The Video Game Draft Version 2.0 Beta

Discussion in 'Games' started by DarthIntegral, Jul 26, 2006.

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  1. KiwiRogue Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2005
    star 4
    Ah yes, I can see that. And the only real way to fix that would be to split it into two lists, the PL, which is 2 picks max, and a higher list (Omega List?) that is only 1 pick max, which does have the cream of the crop. Of course, that list would only have at most 20 characters for variety, and it would make the first picks way too obvious. I guess going down to 2 could be better (though annoying now we have to move about 30 or so characters onto the RL now).
  2. DarthIntegral Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    I'd be fine with abolishing the Power List completely.

    I'd be fine with a two-tier power list.

    I'd be fine with a much smaller power list, limited to two picks per team.

    Shall we put it to vote?
  3. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    That wouldn't work well, because if there are 20 guys on the Mega List (or whatever you want to call it) and only 16 GM's, that leaves four REALLY good characters undrafted. And if the list were to be cut down to only 16 (so no crazy good guys got left out), the GM with the last pick would basically be screwed. And having the next pick wouldn't really make up for it.

    I think with a few people on the side of cutting the PL to two per team and shaving a bunch of characters off, and everyone else on the side of increasing the PL and giving four guys per team, the only logical answer is to just keep the formula we already have. And it makes sense. It worked quite well for this last draft, which was competitive, with plenty of power per team and GM's getting rewarded for solid drafting.

    I think 7-8 additions (or maybe lesS) to the PL from last draft should be made. Then there would be more selection in the PL, but still only 8-10 leftover guys there. And if anyone is bumped into the random number generator, there is still enough guys there (evil or good) for them to get a decent selection.

    I like the idea of 3 preps for sure though. But PLers should stay at 3 per team.
  4. EmpireForever Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2004
    star 8
    If we shave the list and cut it to two per team, then what will happen is people will end up having three to five of the current PLers, instead of just being locked in to 3, because those current lesser PLers are now on the RL list. It actually distributes the power more evenly, and you get better value picks off of the regular list.
  5. KiwiRogue Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2005
    star 4
    I agree.
  6. Shadow_of_Durron Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 2, 2003
    star 6
    I agree as well.

    And one thing I would absolutely suggest is getting rid of the big, bad (mostly) mindless beasts altogether. PL or RL, it doesn't matter.

    With a cut down to two PL per team, I don't think any of the Primal Ragers would make the PL cut, and I don't think they should stay on the RL. They were orginally put on because they were about the best I could come up with for a PL that needed just a few more picks on it last time. I can and have thought of better choices now.

    Ridley has shown intelligence and such, so he should stay. Kraid can probably go, though. And the Rampagers can probably stay because they suck so much, anyways. :p But please, please, please, go away, big World of Warcraft creatures. Please!

    Like the other beasties, they're big and tough, but they add nothing to a team. They do nothing but absolutely obliterate any sort of cohesion for any team that might choose them. Even the "good guy" Primal Rage guys do that to a degree. We have enough great characters in this draft without having to resort to adding big, mindless monsters, and they need to take a hike, IMHO.
  7. EmpireForever Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 15, 2004
    star 8
  8. Axle-Starweilder Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 6, 2005
    star 6
  9. Master_Kast7 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 12, 2004
    star 6
    Yep, I agree.



    ~Liar, lawyer, Mirror for ya, What's the difference? Kangaroo be stoned, He's guilty as the government~
  10. The_Chim Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 16, 2001
    star 6
    I agree, thrice over.







    I think.
  11. DarthIntegral Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    So, then, we might end up with:

    bold = staying on PL
    red = removed from list entirely
    blue = demoted from PL
    anyone unmarked = need input to make a decision

    Alouette (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Alucard (Castlevania)
    Ashnard (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Auron (Final Fantasy X)
    Black Knight (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Blizzard (Primal Rage)
    Chaos (Primal Rage)

    chaos (Xenosaga)
    Cloud Strife (Final Fantasy VII)

    Croix (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Crono (Chrono Trigger)
    Crowley (Suikoden Series)
    Dante (Devil May Cry)
    Dark Samus (Metroid Prime)

    Diablo (Primal Rage)
    Doctor Cidolfus Demen Bunansa (Final Fantasy XII)
    Emperor Barbarossa (Suikoden Series)
    Fei Fong Wong (Xenogears)
    Galcian (Skies of Arcadia)
    Garnet Til Alexandros XVII (Final Fantasy IX)
    Grahf (Xenogears)

    Gray Fox (Metal Gear)
    Griel (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Ike (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Lazlo (Suikoden Series)
    Luca Blight (Suikoden Series)
    Lucia (Devil May Cry)
    Kain (Legacy of Kain)
    Kefka (Final Fantasy VI)
    KOS-MOS (Xenosaga)

    Kratos (Mortal) (God of War)
    Kuja (Final Fantasy IX)
    Kyle Katarn (Jedi Knight)
    Magus (Chrono Trigger)

    Master Chief (Halo)
    Neclord (Suikoden Series)
    Nefarion (Warcraft)
    Noir (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Oda Nobunaga (Onimusha)
    Onaga (Mortal Kombat)
    Onyxia (Warcraft)
    Prier (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Ragnaros (Warcraft)
    Raiden (Mortal Kombat)
    Ramirez (Skies of Arcadia)
    Ratchet (Ratchet and Clank)
    Raziel (Legacy of Kain)
    Ridley (Metroid) (Specify Incarnation)
    Roxas (Kingdom Hearts)
    Ryu Hayabusa (Ninja Gaiden)
    Saix (Kingdom Hearts)
    Samanosuke Akechi (Onimusha)
    Samus Aran (Metroid)
    Sauron (Primal Rage)
    Sephiroth (Final Fantasy VII)
    Soki (Onimusha)
    Sora (Kingdom Hearts)
    Squall Leonhart (Final Fantasy VIII)

    T-Elos (Xenosaga)
    The Nameless One (Planescape: Torment)
    Tidus (Final Fantasy X)
    Tir McDohl (Suikoden Series)
    Vayne Carudas Solidor (FF XII)
    Vergil (Devil May Cry)
    Vincent Valentine (FF VII)
    Xaldin (Kingdom Hearts)
    Xemnas (Kingdom Hearts)
    Xigbar (Kingdom Hearts)

    Yuna (Final Fantasy X)
    Zeal (Chrono Trigger)
    Zidane (Final Fantasy IX)
  12. FatBurt Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 21, 2003
    star 5
    Garnet for me is a non entity unless prepped. I'd have her on the normal list but she's high tier there. I'd drop her out of the Power list
  13. BartSimpson-SithLord Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jan 24, 2002
    star 5
    About Vayne, while he isn't as immediately powerful a final boss as some, he has three annoying spells that should keep him on the PL, because they'll allow him to completely destroy non-well rounded characters. He has these magical barriers that he'll put up that make him immune to physical or magical attacks, or even both kinds of attacks. I know it might be a game mechanic, but it doesn't discount that he does do that. He also was using the mist at that point to bring down entire "cruiser" and "battleship", I'd say, size airships. So, yeah.
  14. DarthIntegral Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    I was leaning towards demoting Garnet. Don't see her as a top-two character on a good team without the ability to prep her.

    By the way, if I'm counting correctly, we've got 32 definately ready on my list to stay on the PL. That means a handful more and we'd be good to go.
  15. MarcusP2 Games and Community Reaper

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2004
    star 6
    I dunno about Nameless One as a power lister. He could be good if prepped since it would allow him to concentrate his abilities, but he doesn't really excel at one thing...he's got combat, magic and thief skills, but it's quite possible that he has all 3 at mediocre levels. Unless when picking you had to select which ones you wanted?
  16. Shadow_of_Durron Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 2, 2003
    star 6
    Okay, lesse here...

    First off, not knowing dinky doo about the La Pucelle or Fire Emblem guys, my natural reaction is to say to demote all of them. But that's just me and my uninformed opinion there, so...

    Soki needs to be on that list. And hoo boy do I mean that one.

    Saix > Xaldin or Xigbar, so if they stay, he needs to stay for sure.

    Crowley needs to stay. Leveling a few mountains and rendering a sizable portion of a country uninhabitable in a magical duel with Mazus pretty much = PL, IMO.

    If two other Suikoden guys stay, I guess it should be Tir and Lazlo. The Soul Eater and Punishment runes are just plain nasty. Man, I hate Lazlo and his short shorts, though. Part IV was teh suck.

    And maybe Neclord for just how hard it is to even hurt the bastard without the proper equipment and preperation... and probably Luca Blight as well. He really is one of the most hardcore and tough SOBs on the list. I know that video that was displayed made him look pretty easy, but that was a generally well-prepared setup with three solid units. Without a good bit of thought, though, he can humiliate you. Quickly.

    I guess demote Yuna to prepland with the other summoneresses.

    Don't know too much about The Nameless One.

    Roxas can be demoted.

    Does Auron really belong on there?

    Such is the sum of my thoughts on this at the moment.

    EDIT: Also, keeping a decent balance in mind is important as well. Can't have that list too villain-heavy when there really should be more hero teams tha
  17. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    Shouldn't Onaga stay on the PL? He did pretty well this draft, and that ability to repel all magic is pretty powerful. Considering that he was a decent first rounder, I'd think that he should stay.

    Is the general consensus that we should just keep it at 3 PLer's per team, or are we still deciding?
  18. DarthIntegral Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    Updating

    bold = staying on PL
    red = removed from list entirely
    blue = demoted from PL
    anyone unmarked = need input to make a decision

    Alouette (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Alucard (Castlevania)
    Ashnard (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Auron (Final Fantasy X)
    Black Knight (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Blizzard (Primal Rage)
    Chaos (Primal Rage)

    chaos (Xenosaga)
    Cloud Strife (Final Fantasy VII)

    Croix (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Crono (Chrono Trigger)
    Crowley (Suikoden Series)
    Dante (Devil May Cry)
    Dark Samus (Metroid Prime)

    Diablo (Primal Rage)
    Doctor Cidolfus Demen Bunansa (Final Fantasy XII)
    Emperor Barbarossa (Suikoden Series)
    Fei Fong Wong (Xenogears)
    Galcian (Skies of Arcadia)
    Garnet Til Alexandros XVII (Final Fantasy IX)
    Grahf (Xenogears)

    Gray Fox (Metal Gear)
    Griel (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Ike (Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance)
    Lazlo (Suikoden Series)
    Luca Blight (Suikoden Series)

    Lucia (Devil May Cry)
    Kain (Legacy of Kain)
    Kefka (Final Fantasy VI)
    KOS-MOS (Xenosaga)

    Kratos (Mortal) (God of War)
    Kuja (Final Fantasy IX)
    Kyle Katarn (Jedi Knight)
    Magus (Chrono Trigger)

    Master Chief (Halo)
    Neclord (Suikoden Series)
    Nefarion (Warcraft)
    Noir (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Oda Nobunaga (Onimusha)
    Onaga (Mortal Kombat)

    Onyxia (Warcraft)
    Prier (La Pucelle Tactics)
    Ragnaros (Warcraft)
    Raiden (Mortal Kombat)
    Ramirez (Skies of Arcadia)
    Ratchet (Ratchet and Clank)
    Raziel (Legacy of Kain)
    Ridley (Metroid) (Specify Incarnation)
    Roxas (Kingdom Hearts)
    Ryu Hayabusa (Ninja Gaiden)
    Saix (Kingdom Hearts)
    Samanosuke Akechi (Onimusha)

    Samus Aran (Metroid)
    Sauron (Primal Rage)
    Sephiroth (Final Fantasy VII)
    Soki (Onimusha)
    Sora (Kingdom Hearts)
    Squall Leonhart (Final Fantasy VIII)

    T-Elos (Xenosaga)
    The Nameless One (Planescape: Torment)
    Tidus (Final Fantasy X)
    Tir McDohl (Suikoden Series)
    Vayne Carudas Solidor (FF XII)
    Vergil (Devil May Cry)
    Vincent Valentine (FF VII)
    Xaldin (Kingdom Hearts)

    Xemnas (Kingdom Hearts)
    Xigbar (Kingdom Hearts)
    Yuna (Final Fantasy X)

    Zeal (Chrono Trigger)
    Zidane (Final Fantasy IX)

    I believe I count 41 to remain on the Power List. 32 would be drafted, and 9 would go undrafted. That doesn't seem to bad to me, but if anyone sees anyone still on there that is very borderline we should remove them, and get it down to 6-8 undrafted. Also, I haven't checked hero against villain yet for balance on the power list, so if someone could do that, it would be great
    Zizz, I'm for demoting Onaga because I'm leaning towards going with two PLs per team. I don't see Onaga as a guy who is going to carry a team to the playoffs as their #1 or #2 option. With three PLs per team, he'd stay on no doubt, but with two, I can't justify keeping him on. Unless others have serious problems with that./>/>
  19. Zizz Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2005
    star 4
    Eh, I don't know about this. I was all for 2 PLers per team, but I think we'd be better off keeping it at 3. Worked well last draft, and I don't think we need a major shakeup. One extra prep and two extra characters per team seems good enough. I think guys like Chief, Gray Fox, and Auron are good to be demoted, but some of the borderline guys like Onaga, Nobunaga, the summoners, and others on that level should just stay.

    Mind you I don't really care that much, and I'll be happy either way. :)
  20. The_Chim Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 16, 2001
    star 6
    Really Inty? That's odd, I guess I cna see what you mean but he was completely undefeated and on the All-Star team too. I figured he was pretty good.
    That's fine though, if anyone is drafting a villain team he would be a great pick, especially if he doesnt have to be a PLer.

    So we are officially going qith only 2 PL picks then?
  21. DarthIntegral Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2005
    star 7
    If I'm the only one who thinks demoting Onaga is a good idea, I won't demote him.

    I'm a dictator, but I at least like to give the people the illusion that I listen to them.
  22. The_Chim Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 16, 2001
    star 6
    Haha, no its ok. I don't mind either way, really it's up to you or you all, whatever.
  23. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    Yeah, but recall his top-end abilities when he's hit the end of the game (which is without prep). I'd figure with prep he'd get things like the Wish spell, the insane ring, etc. Pretty much he can solo most things in the game and regen to full in about 15 seconds.

    I'd agree with making people pick Rogue / Warrior / Mage specialty though.
  24. Evil Incarnate Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 18, 2003
    star 6
    Isn't that what he just got finished saying to you? that he'd do whatever he wanted anyways? :p

    anyways, am I the only one in here who's played Fire Emblem?

    Evil.
  25. JediKnight20043 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 18, 2004
    star 5
    Personally, I think we should stick with 3 PLers.

    I think that having 2 would limit the team a GM could have, and would reduce the effect of having a PL as some guys who were on the PL would be demoted.
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