Amph The Style of Spielberg

Discussion in 'Community' started by StarDude, Apr 18, 2006.

  1. Spider-Fan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2008
    star 4
    Not really. When people say this one doesn't need to be remade because the original will always be better, its no more silly. If you want to distinguish what films do or do not need to be made, let alone remade, I take issue as its an absurd statement to begin with and its casting your judgement above others. People will decide for themselves what they want to see for better or worse and Hollywood will make the movies that sell. Right now remakes sell. There isn't much that can be done about it but not go see them.

    I don't see how its any different than any other hallow trend Hollywood goes through. The only difference is that we are living through this one and for the most part its getting old. But Hollywood will survive, it always has (mostly). It will evolve with the tastes of the masses (for better or worse)...when one trend is no longer profitable a new one will be found and followed in almost formulaic fashion.

    But the trends will never end, be they musicals, westerns, war movies or the current trends of geek culture and sequels/prequels/remakes/reboots/re-imaginings etc.

    You may be affected as a film maker by the current uncreative, uninteresting trend but you would be anyways regardless of what trend it is. Its just the nature of the business.

    I am also bothered by the notion that the existence of trend films somehow eliminates the possibility of original creative films. They still exist and won't go anywhere. But as always they require a little more effort to find as even among the "original" material the majority is crap.

    Which is another point about this that bothers me. People suggest that because the majority of a trend is garbage that it shouldn't be made forgetting that this is a constant regardless of trend. Its Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap. The difference is perspective. We are living through the crap while the 10% will live on just as it always has, we just can't see the 10% because it has been distilled through time yet.

    I dunno, maybe I am wrong but thats just how I see it.
  2. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    Martin Scorsese and Tom Cruise once screened William Wyler's "The Heiress" starring Olivia de Havilland, Ralph Richardson and Montgomery Clift with the idea of remaking it. After the screening, they apparently decided that it couldn't be improved upon.

    That's not only correct; it's rare wisdom in Hollywood(the cast were all at their best, and Richardson's best is truly formidable).

    "Harvey" is an extremely silly movie with a dumb self-flattering premise (the drunken, irresponsible man is wiser than anyone else. Yeah, right). It's still watchable, however, because James Stewart could insinuate his warmth and charm into just about anything and get away with it, and because the audience has all sorts of positive history with him. But...separate him from this movie, and its profound stupidity will be exposed for what it is.

    Some movies *cannot* be successfully updated. IMO this is one of them.

    See also: "Always" & "Love Affair"
  3. Spider-Fan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2008
    star 4
    I disagree with this notion. I think some movies haven't been successfully updated and some movies would prove incredibly difficult but I can't agree that they couldn't be remade. Perhaps I am naive but I am not ready to dismiss the possibility, even in the face of overwhelming failure after failure.
  4. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    This movie got by in the early 50's, but the audience is nowhere near unsophisticated enough for it now.
  5. Spider-Fan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2008
    star 4
    The idea can be evolved and given the garbage audiences gobble up each week a the cinema I find it hard to believe they are so discerning they couldn't buy the concept.
  6. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    We'll see, then, I guess.
  7. Spider-Fan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2008
    star 4
    I will agree that the whole thing can fail and most likely will (again Sturgeon's Law), but I don't want to dismiss it pessimistically without having seen anything. I would prefer to remain optimistic about it and if nothing else I still have the original.
  8. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    But you won't have the original, that's the problem. Libaries and rental stores will only keep the crappy remake.
  9. Spider-Fan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2008
    star 4
    Libraries and rental places have always been unreliable resources, though most libraries I have been to that actually carry DVDs generally favor classics rather than remakes, let alone current or recent releases.

    And there is no shortage of resources to find the movie if you want: Amazon, Specialty Video Shops, Ebay, TCM/AMC etc.

    If you can't find this movie you aren't trying hard enough.

    Not to mention I will still have it because the remake doesn't eliminate my copy of the film. :p
  10. Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2000
    star 7
    I think the film is pretty great actually. I don't think it 'got by' at the time and I don't think I'm particularly 'unsophisticated.'
  11. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    The film loads the sympathy on Stewart's side. Would he be so lovable a drunk if he had a wife and children?
  12. JohnWesleyDowney Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5

    In Harvey, Stewart's got to be the most mild mannered, pleasant, affable drunk in the history of movies. The last time I was at a restaurant or bar anyone who was drunk was loud, obnoxious and argumentative, no matter the topic of discussion.
  13. Ambassador Cara Jade Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 6
    It could be interesting, and I try to give movies the benefit of the doubt til I've seen them, but I really wonder who on Earth they could possibly cast in the Jimmy Stewart role that had HALF his charisma.
  14. Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2000
    star 7
    No. That's why he doesn't. This would also be the logic behind Groucho Marx not being a serial killer in any of his movies and Rhett Butler not being a seventy year old hunchback in Gone with the Wind.
  15. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    That doesn't compute. Just transpose the sister and niece into a wife and child, and he's not so affable.
  16. JohnWesleyDowney Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5

    Additional information. Looks like he'll be shooting by early next year. Which seems strange, it only took ten weeks for pre-production on that massive War of the World movie, so why so long to get up to speed on Harvey? It's got to be a smaller picture.

    Spielberg's next movie
  17. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    He may be waiting for the availability of a cast member.
  18. JohnWesleyDowney Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5

    That's a good point, hadn't thought of that, makes perfect sense.

    I can't wait to see the first "one sheet" poster. If it's brilliant enough, it might overcome some of the skepticism of some people over the remake. Not Zaz of course, but you know, OTHER people. ;)
  19. Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2000
    star 7
    I think Zaz has a higher chance of losing his skepticism over this movie than I do. I really hope something keeps this from happening. I have zero faith in Spielberg to pull of this story without sentimalizing it to the rafters, zero faith in Tom Hanks, Will Smith or any other living actor to pull of Stewart's performance and zero faith in any screenplay to capture the wit and magic of the original. The original is a great film, I think; Zaz doesn't. On the whole, I think this is the most skeptical I've ever been about a remake.
  20. JohnWesleyDowney Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5


    I think a lot of people will be gunning for Spielberg, if there's a drop of emotion in a scene, people will yell, "aha! See, too sentimental! Typical Spielberg."

    But what is sentiment really, but emotion?

    The fact is most people are emotional creatures and they go to the theatre to have an emotional experience, not an exercise in restraint and stoicism. RE: Titanic.

    I would agree that a remake of Harvey does sound like a terrible idea, and my initial
    reaction was negative. That's a film I've loved since I was a kid.

    If the script is a fresh or innovative take on the story and characters, and if Spielberg
    carefully modulates any excesses, it MIGHT work. Let's give it a chance.

  21. Drac39 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 2002
    star 6
    I wonder how much of the original film he will use as a starting off point because the play is still beloved in it's own right. I think how this film will fail if it does is the switch to the contemporary surroundings that was hinted at. The story's a little too schmaltzy for this generation. It might work with Tom Hanks in 1940's setting but not with Will Smith in 2010
  22. Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2000
    star 7
    There is a difference between emotion and sentiment; emotion is Schindler's List, which was deeply, powerfully and profoundly moving; sentiment would be The Terminal which was calculated to hit all the right drippy, gooey buttons and didn't have a single moment of real human emotion in its entire running time.

    Save Stanley Tucci, but then he's routinely the best thing in his movies, so you kind of saw that one coming.

    I have no problem with emotion; as you say, all art is about emotion. But when films are calculated to be deeply maudlin, it just sickens me. Because that's not real human emotion; that's not how real people feel. It's Hollywood emotion. Emotion is great, but only if its real emotion that you can legimitately connect with.
  23. JohnWesleyDowney Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5
  24. solojones Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 27, 2000
    star 9
    Interesting. I like Downey a lot but I'm starting to worry a touch about overexposure with him. I certainly don't want to feel tired of him in a year or two.

    Rogue, here's the thing with what's real or artificial emotion on the screen... ultimately, that doesn't matter. Sure, real emotion in acting, writing, etc is an admirable thing to have, objectively. But ultimately it doesn't matter whether the emotion on screen is real, only if the emotion produced in the audience is real. Which of course is different for every person. There are plenty of films with realistic characters for whom I felt nothing. There are also some films which might be considered to have less artistic quality, but which for some reason or another in myself really connect with me.

    -sj loves kevin spacey
  25. Zaz Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 1998
    star 9
    Downey is an interesting choice...certainly better than Hanks.