TPM Master "Plan"?

The background music and the characters' interaction with the story of his conception does not even HINT at anything other than the (pretty silly, IMO) "Immaculate Conception" theory of his creation.

I suggest you revisit the scene on Tatooine in which Qui-Gon and Kenobi are discussing Anakin's high midi count. Listen to the music turn dark. The familiar "Sith" music Williams uses throughout TPM enters as he cuts to Shmi lurking in the door entrance.

Rather ominous (and obvious) to me-- something is clearly up.

 

A few things:

1. Yes, it might not have made a ton of sense for Palpatine to stop on the street and coddle young Anakin. Now, I read Palpatine's interaction with Anakin at the parade as flippant; you all are seeing much more in it. But I think the evidence lies with me from a structural point of view, which is that while it might very well have been creepy for Palpatine to stop on the street and hang out with the young boy semi-randomly, it would make a lot of sense, and would square well with his formality, to be at some kind of dinner in the kid's honor with other Naboo dignitaries, the two Jedi, etc. What doesn't make sense at ALL, if Sidious was aware of what this kid was really capable of, was having his first meeting with the kid after the battle for the freedom of the planet be a hello at a parade (which, strangely, did not place Anakin nearly as close to the center of attention as he deserved to be). Can't you remember when you were a little kid? Most of the people on this board were probably well above average at Anakin's age, yet were somewhat frustrated that adults were rarely interested in what you had to say as a peer. You sat in the back seat of the car and played Game Boy or read a book while the adults sat ahead of you and chatted. I was raised by parents who took an exceptional amount of interest in my academic performance, who read to me and in general gave me as much or more attention as any of my peers got from their parents, but they simply did not treat me as a conversational peer when I was Anakin's age because I wasn't. This is why children tend to respond so well to grandparents; they're more likely to sit and listen to what the kid has to say, since they're not tired out from changing diapers, cooking food, and listening to the kid complain about this that or the other thing. Children respond in this way because they crave that kind of adult attention and appreciation. If Sidious was out to turn Anakin into a follower, it would not have been out of place to build the kid up a bit by chatting him up.

2. If Sidious created Anakin, why didn't he have one of his butt-kicking acolytes, or himself (who was a pretty capable fella), go snag the baby and raise him personally, to stamp out the goodness that ended up causing a spot of trouble in Episode VI?

 

2. If Sidious created Anakin, why didn't he have one of his butt-kicking acolytes, or himself (who was a pretty capable fella), go snag the baby and raise him personally, to stamp out the goodness that ended up causing a spot of trouble in Episode VI?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Sith fallen Jedi? I'm not sure that the Sith ever raise children as Jedi train younglings. Either way, there can only be two, and Sidious would need a strong apprentice to assist him in dismantling the Republic.

Sidious could monitor Anakin from a distance...guiding him/manipulating him.

 

I think you're right, they don't typically raise kids. On the other hand, they also don't typically manipulate the basic lifeforce of the universe to create super-warriors more powerful than themselves, at least based on my own understanding and intuition. Seems like special circumstances would beget other special circumstances.

Sidious "creating" Anakin is a post hoc theory pasted on in order to make things seem deeper and more interesting. In real-world terms, I don't think Lucas is capable of concocting it; his plotlines either clobber you over the head or else attempt, in a sort of Aristotelian fashion, to look straightforward while being in fact rather confusing, to which all the speculation as to the original impetus of this thread stands as testimony.

 

to which all the speculation as to the original impetus of this thread stands as testimony.

Which means your questions were more rhetorical, and no answer presented here or anywhere else could ease your dissatisfaction with the plot of the Phantom Menace.

 

I see Sidious' master plan in the prequel trilogy going something like this...

------Pre Episode I:

Sidious makes contact with the leadership of the Trade Federation. By the way he speaks to them in Episode I, it is obvious that they know that he is palpatine they know that he has the senate bogged down in proceedings) and that he is a sith. He offers them things that they cannot refuse and those are money, the planetary resources of naboo, and political power (when the plan is finally fulfilled). The trade federation was important to Sidious because they offered him something that few other groups could match. They had the ability to make war with their droids. It didn't even matter whether they were good at the art of war, because the Republic didn't even have an army to match the trade federation.

------Episode I:

The plan is hatched. Sidious sends the Trade Federation to blockade and eventually invade the planet of Naboo. He actually hopes for the entire way of life of the Naboo to be destroyed. He wants the trade federation to conquer the planet and force the government of the Naboo to sign a treaty to legitimize their control of the planet. This would have had a few advantages for sidious and the trade federation. First, the trade federation would have gained a reputation of being a force to be reckoned with in the galaxy. No planet would dare to oppose the trade federation or they would risk suffering the same fate as the naboo. This would have forced the Republic into a military buildup to counter the threat of the trade federation.

Also, Sidious was banking on the Republic folding in the face of the aggression of the trade federation. Sidious felt the would have been powerless to do anything about the invasion since they had no military forces. Even the jedi weren't powerful enough to take on an entire droid army by themselves. The fact that the chancellor would have no power to to do anything about the situation in a military fashion would be the final crowning achievement of the plan. Palpatine would have convinced another system to see his plight and call for a vote of no confidence in Valorum. The sympathy vote for the decimated Naboo civilization would put him into office.

Sidious miscalculated on one thing. He did not expect the Jedi and Naboo security to join forces with the Gungans. The Gungans were the key to the downfall of the invasion and to that point, there was no reason to think that they'd go out of their way to help the Naboo. Sidious considered them a non-factor and set about to deal with them at his convenience. Without the Gungans distracting the forces of the trade federation, the Jedi and Naboo would never have been able to secure Theed city and launch their assault on the droid control ship. Unfortunately for Sidious, the invasion was defeated and the Trade Federation did not become the galactic terror that he envisioned, so he had to go back to the drawing board for a way to sink the galaxy into all out war.

Still, the most important part of the plot came to fruition. Sidious/Palpatine got the Queen of the Naboo to call for a vote of no confidence in Valorum during her unexpected appearance on Coruscant. Also, the sympathy vote worked to greatly and Palpatine seized power of the Senate.

----Between Episodes I & II:

Sidious alters his plans slightly in an attempt to regroup after the embarrassment of Naboo. First, Sidious sets out to gain a new apprentice after the death of Darth Maul on Naboo. He finds no better candidate than a jedi who is disgruntled with the Republic and the jedi order. Converting him to the Sith proves to be no challenge whatsoever and the fact that he is already trained in the Jedi arts makes it easier on Sidious because he doesn't have to take much time to train him in the ways of the sith. The fact that he comes from a wealthy and respected lineage also fits into Sidious's plans.

The crushing of the Trade Federation made it impossible to use them as a tool of fear in the galaxy, so Palpatine found it diff

 

Great post superstardestroyer-1! There is one thing I disagree with, though. I think Palpatine had been working with Anakin long before Episode III. Ani and him are so close in EIII that it seems like he has been working on seducing Ani for many years. Its been his plan for a long time to convert 'the most powerful jedi ever' into a Sith, his apprentice.

 

Right on, Superstardestroyer!

Okay, everyone is still a bit confused about one issue: if Palpatine wanted a sympathy vote to get Valorum out of office why does he want Amidala to sign the treaty and ligitimize the invasion?

The answer is because that is the reason to how he would get Valorum out of office!

Imagine: The peaceful, backwater planet of Naboo is being blokcaded and is suddenly invaded by a massive droid army from the trade federation. Suddenly, Naboo is thrust into the spotlight in the senate by this crisis--and of course, who is the Senator? With Maul kidnapping Queen Amidala and bringing her to the Federation where she is forced to sign the treaty, Palpatine "miraculously escapes" the invasion with his duties on Coruscant--and if Amidala is killed, even better! Palpatine desperatly makes his plea to the senate-- "My beloved queen has been taken hostage and forced to legitimize the invasion of our peaceful planet of Naboo. Now she has been executed and the Naboo have been enslaved in camps! With my poor queen assassinated, i remain as the sole representative and last free survivor of Naboo. The Trade Federation's army is unstoppable! How many more star systems will fall to the Federation as my own has before we do something about it? I suggest a vote of No Confidence in the Chancellor's leadership."

The Senate is suddenly thrown into an uproar over this disturbing event--indeed, the threat of the Trade Federation is a serious one, and with Naboo secure, they could be using it to solidify their army and expand their resources. The situation with Naboo creates a huge sympathy vote and voila--Palpatine is elected Supreme Chancellor!

With Amidala escaping his clutches and arriving on Coruscant with the jedi in tow, Palpatine has to slightly re-think his plans--"okay, i guess Amidala will have to make the No Confidence vote", and from the moment she arrives, Palpatine starts manipulating the queen, trying to shatter her ever-faithful view of the Republic.

Meanwhile, the Trade Federation was supposed to start a never-ending war--they would continue to invade and gain resources and expand while Chancellor Palpatine usurped power for himself. Possibly, his plans were to persuade the jedi to fight the army, thus diminishing their numbers, which was what his plans seemed to be in AOTC--"please, jedi, this army will soon take over the republic! You are our only hope! I understand you want a peaceful resolution and so do I--this is the only way. If we stop the Federation before it takes over the galaxy, we can restore peace and I will return my Emergency Powers."

The jedi reluctantly agree, and a reluctant war is begun, with the jedi leading a hastily-put together Republic army, mostly of volunteers, while the Republic begins building up military measures for the war. Once Palpatine has manipulated things to where he wants them, and the jedi have been significantly reduced, he puts forth his Empire plan, unleashes his Apprentice Maul to dispatch the rest of the jedi and then he gains control of the Trade Federation and the unstoppable droid army for himself, solidifying his position as all-powerful sith Emperor of the galaxy.

You can see the similarities to the final plam in AOTC and ROTS--it went through a bunch of on-the fly modifications when things didnt go as planned, and luckily for him, his failures ending up working out much better for him than his original "Master Plan".

So there it is. At least, that as i understand it.

 

Nearly all of these questions can be directly addressed by reading Cloak of Deception by James Luceno.

Does it answer the questions without creating more though? If so, I for one will definitely go pick it up, but even good EU tends to introduce characters and ideas that just don't fit into the films (like Syfo Dyas ordering the Clone Army in LOE). If anyone wants to expand a little on the merits of COD, send me a PM, or post it here if it's not too off-topic.