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TPM is "winning" IMDB's Worst Star Wars Film survey. WHY?

Discussion in 'Archive: The Phantom Menace' started by BattleDroid1138, Nov 16, 2004.

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  1. openmind

    openmind Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2003
    *Waves hand* The Holiday Special isn't Star Wars...

    Minds tricks don't work on me, only Money! Pay up!!! :p

    This is where I beat Go Mer. I kinda of enjoyed it....as a kid. [face_whistling]




     
  2. The_Nameless_One

    The_Nameless_One Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 21, 2002
    *Waves hand again* The Holiday Special is NOT Star Wars [face_thinking]
     
  3. Darth Geist

    Darth Geist Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 1999
    "This is a site full of militant movie buffs: sad bastards who live in their parents' basements, downloading scripts and trading what they believe to be inside info about movies and actors they despise yet can't stop discussing. This is where you go if you wanna hear frustrated would-be filmmakers mouth off with their two-bit, arm-chair- director's opinions on how they all could've made a better Episode One.

    Actually, somebody here made up that last line; it's not in the movie.
     
  4. Obi_Frans

    Obi_Frans Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 31, 2003
    Actually, somebody here made up that last line; it's not in the movie.

    Actually, yes it is

    Right afterwards Jay says "**** i could make a better Episode I" and Bob just nods his head

    MOD EDIT: Mind your language.
     
  5. Darth Geist

    Darth Geist Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 1999
    Huh. Apparently, we're both right; that line was cut from the theatrical release, but put back on the DVD.
     
  6. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    gez, I had a reply typed out, then realized that I was just letting you draw me into another basher-gusher fight, which I would have been blamed for. So forget it.

    Bah. You did the same thing last week - I asked you to show evidence of your argument and you accused me of insulting you just so you could duck out. Well I let that go, but not this time. Don't accuse me of starting a basher/gusher fight just because you can't support your arguments.

    Now I suggest we get back to the issues under debate.

    and Padme mentions the Republic's anti-slavery laws. Hence, her buying a slave would be illegal

    Her decision to go to Geonosis was illegal too and she did that personally, she wouldn't have to personally go and buy Shmi.

    g
     
  7. openmind

    openmind Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Smells like?déjà vu :D

    Her decision to go to Geonosis was illegal too and she did that personally

    "I'm not interested in getting into a war here. As a member of the Senate, maybe I can find a diplomatic solution to this mess."

    Padme is trying to stop a Galactic war. Ie solve a huge problem that is disrupting the Republic?s stability.

    Shmi, meanwhile is one slave out of many, despite the help she has done.

    Don't forget to she goes back to Naboo despite the warnings, to save her entire people. Risky yes, but hoping to solve one big problem.

    Padme as Queen or as a Senator, is a person of responsibility. No wonder she was not in favour of using Anakin in the first place for the former and tries to solve a Republic?s stature for the latter.


     
  8. Darth_Mimic

    Darth_Mimic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 30, 2003
    At that point, she was no longer Queen of Naboo. And she had reason to believe that the people who were trying to asassinate her were on Geonosis. Plus, Obi Wan's life was in immediate danger. So, she had three good reasons to go.
     
  9. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    "I'm not interested in getting into a war here. As a member of the Senate, maybe I can find a diplomatic solution to this mess."

    Which is immediately followed by her boyfriend carving up the locals [face_laugh]
    Obi is there illegally and she hopes to find a diplomatic solution to the mess he's gotten into.

    It would be quite easy for her to send someone to Tatooine to arrange Shmi's freedom.


    Don't forget to she goes back to Naboo despite the warnings, to save her entire people. Risky yes, but hoping to solve one big problem.

    And she's in a position to do that because Shmi risked all she had to help her.
    Are you trying to argue that Padme will only do something when it involves helping an "entire people" ? Her speech to anakin is all about going to Geonosis to save a friend.


    No wonder she was not in favour of using Anakin in the first place for the former and tries to solve a Republic?s stature for the latter.

    :confused: Have you got your former and latter mixed up? In your post the mission to rescue Obi is the former and she actively encourages ani to go.



    g


     
  10. The_Nameless_One

    The_Nameless_One Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 21, 2002
    Was it illegal for Obi-Wan to be there? I thought the Jedi could go anywhere in service of the Republic [face_thinking]
     
  11. Darth_Mimic

    Darth_Mimic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Obi was continuing an investigation. His presence may have been, in the strictest sense, illegal, but he was padawan of a very reckless Jedi. He's shown himself to be reckless on a few occasions (hey, why don't I just jump onto this droid that left gross slugs in Padme's room...).

    Padme's only official recourse in dealing with Tatooine's slavery would be to go through official channels to have Republic law enforced. And let's face it, Palpatine is suddenly head of the Republic. I think he has a mutually beneficial arrangement with the Hutts, which is probably why Vader never goes to Tatooine with Executor in order to kill the Hutts who kept him as a slave before he was 'lost' to Watto.
     
  12. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    Padme's only official recourse in dealing with Tatooine's slavery would be to go through official channels to have Republic law enforced

    One of the biggest lessons Padme learned in tpm is that she can't rely on 'official channels', the senate was impotent to help her with the TF situation and so she took matters into her own hands.
    She also defied the Jedi and Palpatine by going to Geonosis.
    Clearly this is not a woman who relies only on official channels .

    The question is - would she want to help free Shmi?
    She had 10 years.
    She had plenty of resources.
    She owed Shmi a lot.
    She wouldn't have to do it in person.

    g
     
  13. Loco_for_Lucas

    Loco_for_Lucas Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2002
    There's this constant talk about "the proper channels" in freeing a slave, yet we didn't see any of it when Qui-gon freed Anakin. And it's not because he was a "maverick" Jedi. If he were breaking rules, he would have said so or he would have been told by Padme after the boy was set free.

    Besides, if there were channels to be followed in the Republic, why wasn't Anakin returned to slavery after the conflict on Naboo?
     
  14. Darth_Mimic

    Darth_Mimic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Well, we see Padme learn that official channels do not work in TPM. But, as ruler of Naboo, it is really not her responsibility to interfere with the governance of another world. If anything, it is the Jedi who should have been freeing slaves. But they cannot function without a mandate from the Senate as well.

    Here's where we see that the entire Republic system is flawed. That's the subtlety of the film. Let's face it, everything takes place in this movie for one purpose - to make Palpatine Supreme Chancellor.
     
  15. Shelley

    Shelley Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 9, 2001
  16. Eagle888

    Eagle888 Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Jan 30, 2000
    Shelley, why bother posting if all you're going to do is completely edit your posts with "nm"?
     
  17. Moleman1138

    Moleman1138 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2004
    TPM is not the worst Star Wars movie. Very disappointing results IMO.
     
  18. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    But, as ruler of Naboo, it is really not her responsibility to interfere with the governance of another world

    Buying/freeing a slave is not interfering with the governance of Tatooine. QG did it. Cliegg did it.

    Don't you think Padme would want to help this woman who risked everything to help her?

    g
     
  19. Darth_Mimic

    Darth_Mimic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 30, 2003
    The assumption is that she risked Anakin's life by letting him race. Did Qui Gonn really risk everything on this one bet, or did he have some of that famous 'Force' insight?
     
  20. Darth-Stryphe

    Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2001
    *Waves hand* The Holiday Special isn't Star Wars...

    Hasn't EU taught you anything? It's all canon, all of it -- the comics, the movies, the Holiday Special, the ESB Dixie 3 oz. cups... even this post is canon. :p
     
  21. Darth-Stryphe

    Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2001
    BTW, Gez/Shelley, let's not get into finger pointing. Just present your arguments/counter-arguments and continue in a civil fashion as you have been, and all will be good. :)
     
  22. PMT99

    PMT99 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 23, 2000
    "Buying/freeing a slave is not interfearing with the governance of Tatooine. QG did it."

    Because it was his idea to free slaves, not Padme's.

    "Cliegg did it."

    Because he was in love with her.

    "Don't you think Padme would want to help this woman who risked everything to help her?"

    If she wasn't busy governing her people on Naboo, then yes she would but as Yoda told Luke when asked if he should sacrifice his friends, Yoda said "If you honor what they fought for, then yes."

    For the greater good, sacrifices must be made.
     
  23. Loco_for_Lucas

    Loco_for_Lucas Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2002
    Because it was his idea to free slaves, not Padme's.


    So Padme doesn't need to acknowledge Shmi in any way? She's a real piece of work!

    Because he was in love with her.


    And if he could afford her, it obviously wasn't too much of a price for Padme to pay in helping her as gratitude for everything Shmi did. I'm sure the then-Queen of Naboo could find SOME means of payment. Watto obviously wasn't too unreasonable at that point.

    If she wasn't busy governing her people on Naboo, then yes she would but as Yoda told Luke when asked if he should sacrifice his friends, Yoda said "If you honor what they fought for, then yes."

    For the greater good, sacrifices must be made.


    She was obviously so busy, she couldn't personally take in refugee families and help them in their times of need. Yes, because as a Queen and a Senator, she didn't have time to help a woman who offered generosity that enabled her people to be saved, what with her frolicking in fields and having picnics, we can see she's obviously busy. Maybe she could have taken time from her romance with Paolo to help Shmi? I dunno, just a thought.
     
  24. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    Gez/Shelley, let's not get into finger pointing. Just present your arguments/counter-arguments and continue in a civil fashion as you have been, and all will be good.

    I agree wholeheartedly. And I look forward to seeing Shelley's responses.

    If she wasn't busy governing her people on Naboo, then yes she would but as Yoda told Luke when asked if he should sacrifice his friends, Yoda said "If you honor what they fought for, then yes."
    For the greater good, sacrifices must be made.


    It's directly because of Shmi that Padme has the privilege of governing her people.
    Shmi risked everything to help her.

    Padme doesn't have to risk a member of her family to help Shmi.
    She doesn't even have to go herself.
    She doesn't have to give up governing Naboo.
    She has had 10 years.

    g

     
  25. Darth_Mimic

    Darth_Mimic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Shmi traded her son's life for the chance of giving him a better life. And, like I suggested, Qui Gonn probably knew that Anni would win the podrace. He can partially see the future. He knows that The Force has something in mind for the boy.

    BTW, Cliegg buying and freeing Shmi is different from Padme buying and freeing Shmi. Cliegg is part of the Tatooine society, and is following its laws. Padme is part of Naboo society, and falls under the laws of the Republic. She can't buy slaves because, for her, it is illegal. Probably enough to get her booted from her position.
     
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