Discussion in 'Fan Fiction and Writing Resource' started by Luke_Mara_Index, Dec 13, 2006.
Oh, you can speak freely about the NJO here. I'm not sure too many of us liked it on the whole.
I never did finish NJO. I think I got like 3 books in. I doubt I'll ever get around to finishing it, and I don't particularly want to.
For me, the EU/Legends timeline stops with Survivor's Quest. NJO? What's that?
*cough* To Sleep, Perchance To Dream *cough*
Yes, thank you. I'm not bawling my eyes out... nope.
But that was in 2011? Woah, am I getting fics mixed up, or am I just getting old?
There was another one in the same genre sorta, where an elderly LM find out he has only 3 days to live and they have to cope with him dying. Now I KNOW that one was like pre-Sacrifice.
ANYWAYS, back to happier subjects... lets hate on NJO some more
I liked the NJO in general. If only it had been used as a jumping off point for something other than the Dark Nest Trilogy.
LOL in total agreement. I like the NJO in bits and pieces I think if they'd had more continuity and used various plot points to greater/fuller potential
You guys didn't like all that elbow-rubbing and the throat clicking during the Rumble Dawn Bug-hugging orgy?
To me, the NJO was poorly conceived from the get go.
It seemed born out of hubris ("We're going to show our colleagues at Bantam how much better we are at Del Rey!!!!") while designed to cater to the most whiny of fans ("Character safety bubble? We'll show you we're not afraid to kill anyone!!!! Well, um, except the Big 3. They still have a bubble. Which kinda defeats the whole thing. Look! Squirrel!")
So instead of telling a story driven by character, setting and theme, they imposed a completely external plot and tried to shoehorn the Star Wars galaxy into it. And failed miserably, IMO. I found the Yuuzhan Vong completely out of tone with SW. In addition, while they apparently tried to use Campbell's Hero's Journey as a template for the entire series, they forgot that each book needed to stand alone and therefore the template (or even the basic story structure of inciting incident, rising action, climax, denouement) had to applied to each book as well. So the beginning of the series, especially, was nothing but defeats and characters manipulated by the authors into being blind and making poor decisions.
I see spots when I think of how badly, IMO, Del Rey bungled the license, especially in terms of the Big 3.
But I am fully aware the NJO has its fans (and certainly, it is head and shoulders above the stuff that follows. Hindsight makes it look much, much better).
But, hey, Legends....nothing but Legends...
I know some people adore the Vong...why...I don't know. I hated the Vong because the whole concept of them being devoid of the Force was simply an easy way to make the Jedi vulnerable. The trouble is the books make the Jedi stronger and stronger until only an Uber-villian could possibly challenge them. It's the same problem you run into with Superman. You need that Kryptonite to make him vulnerable. Talon Karrde used the Ysalamiri as the Jedi Kryptonite, but that wasn't enough to keep a ten book story arc going. I think making the Vong immune to the Force would have been enough if their invasion force was large enough to challenge any GA fleet. I didn't like that all conventional weapons were useless against their ships and that they have the technology to pull moons out of orbits. They were just a little too overwhelming and that made the stories downright depressing. I would have liked to see more character driven stories during the war and maybe more conflict between the different factions of the Vong. At the end too many people died, too many planets were destroyed or damaged and there was a big mess. The only bright spot in the NJO was the birth of Ben and Jacen Solo came out the hero. But then they had to screw all of that up.
I honestly don't care if they are now all legends. All I want is to see some of my favorite characters in EP7. You don't have to explain the backstory. Luke is married to a Force-strong woman named Mara Jade who he met after the war. We really don't need to know much more than that. If I can have Mara Jade, Ben and maybe the Solo twins I'd be happy.
Oh my gracious, but I so agree with that. L&M having a daughter or twins also besides Ben wouldn't hurt my feelings at all.
Revanfan1 is superb at writing villains who are just clever enough and Jedi who aren't stupid down to the bone. (Brilliant, actually)
You can do that and have edge-of-seat action.
For my part, I liked the Vong. I don't think that the Jedi became super-powered during the NJO; in fact, I think the authors of the NJO did a great job of making the Jedi nicely balanced. I think it was after NJO that the Jedi got ridiculously overpowered. Not only that, but they apparently suddenly became mean, ends-justify-the-means, violent people. I blame Troy Denning, personally.
I had intended to read all of NJO, but I just never got around to it. I've skimmed and read the parts that I wanted to (the LM pregnancy/birth parts). I didn't really mind what I did read (other than Chewie's death), but I've heard some parts are really bad and it's really damn long (sorry, but 19 books is a lot for a busy student), and Wookieepedia does a fine job of a 'reader's digest' version'. However, compared to DNt, LOTF and FOTJ, I can see how it can be seen as 'the good ol' days'.
Other than the Thrawn books I was disappointed with most Star Wars novels. I never got what I wanted...which was ROMANCE. Why do you think fanfiction is so popular. It is filling a void in the SW Universe.
Look at a lot of popular TV shows...there is romance. And I don't mean sex. Scully and Mulder, Maxwell Smart and Agent 99, Bones and Booth, Donna and Eric, Jeannie and Major Nelson, Mork and Mindy! lol! There was the development of the characters and then a flirtatious relationship. I love that in books and movies.
@Jedi_Lover - you are making me feel very nostalgic for better sit-coms as well.
There's a reason why Union, as cheesy as it is, is my favorite EU piece. VOTF is a close second
I disliked the Vong because I don't think torture porn - gratuitous graphic violence with no real story purpose other than to shock and/or titillate the reader - has a place in the Star Wars universe. Obviously, Del Rey disagrees with me because they only ratcheted it up after the NJO concluded. Oh well. I also thought the Vong were as subtle as a hammer to the head, cartoonish and one-dimensional in their 3v!l villainy. They only lacked mustaches to twirl, IMO. I know there were attempts to make them less video game monster of the level and more fleshed out, but those attempts were too little and far too late to engage me.
Heroes are only as good as the villains they face - and the YV were so OTT and VONG SMASH! (without the Bruce Banner side to humanize and give them texture) that they couldn't help but make the good guys seem rather thick and ineffectual.
@Jedi_Lover: Barbara Hambly is well-regarded within the romance novel community - you mean you didn't like her Star Wars books?
* runs and ducks*
P.S.: I do think both Bantam and Del Rey missed a huge trick by not fleshing out the characters' personal lives more. I did love Starfighters of Adumar for mixing in Wedge's and Iella's relationship with its primary adventure & derring-do. And I, Jedi - say what you will about Corran, but he truly loved Mirax. Meanwhile, it took me at least a month to realize there were scenes in VOTF that weren't set in caves...
You better run!
I think I'm still figuring this out.
I am on Star By Star and apart from a few shamed ones, none of the Vong are anything but two dimensional villians yet. Nom Anor at this point reminds me of General Grevious where he fails at everything he does and I kinda feel bad.
Although I am not looking forward to Dark Nest because of the bugs. At least they could make the YV bugs and set the bar lower.
We'll have to agree to disagree.
I agree Nom Anor fails at everything, but that's because he's basically Wile E. Coyote
But if you are enjoying the books, that's great! I'm just supremely glad they are no longer canon.
This was the best scene from the NJO.
I enjoyed quite a bit of NJO, but I was reading it really fast because I was trying to catch up to what was current at the time, so that may have contributed to my liking of them. Though I agree with Jedi_Lover, that was the best part!
I don't even remember that part!
The only NJO book that I loved was Balance Point. *sigh*
How can you not remember naked Luke! Luke was naked!