Transformers Discussion Thread (Transformers: Dark of the Moon)

Discussion in 'Archive: Your Jedi Council Community' started by Jedi_Master_Conor, Apr 24, 2006.

  1. anidanami124 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    So there is the 1986 Transformers movie. If people want just the Transformers then just go 100% animated. If you want it live action then you need the human element.

  2. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    No one is saying there shouldn't be humans- but the movies shouldn't be only about the humans like this trilogy has been. The Cybertronian characters have a lot of characterization, interplay and dramatic potential, but (outside of Optimus and Bumblebee) they're treated as 2 scene cameos, window dressing or generic monsters. We don't care about any of them, so we don't care when one of them dies or is victorious.

    Bay just didn't trust the robots to be actual characters in the movies, plain and simple. So he filled in a dozen human characters instead and gave them a crap load of stuff to do to kill time (and nameless, generic, personality-lacking Decepticons) until the Autobots could show up for their next cameo scene or action sequence.

    We're not saying make the movie about E.T., just don't make it just about Elliot. It's about both of them. If we don't care about E.T., then we don't care about Elliot's actions. If we don't care about Elliot, then we don't care about the effect E.T. had on him.
  3. DarthMane2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 20, 2003
    star 4
    Not neccessarly. You can have the human element and still have a movie about the Transformers. I guess I have to go back a little on what I said and say that in the first movie the Autobots actually had some characterization. Though they only really had one scene, maybe 2, that showed them off a characters. Mainly the first scene where they are introduced and the scene where they debate what to do about the all spark. Just enough to make you have some feeling about them. However in ROTF both Ironhide and Ratchet to absolutely NOTHING. Except stand in the back ground, or shoot their guns. There are a lot of great Transformers characters, many of which would translate to the screen perfectly. Enough to carry a film and to have you care very much about them.

    So much was wasted because of the human element. I mean we're talking about iconic characters who were introduced in a cartoon and comic that were used to sale toys. Most people will call the original Cartoon nothing more than a toy commercial, which it was, just a really cool one. Still these toy commericals and toy advertisements had more to say about the concept then 3 big budget films. Although if the original stuff was to sale toys, I guess Bay's films are used to sale Cars.

    I don't think people come to see these movies for the human factor. IT's a bay film. IT's got explosions, robots fighting robots, pretty girls, some crappy comedy, and more explosions. If that's all people want then you could have easly gave them all that, and still had a movie about robots fighting robots, save that this time the movie would be more about the robots. And I'd venture to say that many people come to see these movies for the robots, maybe Optimus the most.

    and I hope you weren't picking on the animated movie. I'd rather watch that over any of the Bay films. "Transformers the Movie" is by no means a great movies, but it's a damn cool one. Plus the first 15 minutes has probably some of the greatest animated action ever.

    and 2nd. That joke I made about Megatron tieing his shoe isn't so far off the mark. There was one episode of the old cartoon, I believe where the Dinobots were introduced, where Megs and Starscream are standing side by side. Grimlock fires his weapon and hits Megatron. Visually it look as if it just knocked the wind out of him, but Megatron kneels down, and as soon as he does Starscream doesn't wast any time,"MEGATRON HAS FALLEN. I'M THE NEW LEADER. DECEPTICONS ATTACK." I LOL'd.
  4. Jack1138 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 8, 2005
    star 5
    These films are what they are supposed to be, gigantic 'blow up everything' summer 'popcorn rides' in the theaters. I was surprised at this review;

    Fox gives Transformers 3 a positive review

    Seems they think it is the best out of all 3. I could care less, I will see it Saturday morning. I never expected great films from this series, just some good fun and so far, that is what I got!

    I still remember being a kid and first seeing Transformers in the toy stores. A vehicle that turns into a robot?!? Forget about it! That concept just hit the home run! :)
  5. Aytee-Aytee Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2008
    star 5
    Just got back...

    1. They should have canned Megan Fox from the beginning. The new girl is actually much more likable.
    Though I might be a bit biased because she reminds me of someone I know personally.

    2. "Brains" was one "I'm comin' 'lizbeth!" from being Redd Foxx.

    3. The Twins WERE in the movie, due to bad editing. They can be seen driving into the hangar when Optimus first confronts Mearing.

    4. YES. We KNOW Leonard Nimoy is Sentinel Prime. You dont need to bash us over the head with Star Trek references.
    Everything from "this is the one where Spock gets his ass kicked" to "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few". ANd the final destruction of Cyberton? DUDE, it was PLANET VULCAN from the JJ Abrams Trek!

    5. Speaking of rips from other movies....
    - Deep Rising (tentacle sea monster)
    - The Matrix (tentacle robot monster)
    - Predator (Dreads with Dreds)
    - Revenge of the Sith (opening battle...Cybertron/Coruscant)
    - War of the Worlds (disintegrate humans, but leave their clothes)
    - Back to the Future part II (falling off a building, caught by your friend in the flying machine and raised back up dramatically)
    - Highlander (Sentinel tells Optimus there can be only one. Optimus then beheads Megatron....hey wait...just about all of the robots who die are decapitated in some form or fashion)
    - Inception. (Just LISTEN to the music during the Chicago scenes.. they stole Mind Heist and merged it with Jablonsky's score.)

    6. Ripping from real life. Kennedy and Nixon are understandable.
    But did you REALLY have to use the footage of the Challenger aftermath to show the Autobots being shot down by Starscream? Stay classy, Michael Bay.

    7. What, robots actually BLEED now?

    8. So...wait...there is a WHOLE INVASION FORCE on the MOON. PLUS the co-conspirator in stasis lock.
    The Deceptions KNOW about it, and have been trying...to keep it HIDDEN? One would think that Starscream and Co. would have been waking these guys up in the first movie.

    9 Barricade is back! YAY! Of course he is only seen for a few seconds before being killed off. But its BARRICADE!



    EDIT -- BROWN NOISE...the theatre was TOO DAMN LOUD! Each explosion sent vibrations through my intestines. Made me feel like I was about to evacuate.
    But that's not really a problem with the movie, just the Rave theatre.
  6. TiniTinyTony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 9, 2003
    star 5
    I saw it in 3D. I was hoping to see some real cool effects where when certain stuff blew up that it felt like it was coming at me, but it wasn't like that at all. It was very tame which, on a positive note, was not headache inducing.

    Concerning the movie, I thought there was some great action, predictable story with some twists and turns, and a few laughs. It was definitely better than the 2nd movie. If you go into the movie remember that this is a Michael Bay film where emphasis is put more on the action than the actual story, you won't be disappointed. It's not a summer blockbuster by any means, but it's worth a watch.
  7. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    Against my better judgement, I decided to punish myself and submit myself to yet another Bayformer movie. Without a doubt, it was better than ROTF, but not by much. Not when we still have to endure so many "Bay-isms" that still hurt what should essentially be a popcorn movie about - first and foremost - f'kin giant transformin' robots killing each other. I'll agree that the 3D wasn't headeache inducing but when the majority of the cool moneyshot effects involve one indistinguishable pile of metal parts ripping the head off another indistinguishable part of metal parts, I sincerely wonder why the hell bother.

    You know what really annoys me the most in all films? The emphasis with the damn humans and specially the US military, with soldiers that seem to be able to shoot and blow up these advanced robots with near impunity. And the squirrel suit guys. Oh yeah, definitely an awesome money shot. But really, wouldn't it have been much simpler to have HALO-dropped those guys off from a higher altitude on faster aircraft than those slow-assed Ospreys and then descend/glide with the squirrel suits? And Starscream, being killed off by Knox and Sam. WTH. Nobody kills Starscream but Megatron. It's a rule! BTW, is it me or did they try to make Strarscream sound like his classic Chris Latta (R.I.P.) voiced self this time around?


    Oh, but it was such a good line. The theater crowd went wild when Prime said that. And then there was the final tete-a-tete between Optimus and Megatron. "What would you be without me?" said Half-a-face Megatron. "Let's find out" simply replied Prime. Megatron's half a head is ripped off. Fatality. Prime wins! Ok, so Optimus does get the best lines and the best scenes, and no less than three kills major kills at the last fifteen minutes of the film. I guess that made everything prior to that bearable, at the end.
  8. CT-867-5309 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    I find it slightly disturbing that Optimus has been turned into a brutal, ruthless killer that really gets a kick out of going around cutting heads off.
  9. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    He's the ultimate Autobot warrior, pragmatic throughout. These Decepticons are ruthless killers who show no quarter, especially to helpless humans. He'll show no quarter either. Whether he gets off on ripping their damn heads off is another matter. I sincerely doubt he enjoys it though, and probably wishes he wouldn't have to hurt or kill a fellow Cybertronian. But it IS war, after all. In the old animated movie he was running over and shooting Decepticons left and right as he rode into Metroplex before engaging in a brutal brawl with Megatron. And was ready to shoot his archfoe's damn head off if damn f'kin Hot Rod hadn't interferred and got him killed instead.
  10. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Don't forget "You are and always will be my friend."

    I don't think they used actual footage, but they did base the explosion cloud on that event (which makes sense, given that it was based around a shuttle.

    One thing that was weird though, was that they had that huge shuttle reveal and made abig deal over the launch, yet didn't they either use that ship in the film earlier very casually (thus making the big reveal have little impact) or a different ship altogether (which makes the shuttle make less sense)?
  11. Aytee-Aytee Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2008
    star 5
    That was actually explained in the novel. The Autobot ship was the one that Sideswipe, Arcee and the others came in between movies 1 and 2, but had crashed upon landing, rendering it inoperable. The government kept it hidden while the Wreckers rebuilt it.


    EDIT -- Actually that's how the Wreckers chose their alt modes. Because they are all mechanics, they were impressed with the speed in which human pit crews could work on stock cars. Epps kept DVR recordings of Daytona races to calm them down when they got too demanding with the human workers.
  12. Darth_Daver Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 23, 2005
    star 5
    Yeah, I didn't get the ship reveal when the Autobots had already flown to the moon earlier on.

    Also didn't get why Sam was able to walk into the main NEST base wearing a Decepticon watch after they'd been going on about energon detectors.


    I think it's been reviewed quite favourably. It's better than ROTF, but that's a really low bar to have to beat. Considering the run time was so long, they could easily have lost ALL the Simmons bits with no difference to the plot (did the meeting with the Russian guys contribute to anything? It might have, but it was really dragging at that point so maybe my brain was shutting off). They should have cut Simmons from all 3 movies, though.

    It picked up a lot for the invasion bit, which had the best action of the trilogy, but even during that I kept finding myself wondering what all the main Decepticons were doing as we focused on the humans.
    I can take Megatron not getting enough characterisation, then obeying the Fallen, but he literally sits out almost all this battle, then somehow takes on a Prime quite succesfully, countering any suggestion he was too injured. (Were his injuries supposed to be just a result of ROTF?)

    Bumblebee saves Sam from a fall, then suddenly he's in a group of captured Autobots. Then from a hopeless situation, a few somethings/somebodies(?) fall from the sky, and now he can kick all the Decepticon's asses single-handedly. ???

    So even the good bits had problems.

    Same as the other movies, when it lets itself be serious, it has good bits. But still way too much goofiness dragging it down. And the 3D didn't live up to what reviews had me expecting.
  13. tom Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2004
    star 6
    i'm debating whether to take my kids to see this. they enjoyed the first two films, and it gives me an excuse to watch some giant robot fights, but after reading just the synopsis of ebert's review i don't know if i can do it.


  14. Everton Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 18, 2003
    star 10
    I just asked my MP-05 Megatron whether I should go see this. He said no.
  15. Darth_Invidious Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 5
    You actually care about what someone like Ebert has to say about it? Go see it. Your kids won't forgive you if you don't. Think that the robot on robot smash ups make it all worthwhile.
  16. tom Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2004
    star 6
    that was basically my thought process going into the second one, which is the main thing making me hesitate before dropping another 40 bucks on a family movie excursion. especially when there are movies coming out that i really want to take them to (harry potter, captain america).
  17. Aytee-Aytee Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2008
    star 5

    I partly to disagree with Mr. Ebert on this one. While it wasnt anything spectacular, and the dialogue was indeed inane, the only "wooden" performances came from Josh Duhamel, Tyrese Gibson and the soldiers.

    John Malkovich, Patrick Dempsey, Frances McDormand, were all rather good.
    John Turturro wasnt nearly as obnoxious as he was in the first two films, which is a major plus. Too bad they didnt have him play a serious character.


    Alan Tudyk....was okay in the second half of the film. I'm not bothered that his character was gay...but god did they have to play up the thing for comic relief?

    Shia LaBouef was definitely the worst of the group, and I really hate him in anything he's in.
  18. -Phoenix- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    Alan Tudyk was hilarious and got tons of laughs from the theatre I was in.
  19. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    "....INdia..." [face_laugh]

    The film mentions that too- my confusion was with how they dramatically structured i'ts reveal to be awe-inspiring after it was casually used earlier in the film to get to the moon.

    It's also very weird when you try to factor it (and the Decepticon ships- which I'm guessing was lead by an unnamed Nemesis?) into the whole Arrival on Earth thing in the first movie- wasn't the whole point of the Protoforms and a lot of the alien designs/instant alt-mode scanning ability to show that the Cybertronians didn't need ships to travel into/through space?


    The film series was never consistent- I mean the whole pillars/allspark/Megatron/seekers/Sentinel thing doesn't work together at all.


    IIRC, they provided the evidence from the Russian programs pre-dating Apollo that there were hundreds of pillars originally and that the Decepticons had already been there/it was a trap/ploy.


    I think so, though it's partially implied they're from Sentinel Prime.
  20. Aytee-Aytee Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2008
    star 5
    I dont think that was the same ship. Optimus and Ratchet's vessel looked a lot smaller in comparison.

    And I think the only reason they used it was for cargo room. Transformers seem to be able to handle space rather well (Starscream's credits scene in the first film, Megatron and Soundwave in the second).

    Further proof that Megatron is an idiot: he can survive temperatures colder than -400F in the vacuum of space....but get him to the artic circle and he promptly freezes. :oops:
  21. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    I don't mind Prime killing 'Cons (especially in personal combat), though some of the more violent execution-style kills are a bit jarring (the one he offed at the start of ROTF also felt a bit weird).

    Plus, after Optimus has declared his intention to kill all the Decepticons, it kinda takes the impact out of the Decepticons' decision to execute their Autobot prisoners. If the 'Bots are taking prisoners, you really expect the 'Cons to?

    "Hey, guys, we were gonna kill you all, but, mercy for us now!"
  22. Import_Jedi Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2001
    star 6
    I wonder what MEGAN Fox thought of the movie?[face_thinking]

    My review of TF3

    Frank Welker. I wasn't even sure that he returned to do the voice of Soundwave (since he sounded NOTHING at all like he did in TF2) in DOTM till I went to IMDb AND Wikipedia to confirm it. 8-}
  23. zacparis VIP

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2003
    star 7
    Well I won't say much because I don't want to be down on it, but I didn't like it. Although I do have to ask why it has such an ugly female lead. Whose idea was it to let her near movies? [face_talk_hand]
  24. LORDeron_MAULer Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2003
    star 4
    I was curious to see it but I wasn't sure I was willing to pay money to see it in the theater. According to Spooney's review it's better than the earlier movies but Megatron still has only four lines and Shockwave has none. If it's at that level still, then I think I'm comfortable skipping this.
  25. Aytee-Aytee Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2008
    star 5
    Eh. It depends. DotM is really one of those movies where if you see it by yourself you are definitely going to dislike it.

    Its more about who you are with than what you are watching.