Amph This Movie Didn't Use Slow Motion: Man of Steel

Discussion in 'Community' started by Jedi_Master_Conor, Nov 9, 2006.

  1. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    @Ender Sai

    Mind point it out?

    If Clark was thinking about himself, he would not risk himself to save others. His dad would be 100% dead if he did nothing.
  2. Saintheart Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2000
    star 6
    It's a pity if he did say that - for me personally, Jonathan Kent's concerns about what people will do to Clark if they "out" him work a lot better artistically if Clark's already a figure of disquiet to the folk of Smallville, but w/e. :)
  3. Violent Violet Menace Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2004
    star 4
    Yeah, I think that works better too. And Slowpoke, he was obeying his father. Isn't that the ultimate nice guy?
  4. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    You don't understand. Here is the scene broken down.
    1. Clark sees his father is injured and won't be able to escape the tornado.
    2. Clark moves to rescue his father and realizes he will have to use his powers which gives him some pause.
    3. Johnathan sees what Clark is doing and holds his hand up letting Clark know not to do it.
    4. Clark sees his father telling him no and already knowing the reason why Clark reluctantly follows his fathers wishes and does not save him.
    5. Johnathan is proud his son trusted him and is killed by the tornado but at peace knowing his son is safe.
    6. Clark is sad his father died even though he could've saved him but knows he did what his father wanted and deep down knows it was the right reason for humanity and for himself.
    Last edited by GenAntilles, Feb 10, 2014
  5. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Depend on what did his father tell him to do, in that case, his dad was about to die.
  6. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    So after saw what his dad said, Clark put himself(his power exposed) before his dad's life right?

    Kent thought more of Clark than himself because he loves his son, but wouldn't Clark do the same thing? Put his dad's life before his power problem?
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Feb 10, 2014
  7. Saintheart Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2000
    star 6
    this is the way we wash our hands, wash our hands, wash our hands
    this is the way we wash our hands, so eeeearly in the moooorniiiing...
  8. Volderon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 23, 2007
    star 4
    No he trusted his father
    Violent Violet Menace likes this.
  9. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    Yes, because that's what his father wanted. Clark was the good son and trusted his father to know what was best. Johnathan would've sacrificed himself 1000 times to keep Clark's secret safe.
    Violent Violet Menace likes this.
  10. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    For what? his dad will die if he trusted his dad.

    Kent's idea was actually, very simple, he put his son before his own life, he didn't think his own life is worthy to ruin Clark, let people know his power and possibly try to destroy him. That's why Clark grew up as such a nice guy.

    Then Clark should also do the same thing, like he did before and later, put others' life before his own safety.
  11. Violent Violet Menace Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2004
    star 4
    Watch the scene again, Slowpoke. Clark is visibly reluctant to obey his father, and wants to save him, but decides to trust his father's judgement. Clark decides to respect his father's wish, a wish he can clearly see he is willing to die for.
    Last edited by Violent Violet Menace, Feb 10, 2014
    Jedi Merkurian likes this.
  12. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    So are you saying Clark couldn't judge what's right or wrong by himself as an adult? If his father let him to step away when other need help, he would also obey?

    Clark would also do the same thing to save his father and people he cared, so it's a bit weird to see him stay back.

    He's an adult, he should have the ability to judge what's right or wrong by himself.

    Yeah his father's wish, is it more important than his father's life, in his eyes?
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Feb 10, 2014
  13. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    Clark letting his father die to honor his wish that Clark hide his gifts from the world is stupid as hell. There, I said it.
  14. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    He was also raised by Johnathan with the understanding that his powers and alien nature will cause humanity to flip it's lid and if he's discovered he'll either be carved to pieces by the government in a lab, hunted down by the government his whole life, or will have humanity trying to destroy him at every turn while he has the powers to destroy the whole earth if he was pushed.

    That was Johnathan's whole point with the school bus. Sure saving those kids seems like the right thing to do, but if the government found out and decided to kill all those kids for seeing him and carpet bomb Smallville trying to destroy him... it's not really the right thing anymore.

    Clark grew up knowing his secret needed to be kept secret. With the tornado you saw Clark ready to be discovered just to save his father despite not being ready for it. Johnathan knew that and as a good father protecting his son he told Clark 'no' and died so that Clark would be safe.

    By saving his father Clark would be rejecting him and everything he taught and tried to teach him.
  15. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Yes, I like MoS a lot, but surely Goyer didn't do well on some of the plot details.
  16. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9

    GAHHHH that's not why he does it dp, I swear to your god or mine (I don't really have one, so that's a really hollow gesture sorry), you must be trolling.
  17. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    You don't stop being a son, he trusted his father and that's it. He trusted his father to know what was right rather than trust his own instincts.

    It's a hard choice brought about by his nature. It showed far more than the Donner version how far Johnathan would go to protect his son. He wasn't just protecting Clark from the world, he was protecting the world from a Clark that wasn't ready to be discovered.
    Last edited by GenAntilles, Feb 10, 2014
  18. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Yes, we know that, let the government find out might ruin him, so he decided to let his father die, in order to keep his own private life undisturbed? Kent thought Clark's life was more important than his own, sure that's great. But if Clark thought that way, well... After that we could see he was still keep helping people. Lois told him not to heal her but he didn't listen.

    If Clark didn't do it, they are going to die no matter what, if he did it, the government might not find out, even if they did they might not do it. 100% VS let's say 30%, Why wasn't it the right thing?
  19. Violent Violet Menace Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2004
    star 4
    1. He's not yet an adult in this scene. Isn't it implied that he's a teenager in this flashback? I kind of got that vibe from the dialogue.

    2. If a man is visibly willing to lay down his life to get his way, then clearly he values his way more than his life. Being that that man is his father, the reasons for his wish are profound, and that Clark is still a teenager at this point, Clark decides to respect that.
    Last edited by Violent Violet Menace, Feb 10, 2014
    Jedi Merkurian likes this.
  20. Saintheart Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2000
    star 6
    That's mischaracterising the decision. That sequence is told to us as part of Clark's account that his father let himself die because he believed that the world was not ready, and that Clark was not fully prepared to deal with a world that would not accept him. That is the rationale, not merely a wish that Clark hide his gifts from the world. Jonathan acts out of fear for his son -- as he's acted out of fear in the other sequences we've seen up to that point. Clark has already had a childhood of being told, repeatedly, by Jonathan Kent, that's it's essential he hide his powers from the world. Irrational, perhaps. Without basis, no.
  21. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Being a son doesn't mean always agree with your parents, they also make mistakes. Clark wasn't a kid at that time, he was an adult and he clearly knew what would happen to his father if he did nothing.
  22. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    It wouldn't just be him. Martha would be thrown in some government jail for the rest of her life. Smallville would likely be quarantined, everyone's lives would be ruined. They'd be forced from their homes and some who had a lot of contact with him would be in custody being interrogated for who knows how long or just silenced permanently rather than let the knowledge of an alien on earth get out.

    That was what Johnathan would've have explained to him growing up. It wasn't just him that would suffer for being discovered, it would be everyone, and he would be a kid on his own with godlike powers being hunted to the ends of the earth. How long until he had enough and just started destroying the people chasing him? How long could he last being treated like a monster until he became one?

    That's what the decision was for Clark with the tornado. Risk all that horror and loss to save his dad or trust his father and let him die to keep him and everyone else safe.
  23. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9

    It is, of course. Clark could easily save his father -- with or without people seeing him -- he does it because his father wants him to stay hidden. This is insanely stupid.
  24. Saintheart Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2000
    star 6
    Stop freely mixing different ages and points of maturity around. In the whirlwind sequence, Clark's in his late teens, maybe 20 tops, and still listening to his father. In the scout ship sequence, he's at current age, about 30 or so. Not to mention that Clark is on his own when he heals Lois - not trying to save someone with literally dozens of people around.
    Last edited by Saintheart, Feb 10, 2014
  25. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    He was like 18 at least to me. There is no way Henry look like someone younger.

    A man's way could be changed, many people changed their way during their life, but life could not be restored, that's the difference.

    And it really doesn't affect Kent's way, if you say, it only affect Clark's way.