ST The ST Mirrors/Borrows The Old EU

If there's another topic where this clearly fits in, please merge this with it....

Sometimes I think that the worst place to be with this trilogy is knowing the old Dark Horse Star Wars history up to the Fall of Jacen Solo but not knowing the rest.....because as someone who has made an effort to be familiar with the whole old EU's history, this sequel trilogy seems to be an exercise in streamlining what is essentially the same story of a post-ROTJ galaxy.

Everyone seems to know about Jacen, Jaina and Anakin Solo but few people seem to acknowledge that Jacen's fall lead to Luke being exiled, similar to in the sequel trilogy.

I also think to the Legacy graphic novels....the junker girl who turns out to be a Skysolo. The Skywalker apprentice who is (probably) not a Skywalker (Shado Vao/ Rey) yet carries on that tradition with more by-the-book adherence and gusto than the actual Skywalker descendant (Cade Skywalker / Kylo).

Hell, even Luke's sharp rants about the failures of the Jedi very much echo Cade's in Legacy.

To widen the lens of this discussion, I think of this for the whole new Disney canon....I don't assume everything old is scrapped, they're just reserving the right to contradict with new content. That they got Zahn on a Thrawn novel and Luceno on a Tarkin novel that sneakily seems to re-canonize some of his Plageuis work is encouraging.

A buddy of mine was even saying that the focus of TLJ and TFA on new force powers like projection of self, interlinking of two minds is the new trilogy focusing on powers that have been more in display in the old EU than in either of the other two trilogies.

A question I think about a lot lately I wish to offer to the weary haters of the new trilogy (with which I also have my issues but I enjoy it)- do you think if George Lucas would have made the sequel trilogy he actually would have taken care to not contradict the Dark Horse universe's decades of content?

I think we were always destined for heartbreak when you answer that question to yourself honestly and in the meantime look forward to enjoying the re-integration and remixing of favorite ideas and characters from time to time.

- T

 

in before the


...merge?

 

In before the merge too. By the way, the second book in the darth
bane trilogy has that force power that leia displayed when she got blown of the ship.

 

Hopefully its not locked as this thread does have merit. Jaina Solo marries Jagged Fel in the old EU; an ace pilot who later becomes head of state of the Imperial remnant. I say this because of the instant attraction I felt at the end of TLJ between Rey and Poe. Although she is a nobody at the moment, there is a bit of wriggle room for Rey Solo and although its not the Imperial remnant, ace pilot Poe seems to be the person who will replace Leia as the head of the Resistance.

The thread does have merit and its a viewpoint I've agreed with for some time now; that the ST is loosely following the old EU with various aspects.

 

thank you! I also feel there is wriggle room for Rey Solo given how Kylo talks about folks.

-T

 

I like the involvement of the story group personally for this reason. They can say, “Well, have a look at this.” Or, “What you’re describing sounds a little like this” and provide material and where possible the writers can work in concepts into the new material.

It also reduces confusion among fans. It feels like 9 times out of 10 the Dictionaries or Pablo are able to refefence or explain something in greater detail that’s been part of Star Wars for a lot of people a long time.

And by not adapting anything 100% it keeps EU fans (who avoided spoilers) on their toes since it’s familiar but different all the same.

 

truuuu

-T

 

I have never ventured into the EU as generally not a fan of tie in fiction as the quality is so variable. I have only watched (and re-watched the films many times). However, it makes a lot of sense for Disney to de-cannon the EU as it gives them freedom to do whatever they like (and be more relaxed they are not contradicting the lore in some obscure comic or novel). However, it would also be madness to totally ignore the EU material which evidently does have a wealth of good ideas in it. As such the Disney legends approach means they can sample/borrow/copy anything that works and built their new cannon.

 

I completely understood why they made the old EU into Legends. The timeframe after ROTJ was insanely covered by the time Disney aquired Lucasfilm.

However, the things they did adapt from the Legends EU were genereally the things I either disliked even there or when it is something I liked, played it in a way that made it less interesting to me. For example, yes, Luke was exiled in the LOTF stuff but at that point he had build a viable New Order, numbering the thousands. He also wasn`t personally the catalyst for Jacen Solo`s fall. There was a decade of backstory on the character of Jacen Solo, detailing how and why he fell.

So, the context is completely different to me than the ST. Yes, they mirrored some rough ideas but the execution is worlds apart. By the very nature of having the comparism, I can then say "I found the other stuff more fulfilling". So it`s not actually a boon to the ST that some familiar stuff is adapted.

 

Given the volume of material produced for the old EU over 3+ decades it's inevitable that many aspects of the ST films will feel like they were lifted or adapted from the EU, even if the writers of the new films have never read any of it. Previous authors have already expanded upon the films, using familiar themes and elements from the movies. I have no idea if JJA and RJ read any of the EU material, but I don't find it surprising in the least that they would have come up with many of the same (or similar) ideas as to what could have happened after ROTJ.

For example, one of Han and Leia's children being trained as a Jedi under Luke and then falling to the Dark Side is pretty much a given. It has a lot of dramatic potential and provides an interesting contrast and/or mirror to Anakin's journey. I suspect that pretty much any continuation of the story featuring the children of Han and Leia would eventually end up here.

Pretty much any elements of the ST that have a similar counterpart in the old EU are going to feel a lot less developed. You've got both the medium (film vs novel) and the amount of material working against them. I don't really see any way around it though; the entire purpose of resetting the EU was to not have the writers of the new films constrained by what was written in hundreds of novels and comics.

 

lot of interesting stuff here I'd like to dig into- I thought Luke was still basically responsible for Jacen's fall because he was his master....but I agree that there's tons of backstory there. How did you interpret it? I am familiar with some but not all of that backstory- the death of Anakin Solo played a big role in this right?

Like @Eternal_Jedi just said, the stories were always going to end with Luke training a soon-to-fall Solo child right? So while I agree that it's not always a boon to the ST when it mirrors Old EU, I think there are aspects that benefit from the new versions like, we didn't have to wait for 20 years of back story to get the fallen Solo child- he's already a darksider when this trilogy starts....that has its own problems sure, but I can see how for some it's cool that we get right to that point as opposed to the Old EU where we knew it would happen at some point but it took dozens of novels and comics to get there.

-T

 

StarKiller reminded me a lot of the Sun Crusher (?) from the Kevin Anderson jedi academy trilogy

 

I haven’t read any of the EU but I might try this Thrawn trilogy I’ve read so much about. Is it worth it?

 

The Luke projection scene happened multiple times in the EU. Dark Empire, LOTF, DNT, etc.

 

Oh yes, top class EU. For many years I considered it pretty close to what the ST would have looked like had Lucas actually done it after ROTJ.

EDIT: Dark Horse did a series of comic adaptations of it as well, I really enjoyed those too

 

I too am tempted to break my "don't read tie in fiction" rule and read the Thrawn books. Was also very tempted by the Aftermath trilogy premise BUT I have read so many bad reviews about the quality of the writing I guess I will give them a miss.

 

There's "wiggle room" for Rey Solo? Since uh... since when? She's the one who acknowledges her parents were nobodies. Not Ben.

Rey Solo isn't a thing.

 

I think the whole Luke versus several AT-AT (or facsimile thereof) scene, complete with apparition deception strongly reminds me of Dark Empire..

 

Ben + Rey.

 

Jacen`s fall? Well, after losing his brother, he was taken prisoner for over a year and emotionally and physically tortured as well as put under the "care" of a darkside Jedi who took him as her apprentice. Then after the war he went on a five-year trip to find himself, had a child, had a vision about said child being in great danger and turned to another Sith for help keeping his child from harm. There was so much backstory there. Luke really had no part in the fall.

Compared to that, you are right that in the ST we only get in at the tail end of the story, with a small flashback focusing on one moment. Personally, I don`t like jumping into stories like that. I like it a lot more fleshed out. Which might happen in the new novels but from what I have read, I`m not a fan of the writing in the new EU. Maybe the author`s writing styles just aren`t my thing.

 

Personally I prefer the NJO series. Won't spoil anything for you but it was my hope the ST would borrow from it.

However, it seems the LFL team is borrowing some elements from the Legends\EU universe.

Snoke is somewhat of a

Spoiler: NJO Material spolier

Snoke seems like the Vergere type in the manner he trains Kylo is close to they way she trained Jacen Solo.

 

The Poe/Hux phone hold thing reminds me of Wraith Squadron on one of their early missions.
The Wraiths (Might have still been called Grey Squadron at the time, but I digress) and another squadron fooled the local Imperials during a battle by impersonating Han and Leia on the Falcon to draw the attention of the garrison from their squadmates, (heck, Wedge was freaked out).
And at the end of the battle

Maybe not 100% applicable but just seems like something out of those novels.