The Second Installment of the 2007 Jedi Draft [Congratulations KiwiRogue]

Oh, right. That was before he got his hands on a saber again. I shoulda just looked. I have it... somewhere around here.

 

I think that Obi-Wan has the reach, kids...never underestimate the reach...

 

Is there anything else you would like to offer Shurron, or should I vote?

 

... Nah. One way or another, let's get this over with. Vote away.

 

Before I finalize my vote, may I ask why you decided to pair Vos and Cade together?

 

Because together they're just way too individually overpowering to lose to either of the opposing trumps, and they'd take down Kol, and arguably Kenobi as well.

Because the one thing Vos really lacks is extreme power. He's powerful enough, but not really elite in that respect. Putting him with Cade solves that issue, and the kid brings some great skill himself. But also, both their fighting styles and attitudes are extremely similar. And both are quite simply too good to be bumbling around eachother and getting in the other's way like a couple of boobs, despite not having any non-theoretical cohesion.

Finally, I know if I were to alert John and Jan to this match, I'd have the actual creators of Quin and Cade firmly on my side.

 

Wang: Finally, I know if I were to alert John and Jan to this match, I'd have the actual creators of Quin and Cade firmly on my side.

You should do it. I'd be interested in what they'd have to say!


And then, well, here it is...

Quinlan Vos trumped with Cade Skywalker vs. Obi-Wan Kenobi

This is, without a doubt, an awesome way to decide the Championship. Vos was my ace in the hole when I won the Draft, and he was a steal at a time where not very many people knew what he did through the pre-Republic/Republic series. He versus Kenobi would be a cool enough match to watch already, without the presence of a volatile Skywalker descendent. Very nice.

To start off, I can give the trump the power advantage. Quinlan's shown good use of his own himself, and Cade's got the whole Skywalker thing going on. However, while Cade may have some incredible potential (Chosen One-class), it's beginning to reach that potential that makes him a threat in the Draft. His "healing" ability comes instinctually, which hurts him in the power department because it can be attributed to a natural affinity, much like Bastila's Battle Meditation, though unlike that chick it has potential to be directly devastating in a match setting-- but circa Ghosts (or, I would say still to a slightly lesser degree circa Claws), he simply has a lot more refining to do. Is he still very powerful? Of course. There's a reason he's drafted above the likes of many Jedi with much more Force training, and he's continually rising with each issue of Legacy. However, he's also got a ways to go before he's a complete powerhouse. Meanwhile, Kenobi is the champion of pure efficiency, and puts his own power, which is substantial, to perfected use.

Skill is almost no contest. Kenobi is arguably the greatest saber user on the entire board next only to Luke, with such a mixture and experience of so many Forms and styles that it's near impossible to find a weakness, let alone exploit one, and simultaneously cover all your own bases. And while Quinlan is proficient in this area too, it's definitely not on the level of Obi-Wan's, and Cade's presence hardly propels the trump's there. Cade lacks polishing in this area too, or real quality experience to show us it's not necessary. Kenobi's skill is not only with the saber, either-- he's wielded an array of other weapons on a whim, and is the greatest when it comes to reacting and adapting to any situation.

Experience really is no contest. Vos is incredibly experienced, yes, and Cade has some exploits under his belt with many more to come, but Kenobi is already an absolute experience beast.

Without really any intangibles to speak of, I think Kenobi firmly takes it. The only real advantage for the trump comes in the form of raw power in Cade boosting Quinlan's already ample abilities there, and the fact that the attack won't be coming from just one opponent-- and not only does Kenobi have considerable experience against powerful foes, but he's also got the insane skill (backed by his own well-directed power) that can and has overcome such an obstacle, as well as extensive adaptability and cleverness to combat whatever the trump throws at him. A great, great match that gets more interesting as the Legacy (and perhaps the Live Action TV Show?) series continues, but there's still a clear victor.

Winner: Obi-Wan Kenobi

 

I guess you should have sent Jan a pm.

Now normally I am against a trump with no connection. The idea that you take two slabs of meatloaf and call it filet mignon. However, this might be one a few combinations that work. I agree with Shurron that their attitudes might be the perfect for the other. Plus individually each is extremelly solid, and I believe Cade's stock will be much higher in subsequent drafts. And I think that besides temperment, their skills, and weaknesses and strengths compliment each other.

Ultimatelly though, I think Obi-Wans mixture of experience, power and skill will be too much for Cade and Vos. Im many ways Cade is like Anakin, as far as power and temperment go. I think Obi-Wan will be able to identify this, and allow Cade to make a mistake. As far as power and skill go, Vos is simply a level or two lower.

This is a tough situation, but Obi-Wan will come out of this one way or the other.

 

Meh. S'alright. I didn't really expect this one. I think the call that's really gonna bug me in the long run (Hell, or now. ) is that Cade and Shado vs. the lizards match.

But it's all good. Congrats on the win, Kiwi. Good work.

 

Thank you very much Shurron. Phew! After 2 VG, 2 M/TV, a CB and an Anime draft I win one! Makes up for losing in the last VG finals. I must admit, I wasn't really expecting to do this well when I started with massive PMed pick lists. Thanks to all the judges, and the commissioners who kept this draft running, and to all the GMs for participating. Special thanks to KenKenobi who had my back during the conference matches concerning my MVP Obi-Wan Kenobi.

 

Nice work Kiwi. Great work by all the fill-in judges too in helping to keep this thing from falling apart in the middle. Seemed like it would for quite a while, but it came together in the end. Well done.

 

<center><h2>Championship Match</h2></center>

Mustafar Conference Champion vs. Hoth Conference Champion

Buffalo Bill's Dance Party (2) vs. Shining Knights (3)

Now, this is just a FOURmality.

<img src="http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d42/DarthIntegral/Cade.png">

Cade Skywalker (forfeit)

<h1>vs. </h1>
<img src="http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d42/DarthIntegral/Kol.png">

Kol Skywalker

 

<center><h2>Championship Match</h2></center>

Mustafar Conference Champion vs. Hoth Conference Champion

Buffalo Bill's Dance Party (2) vs. Shining Knights (4)

And with that, KiwiRogue is our champion! Congrats Kiwi!

 

Congratulations KiwiRogue. Nice job.

 

Congrats there Kiwi

 

Congratumalations Kiwi

 

Now just go do the same thing in the SFD, and you'll be golden.

 

We can start talking about next draft and any changes we want to implement. The draft won't start, at the earliest, until Kiwi's colors expire. Obviously, Kiwi has guaranteed spot and first pick. I've got three judges in place, and I'm going to commish it again.

First thing to talk about is any changes to the draft list. Do we want to combine Darth Krayt and Hett, or do we want to leave them separate? Do we want to separate Jacen Solo and Darth Caedus, or leave them as one? Are there any other major additions to the list we need to add? Specifically, is there anyone from the KoToR comic books? I don't think they're being well represented at the moment. Talk about anything else here that would have to do with the draft list.

Also, we can talk about number of GM spots. Twelve GMs with 8 picks seems to work well. But, there always seems to be a little extra interest. If we go to 16 GMs, how do we want to do it? Two conferences with two draft lists (like we used to)? 16 GMs from the same list (like in the Comic Book Draft)? Or are we better served to just keep it at 12 GMs?

Also, how about team size? If we go with 12 GMs again, do we want to do draft 8, start 6 again? I thought it worked well, but we could do draft 8 start 8, as well. There are a couple of options if we go to 16 GMs, as well.

Also, any rule changes? Prep time? Locations? This draft didn't have them, last draft did. We've been exposed to some neat Force abilities in recent publications (like LotF) that seem to indicate Prep time could be helpful, but I'm not certain it's a must have for this draft.

Also, anything else you think needs touched upon.

 

I'd say combine Krayt and Hett, as we don't lose much from Hett anyway (I don't think anyone picked him this draft). Jacen/Caedus is a difficult one, and I'm on the fence with it. Granted Caedus thinks Jacen is as dead as Vader thought Anakin was. If we did seperate them, I'd take Caedus from Betrayal onwards however. Also, we need to look at people like the Exile and determine whether or not they can be used as Darkside, especially with the lightside now canonical.


Personally, I prefer smaller draft numbers, so the way it was structured this time around is my preferred option, picking 8 and sending out 6 (it enables you to draft people that are good for teams (like BM masters) and not have to worry about their individual performance)


I like the idea of prep for the Jedi Draft. Their are some people who have been shown in universe to benefit enourmously from Prep time (eg. Mara, Lumiya etc.), and I think it could work well here. Locations confuse things in my view however, and we should probably steer clear of them.

 

I'd say we get rid of Hett and just merge him into Krayt. Hell, I've never even been very fond of the Anakin/Vader split. And definitely no to Jacen/Caedus. Becuase it wasn't some sharp turn he took to being all evil and stuff once he changed his name. It's been a sloooooooow process with him. It's not like he was a fundamentally good person right before he killed Mara. Guy's been a darksider since Betrayal for sure, and arguably since Dark Nest even. If we were to split Jacen up, the end of "good guy" Jacen could very well be argued as TUF... or hell, digging all the way down to the very bottom of the roots, Traitor.

I like the team size as is, but I wouldn't have a problem ditching the bench and just having everyone fight. I'd say the prep and locations was a miserably failed experiment here, and I wouldn't want to see it again here.

Number of GMs is... depends on the level of interest, I guess. And 16 GMs all drafting from the same list could be interesting. It really could. But there is the issue that maybe the bottom of the list would suffer too much at first, with the last couple of teams having no one that even come close, like, at all to Luke or Sids or whatever. But I do think it could be interesting to see a Ulic-led squad or a Kyle-led squad and it not being a screw up on a GM's part.

EDIT: Exile was officially a lightsider long before the debacle we had with her this time around.

 

No more darkside Exile. Ever. Pretty much the only one with the option should be Revan, since again we have the canonical lightside game, but the Darth Revan history prior to that. If we start to allow DS Exile too often, we start to get requests for DS Kyle Katarn.

 

I really like the pick 8, send 6 format. I also think it'd be a mistake to change the size from 12 to 16 GMs, but that's just me.

Also, I like the idea of prep time, but really without the locations.

Jacen and Caedus should be the same, as should Hett and Kryat. But if we do separate Jacen and Caedus, we'd need a definite cutting off point, and we'd need to decide what to do with that freaking 5 year sojurn and how that would factor in when we're talking about Caedus' experience and force skills.

 

I think I'd lean towards a "specify which" on Krayt and Hett. 99/100 times, I imagine it'd be Krayt. But you never know.

I'd be in favor of not splitting Jacen. I think you'd almost have to go all the way back to NJO to find a definitive split point for him. Or you could argue Sacrifice. Or you could argue Betrayal. Or you could argue Tempest. Or you could argue DNT. And it goes on and on and on.

I think having 16 GMs from one pool would be an interesting experiment. Yeah, a team lead by Kyle Katarn wouldn't have the #1 to match up with a team lead by Luke or Sidious, but that Luke lead team (assuming everyone drafts at least somewhat coherently) wouldn't have a #2 to stand up to the #2 of that Kyle lead squad. But I'll really go with majority there. I can see benefits either way.

I am hard against prep with location. That got a little carried away and failed. Simple prep time, however, could work ... maybe.

 

I think that if we do go with prep, we should only have one prep per team per match. There's not a whole lot of people on the list who would benefit greatly from prep time, and I think one per team would be fine.

 

Thanks for the congrats! First set of colours to honour the team.

I have no thoughts towards Prep and Locations, except that I wouldn't know exactly what advantages one would get with prep. If Jacen and Caedus were to be seperate, then I would put the split at the end of TUF, Jacen would still get all the Yuzhan Vong war experience, but not the 5 year super training and weird powers.