Senate The US Politics discussion

I would add to that, Shane:

(3)(i) The United States should seek to disengage the Palestinians from any meaningful peace talks, as Israel's place as a democracy will eventually win them over and away from their silly quest for statehood

 

Lolz x 200

Good job Obama! Unemployment still up, amnesty with no plan for the long term, fumbles Benghazi, IRS/Tea Party, Justice Dept is run by some vindictive puppet with a racial chip own his shoulder, Putin pretty much does whatever he wants, black unemployment -- what is that up or down? Obama witnesses first American beheaded by ISIS. Response: golf! Durrrrr. Even though I disagreed with many of W's actions, I could at least respect the guy. I think he genuinely wanted to be respectful of the office, and a good steward of American prosperity. Unlike the complete amateur we have now. What were his accomplishments before becoming the Peace Prize Prez? Oh, nothing. He was a lowly state senator with no accomplishments, and US Senator for a whopping two years. Why was he elected if he had no track record, major accomplishments or anything to qualify him? What was it that qualified him?

 

Because you're full of cutting edge political insight.

 

Oh this old canard. The only presidents who have the experience to be president are ex-presidents. Get it?

By your standards Lincoln shouldn't have been president.

 

1. Unemployment is down, not up
2. He has a fully detailed immigration plan that has already been passed by the Senate.
3. Again, check the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Black unemployment has been trending downward and is lower than it was at the time of the 2008 election
4. You're complaining that one person got killed by a group that literally just started existing less than two years ago? Really?

In sum, you have some whining about personalities, crediting other Presidents that time travel doesn't exist, and a bunch of facts that are incorrect. Wow. You really showed us, huh?

 

How could you respect George W Bush?

He was an idiot who destroyed US prestige by listening to even bigger, more dangerous idiots.

I note that the beheadings IS conduct are not different in any material sense to the beheadings conducted publicly in Saudi Arabia and the hysteria, well, it's just the ignorant being ignorant.

Correct me if I'm wrong - and as I'm not an American conservative I'm not immensely stupid and therefore, not wrong - but was not Daniel Pearl executed by the Taliban under W's watch?

As someone who is sympathetic to the Conservative Party in the UK and Liberal Party here, I can only express my contempt for the American Right. Proudly anti-intellectual, capricious, small minded and ignorant they nonetheless don't shy from sharing their thoughts as if the mere fact they thought was significant.

If you were to sterilise all American conservatives, the net effect is probably that both the national IQ, and the percentage of Americans holding passports, would surge by triple digits in one generation.

 

I only tolerate insults when the come from Ender.

 

Who, as he is oft to remind people, has both academic and practical experience in international politics.

Such an insufferable prat.

 

It would take crippling sanctions on Iran and continuing the increase in American oil production from hydraulic fracturing as a start. The next step is probably making it explicitly clear to Iran than an attack on Israel with WMDs would be considered an attack on the United States with WMDs.

Unfortunately, Barack Obama is America's Neville Chamberlain.

 

You're not just full of crap, you're officially full of crap!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...49a070-71dd-11e4-ad12-3734c461eab6_story.html

 

Smuggler do you enjoy infantile extremist idiocy as a hobby, or is this more a side effect of being raised in a conman's cult?

Iran's nuclear ambitions are actually nothing to do with America. I know this is a shock since America's everything (it's not) but they are developing nuclear weapons for what is in fact the most common reason people develop nuclear weapons - to bolster their regional or global influence.

Let me list states who have acquired nuclear arms and their reason:

United States: First state to do so; decided good way to slaughter millions of civilians to facilitate the end of the war.
Russia: Developed to bolster their influence on world stage; maintain as deterrent against American aggression post WW2.
United Kingdom: Bolster influence
France: Bolster influence
China: Bolster influence; act as deterrent against US and USSR aggression
Israel: Deterrent, also excuse to add to the laundry list of grotesque human rights violations by imprisoning a whistle blower. Marvelous chaps, good chums of democracy
India: Bolster influence; act as deterrent against Pakistan
Pakistan: Bolster influence; act as deterrent against India
North Korea: Bolster influence, though they will claim it's a deterrent (it's not)

Let's go back and count the number of states who use being a member of the nuclear club to their political advantage: 7.
Nation states for whom there was no influence: US (because you came first), Israel.

I don't want Iran to have them, but let's face it - your facile neoconservative world view had its 15mins of fame snatched back from it because you and your ilk are commendably ill-equipped to handle the nuance of politics. Children have more accurate and complex world views, and we generally don't seek their input either.

So trying to strangle Iran, based on what can only be applauded as the spectacular failure of sanctions to ever accomplish a goal ever, will only succeed in causing them to resort to liaising with states who aren't bowed by US influence anymore. Engagement with, not dictating at, Iran is the best path forward.

Oh and Obama is not Neville Chamberlain. The reason the Russias of the world don't respect America is because the imbecile you voted for ruined the US' prestige. Mr Bush is unarguably the worst leader America has ever had, and no other leader has made you as hated, ignored, and overbearing as he has. You will see it as strong, but I suspect you haven't traveled much and don't really ever get involved in diplomacy (though from dealing with American diplomats who are also very prescriptive in how others ought think, they're not nearly as offensive as you are). I could list things which would have made a better President than Mr Bush, and who would have damaged the US' prestige less, but it would basically involve going through every Wikipedia article ever and just excluding the George W Bush article. That's right - Pol Pot? Better than Dubya. Smallpox? Better. Magnesium? Better. Some Like It Hot? Obviously better.

 

I'm not saying only ex-Presidents have experience, I'm saying any experience in Obama's case. He is/was a complete amateur. Curious that you point to Lincoln, in comparison with Obama. Before delivering the DNC speech in 2006, what were his major accomplishments? Was he a leader in the business world? Academia? Did he run a state government? Uhmmmm. Ok. Do you think in any other sector of society, having no experience is a qualification for having the top spot?

 

I guess JediSmuggler never heard of Richard Nixon.

We were at the height of the Cold War. China, the largest country on the planet, had obtained a nuclear weapon.

Did we preemptively bomb them? Did we isolate them as Romney recently suggested we do to Iran?

No, we……opened diplomatic relations with them.

WTF?

Yes, hear me out:

Now the realists would suggest we were merely trying to triangulate against the Soviets. But, the point is that opening with China began a process that persists to this day: major trade partnerships and a love of capitalism, even in their own state-managed form, as well as a willingness to participate in major global institutions.

So Nixon's response to a nuclear China led to the relationship we see today between us.

I would really really prefer Iran not get the bomb. But I would also prefer most, if not all, countries didn't have them at all.

But there is a precedent for us living with and actually improving relations with a nuclear power we weren't exactly on friendly terms with. We can change views and minds about this.

 

The Republican Presidential nomination for the year 2000?

 

Although I suspect you already know as much, the House report has already been challenged, and leadership has stated they will re-appoint a Select Committee with the new wave of Republicans. And the report did not include White House or State Department responses. I'm sure you'll say its partisan nastiness as it's finest, but whatever. Did they ever answer how Susan Rice came up with blaming a video maker for inciting the protests, when obviously that was not the case?

Still working on Fast and Furious, and the IRS - Lerner emails disappearance too. Again, probably all conspiracies by Birthers or something, right?

Ender Sai Are you referring to GWB who was the Governor of a large and populous state, with the 15th largest economy in the world, who was well liked (and still is), and had milestones to point to? No problem that you're not a fan. I don't think "being loved by the world" was ever a criteria I used when voting. And other than you, and a few others state-side, we really generally don't care all too much if you think we should get the approval of France or Australia before we collectively take a ****. I do, in fact, recall that when we went into Iraq, GWB went to Congress first, and we went in with a "Coalition of the Willing", which included Aus, GB, and Canada amongst others.

 

Yes, and something you don't find in the US - an intelligent conservative - hammered the situation recently here.

Notwithstanding the fact that we were all duped by manufactured intelligence and all that with your coalition, the invasion has proven to be an ill-thought out mess.

And the fact that other imbeciles like Mr Bush does mean a thing. Presumably people have tendered votes for Sarah Palin too, and yet the breadth and depth of her ignorance never fails to take the breath away.

Mr Bush did a thoroughly commendable job of dismantling his father's legacy and the family name, and that's all that can be said really.

 

Unemployment is still far over what was during GWB or Clinton, including black unemployment, you might want to spend some more time on that BLS site. Sure there was a recession, so what did Obama do? Healthcare, now immigration. Hey let's check back in a few years and see how mass Hispanic migration affects black unemployment? I'll quote BHO here, since he's an expert in business,"the number of immigrants added to the labor force every year is of a magnitude not seen in this country for over a century..... It also threatens to depress further the wages of blue-collar Americans and put strains on already overburdened safety net".

He has an immigration plan that no one supports.

In the context of world affairs, golfing after a pretty credible threat? What did he do after Benghazi? Fundraiser or golf? To Ender's point, does the world love us more now, or has our influence been expanded because of our show of tact when dealing with complex geopolitical issues. Out of Iraq, Afghanistan, or GITMO? Russia a lesser threat or more of a threat?

 

We've all seen how wonderfully Mr Bush handled the news of the 11 September attacks.

deathraygun, how many staff report to you now?

 

Y'all, I'm just so excited we have a Benghazi truther in here.

Anyway, about that Bureau of Labor Statistics website:

October 2014: http://www.bls.gov/news.release/archives/empsit_11072014.htm
Both the unemployment rate (5.8 percent) and the number of unemployed persons (9.0 million) edged down in October.
Black unemployment rate: 10.9

October 2008 (before Obama was elected): http://www.bls.gov/news.release/archives/empsit_11072008.htm
Nonfarm payroll employment fell by 240,000 in October, and the unemployment rate rose from 6.1 to 6.5 percent
Black unemployment rate: 11.1

So, black unemployment down by two-tenths of a percent, but still down. Overall unemployment down 0.7%

 

That had better be an ironic "y'all", Dani.

 

Ender, lay off the snark or you'll get burned. You know NOTHING, and don't dare treat 9/11 so cavalierly.

 

Despite Mr44 inexplicably believing I was Australian a few days ago, I am, in fact, a proud Texan and will use "y'all" as sincerely as I please.

 

As the resident NYCer who lived through the attacks, I give Ender my blessing to talk about it.

/fistbump

 

I don't object to him talking about it. What I do object to is the smarmy attitude I feel came across in his post.

 

deathraygun calls out Obama's behavior after Benghazi, so Ender mentions Bush's behavior after 9/11 in reply. Both of those are factual events, I'm not seeing what the problem is?