Lit The Union of Soviet Noghri Republics

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Mar 21, 2013.

  1. Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn The Other Saga Moderator

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    This is just a cool little thing I'd never noticed before. A lot of Tim Zahn's names and words seem to refer to/describe character or place or object attributes. I'd always associated Kabarakh as a word with the Black Stone, part of the Kaaba site at Mecca (Kaaba Rock, get it?). Rukh could be a modified spelling of 'rook' - apparently the Persian spelling of the word is in fact the same as the Star Wars version anyway.

    But I was just reading about the dissolution of the Soviet Union, and words started to look familiar. Karabakh (yeah, the r and the b are flipped around, big deal) is a region that attempted to secede in 1988. Rukh was the name of a political group in Ukraine around the same time.

    Given the era, I wouldn't be surprised if these words were somewhat-intentional references, perhaps combined with the above meanings as well. The Noghri as a conquered nation, rebelling against the "Evil Empire." Pretty obvious when you look at it like that, but since I'm too young to have made any of those connections at the time (or really, to have known what was going on at all), it's a cool connection to me now. It also will probably influence the way I imagine the Noghri the next time I read the books, the 'texture' they and their culture and planet all have in my mind.

    Yep.
    Last edited by Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn, Mar 21, 2013
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  2. FatSmel Jedi Grand Master

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  3. Dr. Steve Brule Force Ghost

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    I was thinking the other day how, even when the USSR was still relevant, there didn't seem to be any attempt to link the Empire to it. The mention of nationalization in the ANH novel is probably the one communist-ish thing I can think of, and even that's contradicted by Lucas's own outlines where the Emperor came to power thanks to the trade barons, and near-contemporary Han Solo novels having the Empire set up the free trade Corporate Sector.

    I suppose there are some real world reasons why this is so. Lucas's own political sympathies probably made him not want to A) Play into the elevating Cold War tensions at the time, and B) Play into the Reagan administration's appropriation of Star Wars for their own Cold War purposes (Evil Empire, Star Wars missile defense). Plus Lucas drawing inspiration from WWII air combat films would of course make the Empire the Nazis, not the Soviets.

    Then there's the fact that most of the EU during the time the USSR existed couldn't really touch the Empire itself, and after, who's really going to care? Plus if you have stuff like Imperial commissars running around a certain other litigious space opera license holder would probably step in...
  4. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    I want fan art of the thread title, like, yesterday.
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  5. Gorefiend Chosen One

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    [IMG]
  6. GrandAdmiralJello Community and Lit moderator person

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    Post Cold War WEG stuff had a little of it. COMPNOR's bureaus, in particular, smacked more of Soviet stuff than Nazi, for instance. I think it was less an attempt to compare the Empire to the USSR (especially since under WEG, Imperial ideology was as far from communism as you can get) and more an attempt to combine various aspects of totalitarianism regardless of particular ideology.
  7. Gorefiend Chosen One

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    There is also the whole nationalization of commerce thing that ANH alludes to.
    He still does, by secretly getting them to wage a war and allies with other commercial powers to fight those he got into starting the war, greatly reducing the influence of both “loyalists and separatists trade barons” in the process.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_economic_zone ;)
  8. General Immodet Jedi Grand Master

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    Honoghr = Hongaria?
    => the Hungarian Revolution?
  9. fett 4 Chosen One

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    I think it was more a mix of things. The Emperor was originally a Nixon like figure and of course Endor was based on Vietnam.

    While the Imperials themselves had obvious Nazi ish undertones with the Uniforms and terms like StormTroopers and of course the dog fights in ANH were very WW2 esq.

    Then you have the Jedi who are very Samurai ish and the whole Jedi/Sith thing was based on the Shaolin Monks and there destruction by there rivals (forget the name).

    You also have Ancient Rome with the Republic turning into the Empire amd that side.

    We have not even got to the fictional elements such as Dune/Lord of the Rings and of course Kurosawas work like the Hidden Fortress which were used heavily.
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  10. GrandAdmiralJello Community and Lit moderator person

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    Yeah, but that's just one aspect of totalitarianism. The fascists nationalized industries too. The point is that the Empire was never meant as a precise USSR analogue (nor could it ever be), but rather it captured aspects of despotic and totalitarian governments and ideologies throughout.
  11. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    Does that make the VC the Stormtroopers, or the Ewoks?
  12. Reveen Jedi Grand Master

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    Stop me if I'm misunderstanding either regime, but the Empire always seemed more like the Nazis mixed with to me, based on the feeling that the people in charge were mostly greedy thugs who used the state to get their way, with a bit of British colonialism mixed in. As opposed to the soviet union being alot more of a omnipresent monolith. Are there any supplemental materials where the Empire uses the whole "unperson" tactic?

    Anyway, the stuff in the OP is alot more interesting than the usual Star Wars method of coming up with names, AKA mashing together syllables and consonants like a literary caveman.
  13. fett 4 Chosen One

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    Ewoks
  14. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    Then who are the Rebels?
  15. Lugija Force Ghost

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  16. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    Does that make Leia Jane Fonda?
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  17. fett 4 Chosen One

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    There not Americans as the Imps have American accents in RTJ but Lucas has always said that was based on Vietnam
  18. Gorefiend Chosen One

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    Soviets and Chinese [face_whistling]

    The Emperor had it done with some of the Jedi and several of his political opponents.

    Most Socialists do as well, but as you mention of course the Empire is meant to be more of a totalitarian state as a whole stand in then anything truly analogous, with a healthy dose of evil magical kingdom added to the mix.
  19. General Immodet Jedi Grand Master

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    That makes me think of the discussions in the sixties, seventies and eighties when some people were anti-American and some people were anti-communist.
    Often, the tensions got a bit overheated, leading to massive protestations and things like that.

    Well, I am talking about what took place in the EU...
    Last edited by General Immodet, Mar 23, 2013
  20. General Immodet Jedi Grand Master

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    Back in the day, a lot of people (also many writers and painters) were against the American involvement in Vietnam and Korea.
  21. Chewbacca89 Force Ghost

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    Really? :eek:
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  22. Iron_lord Chosen One

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    Writers and painters aren't people? :confused:
  23. Chewbacca89 Force Ghost

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    Nope...they are pods.
  24. Iron_lord Chosen One

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  25. Chewbacca89 Force Ghost

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