Top 10 Reasons LOTR will never be as good as Star Wars

Discussion in 'Archive: Your Jedi Council Community' started by Duckman, Sep 27, 2001.

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  1. VladTheImpaler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2000
    star 4
    This thread is being taken way too seriously, but oh what the hell. I have to comment on these two things:

    "No wonder, These movies are geared towards those people who CAN read."

    No way. If anything, this movie is made for the people who can't read. Or are too lazy to read, at least. I mean, if you can read, why don't you just read the books? Why go see the non-challenging movie?

    "So? 'Lucas directed Howard the Duck.'"

    No! That's not true...that's impossible! Nooooooo...seriously, no. Lucas did not direct or even write Howard the Duck, he only ponied up the cash so his American Graffiti co-writers could make it.
  2. Duckman Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2000
    star 4
    "Obi-Wan Kenobi dies passively. When Gandalf dies, it's while yelling "you shall not pass!" and taking down the Balrog. "

    SPOILER WARNING, MAN! :)
    And doesn't Gandalf come back to life, anyway?

    Speaking of ignorant, anyone else find it disturbing that a large portion of people on a Star Wars board think Lucas directed Howard the Duck?
    Tsk, kids these days :)
  3. Darth_SnowDog Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 10, 2001
    star 4
    Personally, I don't perceive the absence of a John Williams score as a detriment. The man is as original as Vanilla Ice. First he plagiarized Holst's (sp?) "Planets" for Star Wars... then he started plagiarizing himself! (Compare themes in Indiana Jones w/Star Wars) I dunno, maybe the fact that he's pretty much guaranteed a million dollars per film no matter what he does... and he's scoring a series that already has an established fan base of geeks who drool at the mention of "Williams"... well, it's like Steven Spielberg said about why he didn't direct Harry Potter, "For me, It'd be like shooting fish in a barrel."

    Vangelis runs circles around him. (Of course that's relatively easy for a guy who's been composing since he was four).
  4. Duckman Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 21, 2000
    star 4
    Who's doing the music to Lord of the Dance? Howard Shore? What's he ever done?
  5. DarthNapoleon Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2000
    star 4
    nothing can beat star wars. there is not even a need for a list
  6. Mastadge Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 1999
    star 7
    About the hype and whatnot: I don't care. Lord of the Rings will be awesome. Doesn't matter if it sucks; it will be awesome. And even if it sucks, whichit won't, it will still be much better than most of the fantasy films out there. Especially the R-Rated DVD...

    Really, how many good fantasy flicks are there? (since the old Harryhausen/mythology days at least)
    Conan the Barbarian
    Legend (European version)
    Excalibur
    Dragonslayer
    Star Wars trilogy.

    What do these films have in common that the countless crappy fantasies don't?

    They're not kiddified. The directors did what needed to be done for the sake of the movie, not for the sake of the studio, or the audience, or the money. If that meant an R-rating, so be it. Another thing this films had in common was great music, and great visuals.

    In TPM, Lucas sold out to the kids while still trying to appeal to the adults. AotC will not be a kid's film, it will be a SW film. LotR is not selling out to any ideal or anything, the director is making a movie version of his interpretation of the books. He's doing it with a cast ranging from competent to great, with a good special effects team, and with passion. It will be good.
  7. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    Exactly, Mastadge. Those movies had class, and they took the genre seriously--as opposed to something like D&D, which turned the whole thing into a bad joke.

    To make fantasy work, you have to do what Tolkien did, and give it dignity and realism. I expect LOTR to give the genre a huge shot in the arm (which works especially well for me, as I'm a fantasy writer myself).

  8. GrandAdmiralPelleaon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2000
    star 6
    ---------------------------------------------
    My geeky fanboy movie is better then your geeky fanboy movie!

    ---------------------------------------------
  9. Rokangus Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 5
    Mastadge: Doesn't matter if it sucks; it will be awesome.

    I'm sorry, but aren't those two qualities mutually exclusive?

    And another thought just came to mind. Special effects do not make a great movie. I offer up Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon as my ultimate evidence. All the George Lucas magic in the universe can't cover up a shoddy plot.

    Which is also esentially why I'm not letting my hopes up about AOTC...
  10. Mastadge Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 1999
    star 7
    Mastadge: Doesn't matter if it sucks; it will be awesome.

    I'm sorry, but aren't those two qualities mutually exclusive?


    Not at all. The movie can suck, and yet I can still be awed by the battle scenes, special effect, music, or whatever.

    And we already know LotR has a great plot, so we don't need to worry about special effects being the sole positive bit.
  11. ElfStar Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 24, 2001
    star 4
    The reason people were disapointed in tPM was because of the poor acting and story, something which definitely appears to not be true for LotR.
  12. BYOB_Kenobi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2000
    star 5
    1. Star Wars has badass Jedi as the heroes. Lord of the Rings has little people singing songs.

    The Hobbits? Judge them by their size, do you? And one should never deny the power of music to change the world.



    2. Sword and sorcery is only for nerds.

    Y'mean like lightsabers and the Force? ;)



    3. The books are too hard to read.

    Perhaps it overwhelms your vocabulary, but not mine. Besides, if books didn't take effort to read, you wouldn't learn nuthin'.



    4. George Lucas has two films on the AFI top 100 list. Peter Jackson is the director of Brain Dead.

    ...And "Forgotten Silver" (1996) and "The Frighteners" (1996) and "Heavenly Creatures" (1994) and "Meet the Feebles" (1989) and "Bad Taste" (1987). I'll take an indie director over a mass-marketing-and-merchandising weasel any day. The AFI? Pfff... What do they know?



    5. Star Wars appeals to both kids and their parents. LOTR appeals to lonely fanboys who spend all day posting insults on Aint It Cool News.

    I've seen alot more parents read LOTR to their children than "Star Wars," so I don't know where you're getting this information from.



    6. Star Wars has cool spaceships that they can turn into cool toys. LOTR does not.

    I think this only goes to prove against your argument.



    7. In LOTR, the ultimates destructive power is a ring. In Star Wars, it is a giant freaking space station with a super lazer.

    In "Star Wars," the evil mastermind is a mortal human. In LOTR, the evil mastermind is essentially the immortal right-hand man of the devil itself.



    8. Natalie Portman is way hotter than Liv Tyler.

    I beg to differ (I think Aerosmith would back me up on this).



    9. Star Wars has special effect by ILM. LOTR has effects by some "Ozzie" company.

    "Come come, Mister Scott. Young minds, fresh ideas."



    10. Star Wars has music by John Williams. LOTR . . . doesn't.

    Okay, you got me there; Williams is not the composer. But I have to say the music I've heard so far in the LOTR promos is very exciting, no matter who is at the quill.
  13. Mastadge Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 1999
    star 7
    Music from promos is generally jacked from other sources, we won't hear the music until we see the film.
  14. Kesel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 11, 1999
    star 4
    Here's my take on his statements:
    1. Star Wars has badass Jedi as the heroes. Lord of the Rings has little people singing songs.
    -It has a dwarf with an axe, an Elf with a bow, and two B.A. humans with swords (Strider and Boromir). The Hobbits are heroic because they're scared but they go on this journey anyway.

    2. Sword and sorcery is only for nerds
    -As opposed to The Force which is respected by all huh?

    3. The books are too hard to read
    - Well if the books are too hard to read for you than maybe a movie is more your speed. Oh wait, these are movies now aren't they? Problem solved (although I don't see reading as a problem).

    4. George Lucas has two films on the AFI top 100 list. Peter Jackson is the director of Brain Dead
    - And "Heavenly Creatures" which was a very well done film. Remember that George Lucas only had THX 1138 to his credit at one point. Jackson is going to prove himself here.

    5. Star Wars appeals to both kids and their parents. LOTR appeals to lonely fanboys who spend all day posting insults on Aint It Cool News
    -My dad read me the LOTR rings books when I was a kid. They appealed to both of us.

    6. Star Wars has cool spaceships that they can turn into cool toys. LOTR does not.
    - Neither does Citizen Kane or the Godfather what is your point?

    7. In LOTR, the ultimates destructive power is a ring. In Star Wars, it is a giant freaking space station with a super lazer.
    - The ring is unassuming as a force of evil. But there it is, the most evil object in the world. That makes it scarier to me.

    8. Natalie Portman is way hotter than Liv Tyler
    -Matter of opinion.

    9. Star Wars has special effect by ILM. LOTR has effects by some "Ozzie" company
    -That proves to get the job done. ILM is not the end all in the SFX field.

    10.Star Wars has music by John Williams. LOTR . . . doesn't.
    -LOTR has music by Howard Shore, a very capable conductor (Dogma, Se7en, The Game, Ed Wood, Silence of the Lambs)

    I know you meant this as a joke, but I wanted to defend LOTR which I feel will be a quality movie.
  15. BYOB_Kenobi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2000
    star 5
  16. Rokangus Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 5
    Not at all. The movie can suck, and yet I can still be awed by the battle scenes, special effect, music, or whatever.

    Well if you are awed by all those things then then movie must not have sucked, now would it? Once again I reiterate, you can't have it both ways.

    And we already know LotR has a great plot, so we don't need to worry about special effects being the sole positive bit.

    Correction, we know the books have a great plot. But you seem to ignore the fact that Hollywood has a long and sad history of blatantly ingoring the storyline of a book to try to try to make the movie more marketable to a wider audience. And I think a lot of you how successful those kinds of things are.

    Please, I beg all of you, don't compare the books with the movie! Like someone said, they are two different mediums and you can't expect one to be just as good as the other. You can't say that just because one was good, that the otehr will be good as well. Let me ask this. Fans of Hannibal who read the book first, what did you think of the movie? Or how about some of the folks who read The Hunt for the Red October before seeing the movie? Are you starting to see where I'm going with this?

    Hollywood ruins good books!
  17. yodaluke-wan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 10, 2001
    star 4
    agreed. hollywood will always ruin a good book. there is alot of pressure for lotr to be a great movie, so that it can live up to the book. now, this movie will be the hit or miss for the triliogy if it fails the next 2 will hardly be mentioned to be great. thats the truth. if anything i see from star wars fans is that they turn their back on it if it doesn't turn out the way they think the movie should be and since it came already from a great book that puts alot pressure on it. in all honesty you can't compare lotr to star wars. they are different type of movies. lotr comes from a book. while star wars created on the spot. totally different way to look at them. two different kind of fanasties as well, similiar but different. all this topic does have everyone including myself to fight over what is the better story and i will always say star wars, why bevcause i think it is. also i grew up on it. i only read lotr once. and that was it. i liked but i didn't fall in love with it. both of the movies are going to have their strong points and weak ones. its a matter of choice, i would rather see star wars with the powers of the force then lotr with the powers of the ring. to me the force is greater, and stronger but thats my opinion. i will always think that the jedi are the greatest heros in the world not hobbits. again its just me.
  18. Auraveda Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 5, 2001
    star 4
    Wow, everyone's so serious. It's like you all have your identity wrapped up in a movie, you have to defend it as if you were defending yourself.

    Care to lie down on my couch and talk about it?

    :)
  19. Exiled Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2001
    star 2
    Wow. another Vangelis fan around here. Didn't think I would see the day.
  20. Darth_SnowDog Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 10, 2001
    star 4
    The man is a legend. I have oh... 14 albums... less than half his released work. He said in an interview when asked why he doesn't release all the works he records that would be about 20 albums a year. He's independently wealthy so it's not like he needs the money. And I admire him for using his rare, public performances strictly for charitable purposes.

    I wouldn't mind living that kind of life!
  21. Mastadge Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 1999
    star 7
    I like Vangelis, especiall Chariots of Fire and Conquest of Paradise.
  22. jedichick81986 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2001
    star 3
    Okay...all of you LotR fans let's get something straight! LotR is boring and well...dumb.It's about a ring for God's sakes and you are going to waste your money on this! You know what Star Wars is about????? A young kid named Anakin who wants to be warrior and ends being evil and his son tries to turn him back to the good side and succeeds!!!! Not to mention it is futuristic and people in this day are really into that stuff,not medieval fantasies! All LotR has are Hobbits,wizards,and Orcs WOW! People are kind of sick of that stuff. Also sorcery is something that Christians don't like! So, don't expect LotR to be as big as you think it will be! By the way SW will always remain the King of Trilogies!
  23. yodaluke-wan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 10, 2001
    star 4
    well jedichick i will have to agree but get ready to flamed by all the lotr fans here. they dont; see the light do they. yes lotr will be huge but they expect it to be bigger then star wars and the truth is it won't. so i say all the lotr fans go watch lotr trilogies and enjoy. while i will watch the saga of all sagas. either way hopefully we all will be happy.
  24. jedichick81986 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2001
    star 3
    Well,all I have to say is it'll only last a few months hehehe!! If these LotR fans have a problem with us SW fans then suggest they go somewhere else!
  25. StarWJLC Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2001
    star 1
    Star Wars will always be better than the LOTR movies:

    1. SW is a legacy of our time and LOTR tries to be. (It is somewhat, but only as a book)

    2. The heros are ordinary people: farm boys, scoundrels/smugglers, slaves (chewie), other species.

    3. Star Wars is rooted in our cultural history and goes as far back to the philosophy of the Greeks and Romans.
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