look forward to working with all of you. For those who I do not know, consider this my official hello and how are you.

In regards to NaboosPrincess's discussion topic of the Adoption program, this is one issue that I feel very strongly about. As I mentioned the the discussion thread formed prior to this council, there is a sad gulf at times between the more veteran players and new players. This can be understandable at times, but were I personally get bothered is when I see more veteran players write off a newer player just because of their age or the date when they joined. I would personally like to see the Adoption program expanded to help younger players ease into RPing more smoothly.

Another thing that I believe would be very crucial to success in Adoptions is a greater form of accountability to the experienced players who do the adopting. It is one thing to say that you will help a new player, but it is entirely another thing to be patient and watch the player grow as a RPer.

Anyways, I just figured I would try to kick off the discussion. I look forward to working with you all.

--Adm. Nick

 

ok... well, I'd like to intro. my idea for what we could do for the RPF adoptions program...

---

Follow my line of thinking for a moment and conjure up thoughts of the X-men's Danger Room from the cartoon/comic book series...

Now, put a Star Wars RPF Adoptions program spin to it and... VOILA!

You get the RPF's own DANGER ROOM!!!

Just think of the possibilities for a moment...

~Adoptors AND Adoptees can create their own characters for developement in scenarios created and GM'ed by fellow RPers of the boards.

~A rotating line of Scenario GM's so that every experience is different and equally engaging.

~Of course, it will be left up the current GM to enforce their own rules and modes of play for their respective turns.

~And it would be a 'pick up and play' type of gaming style allowing for the ease of joining coupled with the ability to take a break to ease stress levels so that no other RPing endeavors suffer.

~It could be autotomically regulated by a MOD or a Council member for final say on issues as well.

~And the Room itself would be stylized as a type of training sim itself for the ability to fit any possible scenario imaginable.

EDIT:As per the character developement, the character created by the Adoptor/Adoptee (it would also be open to anyone else as well) would grow inside of the training enviroment. The personality aspects of character dev. would grow by exponential measures in their interactions with others. And such skills learn could be carried over into the actual 'Storytelling' RPGs out there like CarbonEye and PodRacing: Life in the Fast Lane [/shamelesspromotion].

EDIT2:Also, one could bring any already existing character from any RPG strolling on in to the training room for a scenario or two... just a thought. If you've read any of the 007 series of RPGs then just imagine Joss Vendu and Markus Carfax fighting alongside one another against giant mechanized robots... good times, good times.

1)No one said that the idea of rotating GMs would ever spill over into the rest of the RPF... SKYE, I think you're really crying wolf on this one... I know that idea scares you, but keep the idea in perspective... that idea is specifically just in the RPF DANGER ROOM concept... and everyone knows that GMs hold the power over thier own RPGs as long as it's within the TOS and even then it's only the MODs that can intervene upon the utterance of those words that we do not speak of...

2)And lets all think for a moment beyond the scope of just Newbie-aid... what ever happened to just making a fun training room sim for Old and New alike???... It is so hard to believe that an established Oldbie can have some fun in a loose-type of training sim and possibly polish their RPing skills along side a developing Newbie??? Lets not allow a sense of elitism (although it is well deserved by the Oldbies i know ) to spoil the fun on RPF.

3)Dont forget that this is an ADOPTIONS PROGRAM... i.e. the newbies in this particular thread would be guided alongside the wise and allknowing Oldbies to prevent the things SKYE mentioned... with great guidence by the elder players of this forum, the newbies can grow into the same mold as thier teachers... the fate of the newbie ultimately lies in the hands of all you Oldbies out there...(no pressure or anything)

4)And there seems to be an impression that this council has some kind of ultimate governing power... and that's really not the case... if anything were just a platform for everyone to get the RPF reformed in the best manner possible... "and I promise to relenquish all emergency powers after the Seperatists are defea---"... Oops!, nevermind...

EDIT: Also for SKYE's argument... one could suggest any Newbie must have thier adoptor with them in the DANGER ROOM to prevent the squabbles SKYE mentioned...
[hr]

Im really in favor of the idea because the Adoptions Program has to be fun for it to be successful... And a program like this would really make the Adoptions Program a long standing successful institution... any thoughts???

 

I don't no much about the current adoption program, but I did offer myself up as an adopter a few months ago. I think the main problem with it is the lack of updates, (which is not the program co-ordinaters fault I know)

I would suggest that the council members each update regularly, and keep an eye on. We also have a forum with RPGs for new members, in which there is a Adoption Program's RPG, which gives the newer players the opportunity to play, and to play as GMs. This will give them the opportunity to learn both of these, in a simple way. (Hopefully...)

As for your idea D-B, it gives the perfect setting for such a role play, so I'm all for this setting, though they're are countless settings to choose from. If there was a new RPing forum, specifically for new players, than you could have more than one of these thread, which specialise in certain areas, such as Flight Sims, Vehicle Sims, Infantry training, Jedi training etc, much like some of the [insert SW Faction here] Fan clubs RPs have been like in the past.

Sithy!

 

It's me again, the local curmudgeon...

I do find it very interesting how people keep believeing when I say I don't appreciate rookies they automatically think I am referring to age or registration date. That's not the case at all.

I refer to rookies as those who flat out can't play an RPG. Simple as that, and yes, there are a lot on this board.

With my idea previously discussed regarding mandatory training, Our Moddess said we can't enforce that because some new people on the boards are experienced RPers. I totally agree with her on that; people play RPGs on other sites as well. We could have a Dec '05er here who is better than anyone else on the boards. Here's all I am saying though:

Before they play a game, one must prove that they are a good player.

Much like other "classes", if you think you are good enough, you can "test out" of needing to take the training. If you pass the test (I assume regulated by this Council), then you are free to join games. If you fail, training would then be required.

This would also reduce the number of newbies who come in, join a game, then never post. The MIA list for the Outcasts would be about 30 players long if we didn't truncate it. If training (or passing the test) was mandatory, it would ensure that only those people serious about playing RPGs would play, thus improving the quality of all games across the board.

Rather than god-moders and lost rookies demainding the GM's attention.

But feel free to ignore me. As darth_nemisis said:

"Skye, it always seems you have nothing but bad things to say, or think.... I don't mean to be rude when I say this, but that's just how I see it."

No it's not negative really. It's just a different persective. Most of this Council believes that the community aspect of the RPF must be improved. I personally believe that the need for improvement is in the quality of the games, and this is one solution that I think will work.

 

Nice references to my SW/007 RP's, Vendu...I mean bojangles. I know I'm jumping into this Adoptions reform discussion a little late (I didn't post in the previous thread), but are you talking about a "training" thread? Some kind of RP thread where Oldies can train the Newbies? If so, I think that's a good idea. Instead of throwing a Newbie into some well-establish, intense RPG...which can cause some problems. (Similar to something we've seen recently in CarbonEye. )

 

To post what I had before:

I do not agree with the newcomers having to pass a class. There are many new users who have the experience, and know what they are doing. I am not saying all of them do, but that's what the point of the Adoptions program is, to help out the new users. If a new user doesn't see the thread, point them to it. That's all there is to it.

Alternate GMs: The idea for alternate GMs is interesting, and would give new users a feel for the different styles many users have in the RPF. Though, I have to say that a week is too short. Many people have time constraints, especially in times of the holidays, and are unable to post. What happens when the GM is unable to post? Does that post-pone the whole thing? Do we move on? Some users may become iritated with that, being use to a short time limit. Though, as I said, I think it is a relitively good idea.

Multiple Threads: I agree with Imp on the idea for a bunch of different threads for the different training areas. Yes, it might get cluttered, but it would surely help everyone out. I am in support of making this it's own forum, such as RPing Community Forum or something. Perhaps we could have our own Category, with the different forums, if it was allowed of coarse. It would certainly limit the clutter in this one forum.

New Suggestion: If that is not an option, there is always the idea of making a thread index. I am all for helping out with that, if not doing it myself. In the index, we could include many games in it, the past awards, the winners, everything. It could be quite interesting.

 

Skye, if you want to make people "prove themselves" before they can join your game, that's your business. But it will not become board-wide policy.

If Imperial_Hammer stops by today, maybe he can say a word or two about how the approval process for his RPGs. LSA could also speak to that, I think, because I recall having to do a little "test" before joining IBoP. It's certainly not unheard of, but it's up to the GM and what he/she desires in potential players. However, I am uncomfortable with making "tests" a requirement for all games.

As to the training, I think we should consider having two threads: One to organize/sign-up for adoptions, and one for the Adoptions RPG. We won't be having a dedicated forum just for training because there's no way that training could fill an entire forum. What we will probably end up doing is having this forum for Star Wars RPGs and RPF-wide things such as Adoptions, rules, and social thread-- and another forum for non-Star Wars RPGs, and one for the big "flagship" RPG. But that is a ways down the line and I don't want to discuss that yet. The main thing is, we don't need to make a big huge deal of the Adoptions-- they just need to be re-worked a bit, and organized. They can probably fit in two threads if we do things right.

I like the idea of rotating GMs for the Adoptions Game, or at least making it a series of short scenarios rather than one long, drawn-out RPG. A newbie could complete one scenario and go out into the forum, or stay for two or three if he/she does not yet feel confident enough to play other games.

 

Well, there are pretty good reasons for RPG entry exams, as there are *some people* whose atrocious spelling and roleplaying abilities suck the fun out of the game faster than an industrial strength shop vacuum in a black hole. That said, there's a pretty easy exam to give

RPers must possess:

1) Basic English skills. You don't have to be Hemingway, but you can't be cummings unless you have a really good reason.

2) Either roleplaying skills or the willingness to learn. Everyone was new once, but our skills evolve when given the chance.

3) Respect for the GM, the rules, and the characters of others.

That is all.

 

*Enters w/ a cup of coffee*

Ah Weekends with Vacation.... ain't nothin' better....

So.... about Skye and that Entrance Exam idea...

I just recently was tinkering around in the lab with an idea of having people undergo a little test if they wanted entry into my RPG that I have going. So one day, I decided to try it out on a person that sent me their character sheet. The person in question submitted a sheet that was, well...... not too particularly great. Spelling errors, Grammar Problems, a not too particularly impressive bio, etc. etc...

And it was one of those things like, you know the person is new and you have.... worries.... about what that person will post and do in your RPG. And as I have a pretty good set of posters in Podracer right now, I was very hesitant (and still am) to have a newer user muddy up the waters...

So in PM, I have the user an ultimatum. I would approve his or her sheet if she could pass a little test. I wanted him/her to put out a well developed, IC-TAG style post on a scenario I'd give him/her. I think it was that you were on a deserted island and was looking for food. If the user could give me a satisfying post under that scenario, I would admit him/her. I didn't give the poster any help, cause that would be self defeating. Wanted the user to go out, do some reading, check around, and then try the post. If he/she got it, I would give him/her admittance, and if not, I would work with him/her until he/she got it.

Results, of course, from the test have still not been recieved. Dunno if the user is really studying up on how we do things here, or if he/she got shang-hied by Darth RL and gave up on our forum. Whenever the user comes around, I shall be more than happy to work with that person until he/she gets it.

And this, perhaps, is something all GM's should think about as a tactic for keeping their RPGs full of players that deserve to be there. If everyone implimented this idea, then the new user problem would be virtually solved, as all the major games would require that they reform before approval. Let the people who really want to play and do the work to get better at it be here. The only possible side-effect that I can see to this would be an upsurge in games by new users that didn't screen their users, but even then, hopefully game creation skills would rise. And it certainly wouldn't be something serious players would have to deal with.

An interesting idea indeed. I plan on trying it out more fully with other users to see what happens, and I'll be sure to deliver to the Council full reports of my findings....

-I_H

 

The only request I demand is that we call it the "RPF DANGER ROOM" ... how cool of a name is that?!?!?!? c'mon!!!

and I really like NP's idea of how to divide it... sheer genius!

And 'HAMMER's idea of on how he handles new RPG players is a prime example of how it should be left up to the GM to regulate his/her own game. This one has yet to toss his hat into that particular ring, but I'm just waiting for that all important great idea to come along.

Also, I can really... REALLY sympathize with what DUBYA's saying about some difficult players, so I can see why SKYE has that particular opinion, but it's just the gamble of being a GM and putting trust in the players to RP it in a great way.

~And the GM-of-the-day (for lack of a better term) or SGM (scenario GM) would decide just what kind of Sim its going to be for that amount of time to be determined. (i.e. Flight, Jedi/Sith combat, problem solving, Non-Force User combat, or character dev.)

Any thoughts on that last part???

 

I realized yesterday when I dropped in to post my ?thank you,? that I did not make my introduction. I doubt many of you know me, but I am the GM for The Galaxy at War, Part III: Schism of the Sith.

We welcome a number of inexperienced and young players into our game. I it can certainly make for some interesting difficulties, and yet, some very interesting plot twists. I am relatively new to GMing, let alone Role Playing, yet in my short year of Role Playing and half a year as GM, I have garnered an almost mind-boggling amount of experience concerning directing, facilitating, mediating/arbitrating, managing, writing, and the ways of writers.

I came to the RPF by invitation, based upon my growing reputation amongst a very few for writing and character development. I was received very grasciously and will always remember how generous that was even though I was flying by the seat of my pants. Still, I am very grateful to have been drawn into the RPF and though my ?anni di gallerie? as Verdi would say, have really only been measured in months and not years, they have taught me so much through both pleasure and pain.

Drama, finis!

Adoptee thread

Con: Drawing on my RL experience, it is not terribly profitable to ghetto-ize the inexperienced. Collected together, the new writers reinforce misconception about the conventions of gaming in an RPG. They also reinforce a culture that while it builds a comradery amongst themselves, isolates them socially, from the more experienced players, from whose interaction, the new gamers could learn exponentially. This happens when the inexperienced writer and gamer is relegated to a ?special? set of experiences via a thread or by self-selection.

Pro: It is beneficial to become acquainted with various scenarios, characters, and environments in a setting where the experience is both intense and brief, yet long enough to familiarize the ?new? player with them. Often, the gamer/writer is made aware of scenarios they had not imagined.

The specific concern to be addressed: Providing experience without separating the new gamers from the more experienced community.

Notice, I am not expressing a concern as regards slowing down established games, etc. Though it can be annoying and even rather hilarious when the plot/action is in high drama, creative writers can usually write around or even incorporate these awkward moments.

Where I stand at this point in the discussion:

A simulation thread is a good idea so long and the players are also encouraged and even nudged into games with more experienced players. This is the only way they will really grasp the evolution of characters and plots. Perhaps if they are brought into games by their adopters, this would facilitate the ease of play and integration, while placing the new gamer in the best environment for gaining experience.

Edit 1: The simulation thread providing GM experience for new gamers is an EXCELLENT idea, because really, gamers do need to have a sense of function of the GM regardless of whether they intend to GM eventually or not.

Testing players in a non-compulsory culture, such as TF.N is just not, in my opinion, appropriate, though I share the concern regarding a lack of basic writing skills, not to mention creative skills: plot and character development, etc. I would say that the lack of creative skill is almost a greater difficulty than lack of writing skills. Sometimes that deficiently can be partially overcome by keen dramatic sense. All that said, testing even at the level of GM, can be quite a hornet?s nest if one follows that out into a possible scenario, where players might question a GM?s ability to make such a judgment. It?s simply a very troubling precedent, yet not impossible.

If the rules state that a certain level of competency is required to play in a game, then that competency might need to be stated in order to bring everyone to a clear understanding in that regard. It doesn?t ensure the gamers adhere to good writing habits, but it helps.

In my RPG, I have rev

 

Congrats to all of the Council appointees! I look forward to following your discussions

 

NaboosPrincess asked me to stop by with my thoughts on adoptions (but I'm late because the time I was asked to stop by was 6am my time and I wasn't awake)

In regards to the training of Newbies, Kartanym already brought up the issues in the previous thread. They basically were: although adoptions works great for the people who decide to join it, not everyone does. That is one reason why we get the new members who have poor RP craft (not because they're bad RP-ers, but because they're in-experienced).

The training grounds and Newbie-RPG were both designed to help alleviate these issues, by providing answers to questions and training to refine skills. The former gets overlooked by alot of people and the latter failed because people lost interest in it.

The problem is PARTICIPATION. It'd be unfair and very difficult to make participation in either the adoptions program or the training grounds. And so, while there's been several RPG-ers who have come out of adoptions with benefits of the program, there's alot who were dropped because they left the boards, didn't post in the rpf for two months (either adopter or adoptee), or they requested to be removed.

The Adoptions program works in its current setup, but it's only as good as the people who agree to Adopt newer players. THAT is the crucial issue. Alot of older players have a stigma with new ones (for their poor grammar, spelling, posts, etc). I've also dropped oldbies from the program before because their newbie messaged me and said that their adopter hadn't spoken to them for a while, or it wasn't working out.

I was in the process of writing a guide for new adopters/adoptees when the forum reforms came up. These guides give step by step ways to use the adoptions program, including handy hints for when your adopter/adoptee is absent for a few days. They were going to be sent out with the newest batch of adoptions, but I haven't finished them due to a confusion about managment of the program itself.

From what I can see from the council's posts (feel free to correct me on this), the concerns were that the current adoptions program isn't doing it's job and that new player aren't getting trained.

The facts are that player who participate in the adoptions program with the intent of getting something out of it do benefit greatly from it. As I mentioned earlier, the problem isn't the program, it's the Participation in the program.

[/My thougts on the matter]

 

Milney, based on what you have just stated as per your experience concerning adoptions, the problem is a matter of not having an effective "clearing house" and it seems to me that the point of "capture" for mentoring is at the GM level, then. So perhaps we need to look at this issue from that vantage. How then can this point of entry be exploited in bettering gaming?

Edit 1: True, Milney and DVC, getting the new players to participate is a big issue. They can't be forced to do so. GMs might consent to encourage as a requisite for entry to their games.

 

I think the current system has two problems.

Getting Experienced players to Mentor.

Getting New Players to Put themselves up for Adoption.


The first problem is most challenging to me, as I can not determine why alot of us older players don't participate in the Adoptions program (Including Myself, though, I'm planning on being a part of the new one)


The second problem is much easier. Maybe, should a GM find a players skill to be lacking in certain areas, the GM should ask them to join the program before applying for the RPG.

 

I would like to offer a few words, if I may, to anyone willing enough to take the time to read my post. Firstly, however, I would like to extend my congratulations and support to all who have been nominated and selected to serve as members of the community council. No doubt you are aware of your responsibilities, so I will not go into detail reminding you of those, except to say that the ideas presented here, by your colleagues, whether or not they are a part of the council, are the very foundations from which you are free to build, expand, modify, or otherwise progress from. The only failing I can see in any such efforts, is a lack of effort and action, when there is such great potential for growth RPF-wide. As far as I can see we are all in this together, so any shortcomings will be the result of poor cooperation. The reality, of course, is that many hands make light work, and the RPF can and will become what you make of it. Let us ensure that, as great as the RPF is, we make it greater.

Many of you may have come to the realisation that the new members to the RPF are indeed the future for us all. It is they who will likely put forth some of the largest amounts of time and energy into being here. As such it is only natural to come to understand the critical importance of an organised program for adoption and/or training.

An adoptions program is an excellent way to bring and welcome people to the RPF. As has already been pointed out, however, its success, or lack thereof will be due to the levels of participation it receives. Should it be given the attention it deserves, welcoming new players and old to work together for a common purpose, I see no reason why it would not prosper. The key points here are to ensure availability of both old and new members who are willing to participate. To gather such members, one need only ensure activity and prominence of the adoptions program. Keeping it on page one, through regular posting will ensure it is never forgotten, for example. Just as it is helpful for new members to games outside of the program, and elsewhere within the RPF, to be informed that a thread exists for adoptions/training, should the newcomer be interested in that form of orientation.

I like the word orientation and I feel it should be a key focus of the adoptions program. When starting at a new school, or other institution, whether a company or some other organisation, informal or not, orientation programs are often offered. These form an integral part not only of introduction for new members, but for older members who may have missed such an opportunity, or could otherwise find value from experiencing an orientation despite their past experience, no matter how well founded or diverse. Why not include the same sort of concept in the adoptions program? I merely suggest that an organised introduction service be offered. Perhaps something in the opening post to explain what the RPF is, and what the adoptions are about. It could go as far as to mention the different threads and forums offered here, with recommendations and descriptions for major games and hangouts each has to offer.

Having said that, I feel it is important to realise the concept of adoptions, or indeed orientation, should not be limited to one, or even two threads. It is more than reasonable to have formal efforts held within a training thread, and a program thread, but true and widespread learning and welcoming for players will only ever take place if other RPGs are also open to newcomers.

Many, if not all, games within the RPF are open for anyone to join. I have noticed some limitations to membership placed by either requesting a registered post count (usually over one hundred posts), to be met as part of the ?joining qualification?. Needless to say, I am both saddened and disappointed by the idea, which I will discuss further below. The games that do not restrict membership are the few that offer a greater welcome and more meaningful, heart-felt community environment for those who join and the RPF as a whole. Most games fall into th

 

LightSide_Apprentice:

Well put. I personally do sort of like the idea of a "ranking" system to inform players of the level of skill. Elitism is obviously a concern, but I feel that if such a rank program was given special care and consideration it would in turn be a huge blessing, not a hindrance.

I unfortunately do not have much time to devote to this issue at the moment (I am off to a graduation party, thrown in my honor, so I cannot be late ) but I do feel that LS_A's idea deserves some special consideration. I plan to talk more of this latter on, but for now I am off.

--Adm. Nick