PT TPM 3D Has Finally Stopped The "Everyone Hates This Movie" Charade!

lol Avengers

 

I was a little worried about the whole Maul-lives thing for a bit but then I started thinking about it and it came into perspective.

Anakin went through much worse and survived. Then you have Grevious who is nothing more than some internal organs and a bunch of robotics. Should Maul stay dead? Maybe/Probably. But when people come to that opinion (against his return) it should be for reasons other than the plausibility of his survival within the context of the Star Wars medical technology as we understand it.

 

I think it was the Boba Fett factor, how he was brought out of the Sarlaac pit in the EU. So they did the same thing there, but I think it was kind of lame to do that in this scenario. Maul for all intents and purposes should have remained dead.

 

Apparently Lucas originally filmed Maul's death less explicitly than it eventually made it to theaters. I think he feared the ratings board, and he probably had an internal debate over if it was appropriate for what is essentially a kids film. Afterward he apparently decided that he needed to show Maul being cut in two so as to leave no doubt that he was dead.

He apparently changed his mind, however, and approved Maul?s return in TCW (I love the show, by the way)

I wonder if he?ll leave TPM the way it is or go back and digitally alter the Maul?s ?death? so that only his legs are removed.

The interesting issue that Maul?s survival raises in my mind is about what happened after the camera goes back to Obi Wan and Qui Gon. I can almost imagine the beginning of a new Clone Wars episode starting out like The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers. Maul falls, but this time the camera (and the audience) could fall with him and pick up his adventure from Maul?s point of view?

Also of note is the fact that after Anakin is injured on Mustafar Palpatine rushes off to find him and save his life (so he can go on using him). Apparently Palpatine did not do the same for Maul. I'm assuming he left him for dead.

The preview clip of the return of Maul on TCW expresses Maul?s hate for the jedi? but I have to imagine that his hate for Palpatine (who abandoned him) might be even greater. He?ll likely also hate Dooku, who replaced him as the apprentice.

I haven't read the Darth Plagueis novel, or the Darth Maul books, but apparently a light is shed on some of these issues...

 

I'd almost have preferred it if the character in TCW turned out to be, I dunno... Maul's twin brother?

As for Palpatine... well, he certainly did go back to Naboo, but now that he was a freshly-elected Supreme Chancellor, he probably had a lot of other schemes in his mind that he wanted to implement ASAP. Plus getting around Naboo in his Sith outfit probably wouldn't have been very easy.

 

For some reason it did slip my mind that he was back on Naboo. Well that raises more questions. I wonder if he went to confirm the death of maul or just said to heck with one more dead pawn....

 

He might have gone so far as to sneak into the Naboo morgue... maybe. You know, just to say a final farewell.

"Whatsa you doingsa here, Supreme-0 Chancellor?"

"Oh, there you are, Jar Jar. I have come to see for myself the great evil we are up against. As Chancellor, I promise to put an end to the menace of the Sith!"

"Yousa bombad, Chancellor!"

 

Ironic thing is, I loved TPM at first....

It wasn't until after I joined here; then learned that G.Walton didn't have a coherent plan, that it all fell apart for me. At the end of the day, it's TFN's fault that I hate TPM.

 

You must unlearn what you have learned.

 

Nah. The 90s blockbuster was truly a pitiful sight--James Cameron's offerings notwithstanding--while quality television drama was distressingly sparse until HBO unleashed the first of its many masterpieces, Oz and The Sopranos, in '98/'99.

If TPM-animus has diminished, it's mostly because folks now realize that George Lucas was never tasked to save the world from sin. (That job was reserved for Wikileaks! )

 

I should blame Zombie.

He's the one who unleashed the secret history of the saga....


But I'm VERY that he did.
I'll take the TRUTH, every time.

 

I have this theory about the effect that the post 9/11 mentality had on the public reception of the prequels (yes, I know TPM was released in 1999, but all the more apt, as TPM is about the back-room scheming taking place before the war..)

The original trilogy is sometimes said to be a success largely as a result of its timing. Coming out of the era of Vietnam, political scandals, and other uncertainties, Star Wars was like this hopefully story right when people were ready to feel good again.

The Prequels arrived at the end of a time of prosperity. Politically and economically things were looking pretty good, but you had the Clinton scandals and some lesser terrorist attacks, then Bush.. And bam, 9/11, Afghanistan, Iraq, the economy.

TPM seems to end upbeat, but the darkness of AOTC and ROTJ are foreshadowed. Lucas is practically a prophet. As everything in the real world took a turn toward uncertainty, his films reflected a crumbling Republic where fear and want of security supplants liberty. All that negativity, on the entertainment end of the social spectrum, comes out in the public derision of the prequels. When you get right down to it, I think I lot of people refuse to like the prequels because understanding the prequels requires them to take a look at themselves and the reality we live in.

I guess what I was getting at above is that if the prequels were released in a different decade their reception, I think, would have been very very different....

 

Agreed 100%

 

The same could be said for a multitude of films, regardless of genre.

Gone With the Wind, Ishtar, Jaws, The GodFather, Ghostbusters, Schindler's List....

 

I'd have to look for it, though I don't see much of a point. To call it a "synopsis" or "fanfiction" as I did is probably giving it too much credit - It was literally like three paragraphs in one forum post, with poor grammar to boot. It was not a serious fan project or notable in any way, just another guy talking up his own ideas over Lucas.

I don't watch much modern TV, but I'd have to disagree about movie quality. As I said before, one of the themes of the SW saga is to view the past with a critical eye and learn from it, rather than just glorifying everything old. I agree very much with that message, and believe that a failure to do so is the root cause of many of the world's problems on much more serious matters.

Has anyone spent time watching a lot of old movies? Not just the classics, which often aren't as faultless as they're made out to be. But regular, plain old movies from decades ago. The stories are more simplistic, the acting and dialogue is often less subtle, and the effects are less impressive (again I will state that modern CGI blows away stop-motion figurines). In decades past, it wasn't uncommon to see sexism or outright racism in movies. Even two or three decades ago, unsubtle and blatant jingoism was far more common in movies.

Numerous studies have confirmed that the population has grown smarter over the decades. Young people today are more capable of processing complex ideas and keeping track of details. In the 1990s, we would NOT have gotten a mainstream blockbuster as complex and intricately made as Inception. People are free to have their own opinions, and not see my example there as favorably as I do. But one thing that was noted in articles was that younger people had a far easier time understanding that movie. CinemaScore exit polls showed younger audiences giving that movie an "A" grade, while older viewers gave it a weak "B-" grade. The common complaint from older viewers was that they "couldn't get it." I know from personal experience that my parents were completely lost, and unable to keep up with the plot. Now like the movie or hate it, many people obviously were able to "get it." So that's one example of mainstream blockbuster action movies being made with more craft and complexity in details.

Scifi, fantasy, and superhero movies have been utterly revolutionized by the emergence of CGI. You simply could not make a decent looking Spider-Man movie in the 1990s. But it's not just the visual effects. Modern blockbusters are written with an eye toward themes, and important underlying messages. Their plots are structured for "epic" battles that are far greater in scope and scale than what could've been achieved just a decade prior. These movies have conflicts that affect the characters and audience on more than one level. Modern blockbusters often try to get into their characters' heads and explore their motivations; before it was far more common for movie heroes to just stick to blowing up the bad guys. For example the Nolan Batman movies are not only far more intense than the Batman movies of the 1990s; they do a much better job of showing who Bruce Wayne is as well.

Now I'm not going to claim that current day movies are all intricate or intelligent. People shouldn't glorify today just like they shouldn't glorify the past. But viewing the past through nostalgia and rose-tinted glasses is far more common in online communities, from what I've seen.

EDIT: If anything, I would say that the Prequel Trilogy reflects the greater complexity found in more recent blockbuster action movi

 

Always thought that Qui-Gonn is the heart of the movie. He and Anakin, it's close to a father son movie, not quite. The people that hate TPM wanted the Luke-Han-Leia thing from the OT, and they can't handle that it wasn't a copycat of the original. It's like if you have a certain taste in music. It's one thing to say ' i like country music so Sinatra isn't my thing." It's another thing to say "Sinatra couldn't sing and he sucks"
Rewatching it yet again i thought Lloyd's acting was fine, the big Senate scene works very well, Podrace and big Duel are awesome. I really enjoyed it, and as dark as the following movies get it needed to start lighter. Lucas knew that. The haters still havn't figured it out.

 

I too have always LOVED AOTC!

It truly is the TESB of the PT for me. All the BEST parts of the back story, all the meat an potatoes are in AOTC.

I remember almost every single review at the time describing the last hour of the movie as a big satisfying payoff filled with some of the most explosive and exhilarating fun since ANH. Yes ANH!

Our 3 heroes reunite at the beginning of the movie, each go off on there own respective character transformation, then come together in the arena, each changed in one way or another and forced to fight for their lives. Begun the Clone War has! IMO thats arguably just as awesome as TESB in every way.

We got the jango fett/detective obi-wan/clone mystery as a mouthwatering, intriguing payoff to the 20 year old "what was the clone war/what was boba fetts involvement" question all inter-cut with the return of the homestead as well as the father/mother skywalker drama of how they fall in love and how bittersweet it is portrayed. All against the backdrop of a great war. Isn't that a pulp space-opera? Isn't that everything that star wars is???

Well for me it always has been!

I just really think this is all GREAT stuff. I for one think it just doesn't get any more star wars than that. IMHO people pick apart the acting because with such great stuff going on, the only thing left TO pick on is things like acting and Star Wars has never even been about acting. And as far as the complaints about the clone mystery and political intrigue being so called "contrived" I just think "wow, what a cheep shot for something to complain about". Its star wars, a 12 year old is supposed to be able to understand it and make the basic little connections, its supposed to be simple. Everyone I went to school with at the time LOVED AOTC, it was the best thing happening with the world when it came out.

Anyways I love AO

 

A prophet? Oh please. Your "evidence" is circumstancial at best.

Lucas is a filmmaker, not a religious or political figure. He makes entertaining, highly grossing movies, that is it and it is enough.

So it's the critics fault they dislike the movies? Typical. How about "tastes are different" instead?

For the record, I did enjoy watching TPM on the big screen, but there were still times when I was bored and thought the movie was lacking.

 

You sound to me like a troll, a star wars hater, and somebody who goes around never seeing anything in the world deeper than face value.

 

Right. And you sound butthurt, especially considering your response to my other post. Do you have any actual arguments to offer regarding Lucas' status as a prophet?

 

It was already explained. You called it "circumstantial evidence", as though you're a defense lawyer. By this strategy you ignore and reject the possibility that art might accurately predict anything, intentionally or otherwise.

 

No, I reject the notion that any artist might be a "prophet". Prophet has a strong religious meaning and I just don't feel comfortabel when I see this word described to anybody (at least if it is done unironically). Do you?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophet

But then I guess the belief in chosen ones is a belief that is fostered by Star Wars itself. Another thing I feel uncomfortable about. But maybe I'm reading too much into it. Anyway, I prefer being a defense lawyer rather than deluded.

 

That's exactly what I said.

Prophet in this context just means prediction, it doesn't have to be religious.

 

Perhaps he can see things before they happen?