~~~The Snake Pit~~~ METAL GEAR SOLID Discussion Thread

[image=http://plaza28.mbn.or.jp/~projectitoh/kojimaniax/mgs3_mech/mgs3_mech_01.jpg]

It looks pretty tight, but for some reason it reminds me of the Thunder Tank from the 80's cartoon, Thundercats ...........either that or I have one active imagination

I can't can't wait for MSG3.

Han : I have to agree, I think this story lien is incredibly intruiging. I have this feeling that Snake Eater is goign to place so many mysteries in place finally and reveal so many of the questions we have been asking ourselves send the first Metal Gear.........I don't expect an happy endings in this one

 

"what exactly made Big Boss decide to go rogue, establishing his 'Outer Heaven' and 'Zanzibar' regimes..."

That's easy enough to explain. Big Boss wanted a world where soldiers like him and his comrades would always be needed and respected. In a word, he wanted a modern world, but with Samurai/Medieval Knight like power structure when it came to the role of soldiers in society. Soldiers are more fit to rule and hold power because they are strong; they also take all the risks, its their blood that is spilt, and many of their wounds never heal. Might makes right, and those that have the right to rule do so because they have military power. That's not to say the world be in anarchy. Both Snake and Liquid (and really anyone with an ounce of sense) knows that mankind will always wage war for one reason or another. The problem, is balance. Going back to the good ol days of the Cold War is a good start to having a world were being a warrior is society's highest calling.

So basically, he wants a return to the good old days of true chilviry (Having honor but also smacking the hell out of your enemies and carving yourself a wealthy ninch in the world).

Liquid is far from a madman, in fact, he's the smartest person in the whole Metal Gear saga, constantly outwiting the Pentagon and his brother. Not only that, he's arguably tougher than Snake (He's STILL not totally dead! ). Not to mention his exploits in the Gulf as an SAS commando, shooting down two F-16s with a Hind-D ( ) and killing Fox Hound's greatest agent.

Ah yes, and because its hilarious:

http://www.techtv.com/xplay/features/story/0,24330,3603442,00.html



I never had any problem with Raiden though. He had a great back story (Okay smartass lets see YOU act really mature after YOU'VE been an infamous child soldier) and his personality wasn't stunningly bad. The fight with him and Snake against the Arsenel Tengu's is one of my favorite Metal Gear moments EVER. Most gamers are so horrified about playing a "sissy" character that they have to bash Raiden at every turn. Just remember, it could have been worse.

 

Killing FoxHounds greatest agent? You cant mean Grey Fox. Snake killed him and Liquid fought the left over cyborg freak. Plus Liquid was in the biggidy Metal Gear and he still almost lost.

 

ObiH: Han : I have to agree, I think this story lien is incredibly intruiging. I have this feeling that Snake Eater is goign to place so many mysteries in place finally and reveal so many of the questions we have been asking ourselves send the first Metal Gear.........I don't expect an happy endings in this one

I've said it before in this very thread but I really think MGS3 and Episode III are related in many ways.

If you know Kojima, you know he loves movies. I'm sure he likes Star Wars (who doesn't, right? ) and I think he's taken some inspiration from the Prequels. Now Kojima has said MGS3 isn't a direct sequel, but it will stay true to the MGS storyline.

We know there will be twists and turns in MGS3, but I'm confident who we play as isn't one. We'll be Big Boss. Kojima said there will be a surprise once it comes time to play, but I don't think it will be character driven (ie: bait and switch). Perhaps motivation? Big Boss/Snake is there on a heroic mission. But will become a victim of his own government (so he becomes a mercenary) or circumstances (much like Anakin Skywalker).

Kojima said the story will be much more simple. But still plot heavy. To me, that means tons of questions answered. Not more questions posed.

 

"Killing FoxHounds greatest agent? You cant mean Grey Fox. Snake killed him and Liquid fought the left over cyborg freak. Plus Liquid was in the biggidy Metal Gear and he still almost lost."

To say that you're underestimating Grey Fox is an understatement. He was the first Genome (i.e. genetically enhanced) soldier in ADDITION to being the ONLY person ever to hold the code name Fox, AND having been fitted with a prototype exoskeleton AND being fitted with visual cloaking device. He killed a dozen highly trained Genome soldiers without breaking a stride. He was far stronger as the Cyborg Ninja than he ever was as Grey Fox. For Christ's sake, he's able to block an ENTIRE clip of FA-MAS fire with a SWORD! His armor was also a near match for Rex, being able to HOLD UP one of Rex's legs while it was trying to crush him. Lets also remember, that people can be clinically dead and still be brought back to life. So Snake "killed" Fox only in a technical sense.

In short, Liquid Snake trashed Fox Hound's greatest agent when he was even STRONGER than he was in his prime.

Anyone see the link I post yet? "Gaming's most uncomfortable moments: Naked Raiden"?

 

I saw that episode. I think Kojima lost it.

And Fox actually wasnt the best agent. Big Boss was. he was the greatest soldier of the century and he was in Foxhound. Snake killed him.

And if Liquid is better than Snake then explain all those times you beat the crap out of him

 

Somehow, I think that Kojima has got a major twist planned for MGS3. In MGS2, we ended up playing as Raiden. I wonder if the master has another idea like that one.

 

I dont think we will have anopther character switch. Kojima is to smart to pull the same trick twice

 

"And Fox actually wasnt the best agent. Big Boss was. he was the greatest soldier of the century and he was in Foxhound. Snake killed him."

Obviously Big Boss was the greatest Soldier of the 20th century. But he was Fox-Hound's C.O., he led the organization, he never did missions for it. Big Boss earned his reputation as the world's greatest soldier during his time as a US Army Ranger, a mercenary with the Green Berets, Delta Force and took part in more than 70 missions. He was NEVER a feild agent of Fox Hound. Thus that makes Grey Fox, Fox Hound's best agent. That doesn't mean he's better than either of the Snakes though, after all, they're clones of Big Boss.

"And if Liquid is better than Snake then explain all those times you beat the crap out of him"

Simple, e's not dead. Let's not forget that Snake and Meryl WOULD have died at Liquid's hand had not FOXDIE kicked in at that exact moment.

FOXDIE is still inside Snake. He could drop dead at any moment, a particularlly insidious design of Naomi. The mutation to FOXDIE meant that its time of delay before triggering death is unknown. It was meant to make Snake live the rest of his life in fear. Which didn't work obviously. It also explains why in MGS2 Snake is so conserned about leaving behind a better world for future generations, he doesn't know how much time he has left. Snake is also soon to be dead because he's a Clone, and as Liquid/Ocelot says, Snake's materials are vintage.

Don't try to out Metal Gear history me, I've beat them all and read all the background information.

 

okay, fine, I'll go to my next point. If Fox was the best agent Fox Hound ever had, then explain to me how Snake managed to kill him.

 

Snake was not as experienced/well seasoned as Fox, and yet was able to defeat him. Think of it like Darth Vader vs Luke Skywalker, Luke was able to defeat Vader even though Vader had the superior skill/experience at killing Jedi. Remember, Snake is a direct clone of the world's greatest soldier.

It's like sending an inexperienced fighter with mountians of raw talent up against a seasoned pro who got his skills from experience and training. All the training in the world won't give you a "touch" like Muhammed Ali for a boxing example. Plus, Snake definately was not a rookie at this point, with Outer Heaven under his belt, he was on his way to becoming a legend himself.

It's clearly stated that Grey Fox was the only person to ever achieve Fox Hound's highest rank (Fox). Yet both Liquid and Snake were able to beat him because of their nautral genetic ability, which was sharpened through training.

In short, it's good to be the clone/son of the world's greatest soldier.

 

but the fact is that they beat him and were members of Foxhound. therefore they are better than him. they may be clones but they still beat him

 

Plus, Snake definately was not a rookie at this point, with Outer Heaven under his belt, he was on his way to becoming a legend himself.

Where he defeated the Greatest Soldier of all-time. Snake's the best.

 

Exactly

 

@ Kit

 

The point is though that neither Liquid nor Solid attained the rank of Fox. Even in the game mechanics, getting a Fox rank is better than a Snake rank. The restrictions are tighter. Thus, Fox was Fox hound's best agent. But eventually, Snake and Liquid surpassed him in skill. They weren't members of Fox Hound when that happened though.

 

Snake was definately part of Foxhound at Zanzibar...When he kiled Fox. And in MGS Cambell always referred to Liquid as the leader of Foxhound. So, they were in foxhound when they beat him

 

I want the Twin Snakes

 

Me too.

 

I just saw another preview for it on X-Play

 

I just read the impressions from Gamespot.

 

It's supposed to play and look beautiful.

But parts of it aren't running at a steady 60 fps.

But that's okay for action sequences sometimes...

 

Well snake might not have beeb a "Fox" but foxhound was disbanded, if it had stayed around, and snake with it, he very likely would have got the rank of fox

 

When you think about it in the name Fox-Hound, The Hound is better than the fox. Its a foxhunting hound and is better than a fox. But the rank is a bit lower. I find that a bit confusing.

 

The Fox is more wily than a Hound though.

Liquid wasn't in Fox Hound when he killed Fox (he was rogue).

However, Fox does say to Snake while he's dying that Snake "deserved" the title of Fox. He was just never awarded it because he quit Fox-Hound after Zanzibar and was diagnosed with PTSS.

So you could say Snake was Fox Hound's best agent... for about six hours. He still was never officially awarded the title though.