The Star Wars Saga: Yoda's Perspective

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by chieftan_1111, Feb 10, 2003.

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  1. chieftan_1111 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    star 3
    First of all, I'd like to say that i like this new board...very good idea...Also, be prepared, this is a long read. I welcome any responses or comments, insights, etc....

    Anyways, from the moment TPM was released, and then later AOTC, I've always viewed the movies as one giant saga...i mean, the minute Weird Al Yankovic sang the once great hit "The Saga Begins", I've been a slave to thinking of the movies in terms of the bigger picture...from little quotes that you kind of chuckle at, like Anakin in TPM saying "NOBODY can kill a Jedi.." to the Vader shadow that Anakin casts at the Larrs homestead in AOTC...

    The story is definately Anakin's, and in the end we find that the chosen one finally comes through...in the end good prevails over evil, the rebellion wins over the empire, and a young Jedi named Luke Skywalker faces the biggest inner conflict that anybody can face: follow the crowd (aka: his father) and turn to evil, or stand among the few who believe that freedom is worth fighting for and risk getting killed...

    The Saga as a whole is beautiful...

    In all that I have mentioned, however, one little guy seems to get lost in the picture...I mean, most would step up to the plate at the mention of his name and cast their vote towards him as being the toughest Jedi a galaxy can brave...most would listen to his odd, yet wise, manner of speaking and claim that he is among the ranks of Plato or Aristotle...All would say that he is part of what makes Star Wars, well, Star Wars...

    Yoda...

    What is it about that little green Jedi?? Why is it that he is coined by most "the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy", but that's as far as it goes. In all the discussion about Anakin's transition to Vader, and Obi-Wan's attempts at fixing his mistake, mixed with Luke's inner struggles, the little guy doesn't stand a chance.

    What I am proposing is for most to take a step back and look at the Saga from Yoda's standpoint. Go back and watch the five movies that are available at this time, and later watch all six, and try to see things from Yoda's point of view.

    Consider his role in the movies:

    1. The Phantom Menace

    The introduction of Star Wars itself. We get cameos from alot of characters, but focus on Yoda's perspective. In this movie Yoda is on the council. Not a whole lot is revealed about him, except that he has the highest midichlorian count in the galaxy (next to Anakin), and is seemingly the head boss of the Jedi circle. His well-renowned wit and charm are sort of lost in this movie as he is more of a teacher, a cousellor...one whom the Jedi respect...

    2. Attack of the Clones

    Yoda's role seems to shift in this movie. He moves from being a counsellor and a teacher (which he really still is) to a more active stance in the council. He's one of the few who seem to think that maybe Palps is up to something. Then towards the end of the movie, he takes on the role of commanding a clone army, and going toe to toe with Count Dooku. Here is the first time we saw just how awsome Yoda's force power and saber skills really are.

    3.Episode 3

    Nothing much is known yet. I could speculate, however, that we are going to see a more somber Yoda. My guess would be that he's not going to go head to head with anybody in this movie (although that would be awsome). I think he'll come off like the classic Yoda, spurring little tidbits of wisdom and being there for Obi-wan as a guide.

    4A New Hope

    Poor little fella didn't even make it into this movie. Maybe ole GL will decide to add him in digitally at some point, but don't get your hopes up.

    5. The Empire Strikes Back

    Here, in my opinion, is the best performance from Yoda in the entire saga thus far. It is in this movie that fans fell in love with the little green guy. Viewed at first as a little kooky, he stepped up to the plate and took over where Obi-Wan left off. Had it not been for Yoda, Luke would've been left to his own in his actual "Force" training. Yoda's the one who taught Luke about the darksid
  2. Tigger-Wan_Catnobi Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2003
    This is interesting, to say the least. I've always had a soft spot for Yoda myself. I've lived for many years with the stigma of crying in the theater when he became one with the force. I remember my Dad comforting me, saying, "I'm sure we'll see him as part of the force."

    I like what you've said here, and I completely agree with your E3 assessment. I saw another thread somewhere here that talked about Yoda giving up and that's why he's so reluctant to train Luke, etc. I don't think so. In E3,we should see a more contemplative Yoda as he plants the seeds to overthrow the Emperor and destroy the Sith. I think ANH, ESB, and ROTJ show us the completion of Yoda's plans to restore the Jedi Order.
    Yoda has faith that The Chosen One will bring balance to the force. This faith will be how he demonstrates his immense power in E3 and beyond. It will mirror the patience that Sidious showed in generating the downfall of the Jedi.
  3. Master_Sidious Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 20, 2003
    star 1
    4A New Hope

    Poor little fella didn't even make it into this movie. Maybe ole GL will decide to add him in digitally at some point, but don't get your hopes up.


    What if this isn't our hope. Where would you use him in ANH so that it is useful and meaningful to the plot, not just to put him in the movie?

    I feel as if his entrance in ESB is made that much better because of his not being in ANH.

    I do like the post in general, I just don't see where he fits into ANH.

    $.02


  4. NiktosRule Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2001
    star 4
    I like your little essay a lot.

    I couldn't agree with you more about your ESB assessement and about how Yoda too often gets overlooked.
  5. KenKenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2002
    star 6
    *wipes forhead* Wow..I got through it all.. :eek: ! ;) :p



    Very interesting thoughts. Your post showed intellect, research, and insight, casting some light on a rather "undiscussed" area of Star Wars. For that, I applaud you. :)



    I agree with Master-Sidious on the fact that Yoda's lack of appearance in ANH was for the greater good. I imagine that Episode III will lead Yoda into hiding on Dagobah, linking and showing the connection to ANH.


    Yoda's absence in Episode IV is important in the essence that it shows how Yoda was mysterious and hidden from all existance, and it was not revealed as though there was another Jedi until ESB (this counting out Anakin, as he would be classified more as a Sith at this point).

    Also, if Yoda was in ANH then it would more or less take away from the confusion Luke encounters when he first meets Luke. Of course Yoda could make a cameo in which Luke does not see or come in contact with him.

    But then again, do we really want to take away from this classic? ;)




    Ken Kenobi- And you have a nice day ;)
  6. YodaJediMaster12 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 26, 2002
    star 4
    Agree with your essay I do. ;)

    Yoda is certainly one of the most important characters in the entire SW saga and is also one of the most endearing. He influences the saga immensely, and should never be overlooked when speaking about the key figures in SW.
  7. chieftan_1111 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    star 3
    Well, I don't know...it's Yoda...how much could he actually take away from the plot?? Maybe a scene with Yoda talking to the voice of Obi-Wan after his death...

    I wasn't suggesting that it SHOULD happen...i just really like Yoda and thought it would be great to see him in ANH, simply because he was in the other five movies...alot of people watching the saga all the way through will wonder what happened to Yoda?? Of course, him not being in ANH might add to some of the suspense of wondering what happened to him to...

    Oh well...my thoughts on that were basically just a praise for Yoda...not really saying that it should happen...
  8. yodashizzzle Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2003
    star 4
    good thread, chieftain. i think yoda adds immeasurable amounts of depth and interest to the whole star wars saga. i find myself wanting to know more about him and then realizing the risk in having his character further developed. i've read some (though not nearly all) of the novels that have been steadily coming out ever since timothy zahn's trilogy and it's hard to go through and pick out the things i like that people have added in terms of expanding characters further. nobody's done much with yoda so far, and i'm not sure how i feel about that yet. the same applies to lots of characters for whom i feel an affinity for. its great when somebody can add something more if YOU LIKE IT. but if somebody comes along and does something you hate, its unforgiveable. GL has done pretty well, i think, in walking that fine line between too much and not enough info as he's fills out yoda for the PT. what role yoda will play in E3 has yet to be seen, obviously. but i'm looking forward to what GL does with him and feel equal amounts of anxiety and hope that he'll give us some quality yoda moments.
  9. OutlawYoda Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2002
    star 4
    In Episode 1, he seems so sedate and cranky.
    By Episode 2, Yoda seemed to have learn alot, so he was much more out in the open, and laughed alot more. Now that for me was some of the heart of the movie, he was the best performer in AOTC! Hearing him laugh again was great too.
    I can't wait to see how he is in episode 3!
    Great thread! :D

  10. DAFT_VADER Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2002
    I think that Yoda could be put into ANH with a bit of work and would improve the plot line throughout the series by doing so.

    Bear with me I am not completely bonkers.

    The one thing that has always annoyed me with ESB was that somehow Vader & Palps suddenly know everything about Luke and in particular Vader has developed an obsession with him.

    Granted that maybe they heard through the galactic grapevine and Vader recognised the surname but this still seems a tad weak.

    I would think that it would be useful to at the point when Luke destroys the first death star and uses the force to do so if they had a shot of the strongest force users in the galaxy suddenly look up from what they are doing.

    i.e.

    Obi Wan - Use the force Luke
    Luke Pulls trigger quickly cut away to Vader who is still spinning give a sharp what or something, cut to palpatine who is on the toilet looks up suddenly and gets a sly glint to his eye, cut to Yoda who is walking he stops looks up says 'begins it does' smiles and continues walking cut back to the shots going into the hole and carry on.

    Okay the toilet might not be the best part of that but I think it would add something if the general idea was included and it would give Yoda and Palps a guest appearance in the film they miss out on (and lets face it it is even more bizarre that Palps who is central to the first three films suddenly dissappears for the fourth one)
  11. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    (which is why a senate scene would be much better to include than a toilet scene)
  12. Darth-Mule Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 2002
    star 4
    The whole Star Wars story was created from something Lucas originally called "The Journal Of The Whills". It was revealed on the Official Site, in the ask a jedi section I believe, that Yoda is a Whill.
  13. chieftan_1111 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    star 3
    Maybe they could add a Yoda love scene...*LOL*...joking of course...
  14. chieftan_1111 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    star 3
  15. OutlawYoda Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2002
    star 4
    A Yoda love scene eh? and who exactly would be the lover? :p
    ...........
    ............
    could it be?......
    ...........
    .........
    Leia?!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:
    :p
    But seriously, Yoda is Star Wars! Hes in every single one except A New Hope, his character owns!
  16. Ternian Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2000
    star 4
    Keep on topic guys.


    The more I see of Yoda in the PT, the more incompetant I feel he is. For 900years old, he doesn't know too much about his surroundings.
  17. chieftan_1111 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    star 3
    The more I see of Yoda in the PT, the more incompetant I feel he is. For 900years old, he doesn't know too much about his surroundings.

    How can you say that? I think from AOTC, Yoda is VERY aware of what's going on...

    Let me give you some examples:

    1) Like the second of third scene, right after Yoda said that "the dark side clouds everything"...Palpatine finishes what Padme is thinking:

    Padme: But i don't think...

    Palps: that the situation is that serious. But I do senator.

    And then he goes through this song and dance about how she would be more comfortable with someone she is familiar with, yada yada yada...

    The point is that the camera cuts to Yoda during Palps speech to Padme about her protection, and there's a look like he doesn't quite trust what Palpatine is saying...thing is, that that could just be considered my interpretation, however, if you watch the scene with the Audio Commentary on the DVD, GL says the same thing...

    2) Cut to the Tusken massacre scene. When Anakin is going crazy on the Tusken Raiders, who is it that hears Qui-Gon's voice?? Anakin, most likely, and Yoda....it is Yoda who is meditating and hears the voice (the novelization goes into more depth with this scene)...it is Yoda who senses Anakin's pain...

    3) Cut to the end of the movie. Obi-Wan and Anakin are fighting about going back to pick up Padme. Finally, Anakin gives in and decides to go with Obi-Wan. Then, the scene cuts to Yoda, who is kind of off in his own little world right in the middle of a battle. He then instructs the clonetrooper to get him his ship and take him to the hanger. Why?? Because he knows what's up. He knows there is tension between Anakin and Obi-Wan, and he realizes that this tension will probably get them killed in a duel with someone as skilled as Dooku. Hence, his reasons for showing up in the hanger.

    4) Finally, jump movies to TPM. Yoda seems to be the only one who senses grave danger in Anakin's training. He disagrees with the entire Jedi coucil on the matter, but he allows it to happen anyways. Kind of like he got outvoted.

    My point is that Yoda seems to be the ONLY one who knows what's going on

    Yoda knows alot more about what's going on, than meets the eye too. I wouldn't call him incompetent in the PT. I would probably call him more overly patient, kind of a pushover. He disagrees with alot of things, but he never really stands his ground. That's Yoda's only problem with the PT. But, everybody has their faults. Everybody makes mistakes. I think that's why I like Yoda so much, he mades his mistakes and then learned from them. Best example of this was his change in opinion from TPM to ESB. "Master Yoda says I should be mindful of the future" to "Never his mind on WHERE HE WAS", respectively.

  18. ibura Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 24, 2003
    This is just a quick comment, but I just wanted to say that I think it would be really cool to see a shot in E3 of Yoda holding one of the infant twins (probably Luke) while walking....perhaps delivering the child into obi-wan's arms to take to tatooine just before going into hiding himself.
  19. Valiowk Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2000
    star 6
    I liked your essay a lot, and I must say that it really awakened me to how little we actually see of Yoda, yet how much we assume ourselves to understand of him, Jedi Master that he is.

    Yoda actually plays a relatively minor role in the whole saga, yet it is exactly his words of wisdom that most remember throughout the saga. Whether it is "Do or do not, there is no try", or pointing out Obi-Wan's or Anakin's weaknesses, it is Yoda who lets us see the entire saga from a clearer perspective.

    It is in this little green character that so much wisdom is stored. No wonder we are so emotional about him, for his appearances, though little, leave a huge impact on us.
  20. Jabbadabbado Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 1999
    star 7
    Yoda is an interesting and somewhat confusing character in Star Wars. He makes a number of interesting decision, and statements, here listed in chronological order:

    1) Yoda criticizes Anakin for his fear after leaving his mother, and decides not to allow him to be trained.

    2) Yoda allows Qui-Gon to take Anakin back to Naboo in the middle of an armed conflict.

    3) Yoda changes his mind about training Anakin.

    4) Yoda acquiesces to the decision to send Anakin on a mission to protect Padme.

    5) Yoda brings the clone army to Geonosis, and allows a large contingent of Jedi to go into a situtation that gets most of them slaughtered. He allows the Jedi council and the jedi order to become a willing, eager tool in Palpatine's master plan.

    6) Yoda flees/goes into exile. (Episode 3)

    7) Yoda pretends to put up a protest about training Luke. Why does he do this?

    8) Yoda protests Luke going to save his friends, even though it sets in motion the events that allow Vader to return from the dark side.
  21. Obi-Ewan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 24, 2000
    star 4
    I was thinking of starting a thread along these lines, but not for Yoda's sake.

    I see the saga as the story of two generations. The first generation is Anakin, Obi-Wan and Padme. The second generation is Luke, Han and Leia.

    It can't really be said that one character stays the central character throughout. Anakin/Vader is NOT the central character in the old trilogy, Luke is. Vader is the antagonist. His redemption is really only in ROTJ. It's Luke's journey that is followed in the OT.

    However, a friend of mine likes to say that Anakin is the "heart" of the saga, and while I don't agree, I see his point. The prequels are about him, and much of the things that happen in the old trilogy can be blamed on him: two of the heros are his children, killing Obi-Wan forces Luke to find another mentor, and it was his turn to the Darkside that creates the Empire.

    However, one could easily argue that it is Padme or Obi-Wan. Padme has been at the center of two of the prequels so far. She was Queen of Naboo in TPM, and the film was really about her trying to help her people. The second one begins with an assassination attempt, and while her role in Episode III is unknown, she does give birth to Luke and Leia, and Leia follows in her footsteps.

    Obi-Wan trains Anakin, and is a central character in the prequels. He is also instrumental in setting up the originals. He helps hide the children, he is the person Leia is trying to recruit when she is captured, and he hires Han to take them to Alderaan, so he is responsible for putting together the ensemble. He is always brought up when Luke meets Vader.

    However, if I had to pick one character who is central to the entire saga, it's Palpatine. The prequels so far have been about his attempts to gain more power, and it is his Empire that Luke and company fight in the OT. The saga ends with his death.
  22. chieftan_1111 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2002
    star 3
    I disagree, i think that the saga is definately centered around Anakin and his family...Palpatine gets very little screen time in the movies and zero screen time in ANH.....
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