TRANSITION TO VADER: "The neat little thing"

Sketchy!!!? HOW?
Your opinion's interesting to me, i don't get it though, i mean just seat back, watch ROTJ's final sequence on the Death Star near Endor, watch carrefully and tell me what you think this blue electric lightenning is...

 

I understand what you are trying to say, but in that particular case lightning is used for nothing but destruction. It's possible that force lightning could be used to jump start a heart, but I really doubt it could be used to transfer life energy from a dead guy to another that just recently dead/comatose...

And last time I checked James Earl Jones wasn't knighted...

 

Lucas was influenced by classical myths. Mary Shelly's Frankenstein most likely influenced Lucas's Obiwan and Darth Vader. Mary Shelly's Dr Frankenstein is very similiar to Lucas's Obiwan Kenobi. Both are tragic figures as well.

 

Frankenstein is cool and all, but I still like my Robo-Cop anaolgy...

 

Okay, this is completely off topic, but it needs to be said.

Frankenstein was not a mix of various remains. Victor Frankenstein, who was never a doctor, was the scientist. His creation had no name. Read the book.

Back on topic, it's no crazier than any other theory. I don't think it's likely, but hey, anything can happen.

 

I've never said that Frankenstein was the result of people's remains, i said that his creature WAS. (Doctor/Professor Frankenstein's monster) And in the Kenneth Brannagh's movie, i think they call him Doctor, but again i could be mistaken.
However, if you red Marry Sheiley's book you should know that he is (indeed) the mix of dead people's body parts assembled and brought to life by electricity.
I understand that some people don't agree with this thread's theory, but please post your opinion on this following quote.
"In Ep.III, there is a neat little thing happenning in the vocabularry of the 30' & 40', and hopefully it's going to work".
What do you think GL is talkin' about then!

 

I don't like the theory either. Dooku's body mixed with Anakin's body? Haydon's a tall guy, he'd fit the suit allright. No duuku required. If you look, there are lifts in Vader's boots.

 

Hey neuromancer ! first rule on this forum, don't just post, read as well, it helps sometimes.This theory was a little off at first and evolved into something that sounds extremely possible now. Obviously you didn't read the last posts.
IT IS NOT ABOUT BODY PARTS, IT IS ABOUT DOOKU'S ENERGY BEING TRANSFERED INTO ANAKIN'S BODY (UNCONSCIOUS)BY SIDIOUS.

 

Why does Anakin need Dooku's energy?

I still don't like the theory.

 

I think that Dooku's energy will be transfered into Anakin's dead body in order for Sidious to bring him back to life and in the meantime to control and unslave him through the power of the Dark side.
The same way Doctor Frankeinstein is connected to his monster.
He will have an army of Clones and a obedient creature eternelly thankfull because of the gift of life.
Vader will be Sidious' creature.
Do you remember that last thing that comes out of the Emperor's body after he is thrown into the Death Star's shaft. Dark blue mysterious power.
THIS right there is a key element of the Saga which hasn't been explained yet,
-->Dooku's body parts, allright i might have pushed it a little too far.
All i'm saying is that the same dark blue electric power that killed Vader will take him back to like in Ep.III.

 

You were refering to the force lightening that killed Vader and almost killed Luke? I saw no blue energy but what came from the EMPEROR when he died.

This isn't new, and i like it about as much as i did the last time i read it. Which is to say, not much.

It's not a personal attack, dude.

 

TEXAS, I think that Anakin being given life via force lightening is entirely possible, but I still am not sure if it will be Dukoo's. I personally don't think that Anakin's being brought back to life, or his rebuilding what have you will have anything to do with Dukoo. ButI could be wrong. I like everything except that idea. I just don't see Dukoo being involved in any way.

 

What she said.

 

This thread is interesting. I do have some problems with the theory though.

If the Emperor was only able to turn Anakin to the darkside after he was seriously injured/killed, why was the Emperor so confident that a virtually unharmed Luke would turn toward the darkside? It almost seems like many of you are saying Vader has no choice but to become evil after he is resurrected, whether it be from force crystals in his suit or he's basically conned or blackmailed into it by Palpy, or has nowhere else to go. Is Anakin a sith before he becomes Vader? yes. Why else would OB1 beat the crap out of him?

I think Dooku's place in this trilogy, as someone said before, is an obstacle for Anakin. Dooku is old, and Palpy wants a younger, more powerful apprentice. I believe that this is Dooku's primary role, and Dooku will actually have very little to do with Anakin's resurrection. I think that, and this is my opinion, Anakin is going to kill Dooku first, before OB1 beats him at a duel and almost kills him. Anakin would already be Palpy's new apprentice when OB1 tries to get him to turn back, therefore, Dooku is already replaced, aka-dead.

When you are all analyzing the script from the OT, you have to remember that GL did not necessarily know where he was going to take every character with every detail. Luke kisses Leia in ESB because Lucas hadn't made up his mind about whether they are brother and sister. OB1 justifies his comment about Vader killing Anakin because GL wasn't sure if he was going to have Vader as Luke's father after ANH. You also have to remember that GL changes his mind about a lot of things. That's why the original books have been slightly altered to cover up the Owen is Ben's brother thing. We just can't rely on that speculative reasoning as much as we would like, though it is productive.

Now, this is the last point I can think of, and it will sound a bit jaded and bitter and I will probably be attacked for this. I think that the Frankenstein theory is MUCH MUCH more creative than anything GL has thought of doing for Episode 3. Don't get me wrong, I liked AOTC and even liked TPM. But, I don't really see George Lucas as being the same complex story-teller that he used to be. He let his skills for story-telling and directing go rotten over a 20 year vacation. So many people were disappointed with TPM because it had such a disorganized, dry, and humanless feel to it. GL says that it's because he needed a movie to introduce the characters...well, that doesn't make sense, because ANH introduced new characters and wasn't as bland and dry as TPM. TPM felt like an amatuer film with a big budget. So anyway, my point being is that I don't think we are going to be in for anything shockingly creative that will fully alter our vision of the OT at all. I think Anakin will turn to the darkside, OB1 will fight him, and then OB1 will give up.

That being said, I'm going to duck and dodge all of the stones being thrown at me.

 

Oh there won't be any stone thrown at you because first of all you expressed your ideas with such enthousiasm that it's contagious, second of all because everybody but NEUROMENCER will agree with you.
It's interesting how you view GL's vision, i think of it a little differently.
I trully believe him when he's saying that the early draft for ANH had Anakin Skywalker in it.
Then i agree with you when you picture him as building the starwars saga brick by brick. I just know, (i heard Rick Mc Callum talkin' about this)that nobody was introduced in TPM or AOTC without a particular purpose for either the PT or the OT. We know why Shmi was for ? (To bring Anakin the sense of loss, fear, lonelyness ect...which will eventually lead him to the DS) we know about Padmé ofcourse, even Watto had a purpose (Anakin's first master), Jar Jar has one now (the Fall of the Republic in a way-Jar Jar is an easily controlled weak mind), Panaka & Typho have one (probably to describe the sense of sacrifice which holds a huge part of the Naboo culture)Valorrum and all the Coruscant political figures have one (sense of continuity with Grand Morff Tarkin and Captain Needa)and so on...
Now why did GL introduce COUNT DOOKU/TYRANNUS
Yoda was Dooku's master who was QGJ's master who was OB1's master who was Anakin's master...but other than that, what is Dooku's purpose. Well u already know what i think !Dooku has so much ambition politically wise that he can be a powerfull ally to Sidious and a threat in the sametime.
In AOTC Sidious is the Pupeteer (once again) contolling the Federation, the Separatists, The Republic, The Guild Of Commerce, The Sith & the Jedi...But in Ep.III (this is only speculation)Dooku is going to reveal his true motifs and Sidious will get rid of him (This could be the way to show Sidious's true evil nature to both the Jedi and the Audience) So before Padmé or Anakin's death, we'll see Dooku getting killed by Sidious. I just have a feeling that Dooku is not going to pay like a regular badguy at the end of the film's climax. However Brynph this is my wish, but i'm afraid that none of this adult oriented dark clever stuff we've been dreaming about will happen. GL confirmed recently in a british fan magazine that Ep.III will be extremely dark, he said something like "Dark? surely and not only compared to the other Sw movies but also compared to today's Hollywood films) So we could expect something as dark as "Aliens", of course in the pure SW tradition and Rated PG13 .
But hu! let's trust GL one last time.

 

I only hope you're right texas. AOTC was defintitely a step up from TPM, but I still don't feel that Episode III will tie up all of the loose ends that the fans want to see. I guess we can only wait and see...

 

I love how if you don't jump immediatly on a theory, you piss people off.

Gotta love the internet.


I have no problem with Vader being revived with Darkside Lightening, but anything from Dooku (Energy, body parts, whatever) i just don't see. Palps had what looked like energy leave his body when he blew in the core of the Death Star, but that's a L-O-N-G J-U-M-P to DS energy transferring from a dead guy into a living, though maimed and probably mortally wounded, person. One instance of evil looking energy leaving a doomed Sith Lord isn't enough to be making large bold statements like this. There just isn't anything to back it up.

It's fine for speculation, but don't count on it being in the movie. Not that it's impossible, but i wouldn't hold my breath for it long.

I also notice a distinct lack of evil looking energy coming from Maul in TPM. If all Sith have it, and not just the Ultra-powerful ones, Maul should have. This is even assuming that energy came from the emperor at all, and not from the momma-of-all Reactor Cores that he fell into. There are simply too many variables.

Is it good speculation? Yes.
Is it possible? Yes.
Does it sound plausible in a fantasy series like Star Wars? Yes, not much isn't plausible in fantasy.
Is it beyond all doubt? Not by a longshot.
Does -Neuromancer- have doubts? Yup.

Edits: Drunken spelling errors and formatting with Vodka. Not easy.

 

In Ep.III, i believe that Chancellor Palpatine will continue to get closer to Anakin, listenning, understanding his frustrations, he will continue to guide and encourage him. Anakin will not feel the corruption within Palpatine.
OB1 will though, just like his master before him (QGJ)and this will only pull the two knights apart. Anakin and OB1 will split apart and loose touch. Palpatine will continue to watch
"Anakin's career with great interest"
Now, Anakin always wants to fix things when he's upset. Well now listen to this
"One day i will be the most powerful Jedi ever, i will even keep people from dying"
Now everything's clear, the whole "Frankeinstein Theory". Anakin is not a demon, he's a fallen angel (GL statement)
On Tatooine he was just a SLAVE boy who liked to build and to FIX things.
Anakin was and will continue to be a slave.
Well we heard (and i believe this was official source) than Sir Earl Jones will only record five minutes of dialogue.
So Anakin will be Anakin throughout 3/4 of the film, Darth Vader won't have that much screen time...Why?
For the same reason why Jack Lloyd looked like the perfect kid, and Hayden like a good teenager overall.
No c'on! Anakin is just like Luke, might be a little more arrogant but he is still a nice fellow. This is why in TPM and AOTC we don't see him really going down hill, because i don't think he will suddenly go from "this boy from Tattooine" to the evil Darth Vader. No i think he is going to disapear in Ep.III, he will stay hidden for a while, hidden on Coruscant in Sidious' secret base. Where the whole "Frankenstein thing" will trasform him for ever.

Now a few quotes to back my "Franky Theory" up, or just to make it sound possible !
"If only you would know the full power of the Dark side"
"Then my father is trully dead..."
Luke to Vader (ROTJ)
"Yes my master"
Vader to the Emperor (ROTJ)

 

Some things about this Frankenstein theory we know for sure.

1. Remember that in ep. VI, during victory celebration, the ghosts of Obi-Wan, Yoda and Anakin appear. That means Jedis (at least ) have a soul. If two souls cannot live the same body it is only Anakin's soul that lives in the body of Vader. And if there are two souls in Anakin's body ( ), where is Dooku's ghost celebrating Emperor's defeat?

2. Vader said himself that Luke is his son... One human being can have ONE father!

So Vader is Anakin. Can a nice guy like Anakin became a monster like Vader? Life gives a lot of examples of people that had been very nice kids but later become tyrants.

It was Anakin who wanted to become the most powerful Jedi ever. In my oppinion, this is Star Wars' message: people can become bad if they want power too much. After becoming the most powerful Jedi ever, Anakin is the same person: a slave. A slave of the Emperor and a slave of the power.

Anakin became powerful; so what? he wasted his life remaining the same tortured soul...

 

Interesting litesaber,
Now in your opinion, what is GL refering to when he's talking about a "neat little thing in the vocabularry of the 30' & 40'"???

 

Hey if Vader is Frankenstein.Then Obi-Wan will be the Wolfman.Sidious could be Dracula.Yoda will be The Mummy,and Luke could be The Creature from the Black Lagoon! Hey GL just recasted the universal monster line-up from the 30`s and 40`s LOL

 

what is GL refering to when he's talking about a "neat little thing in the vocabularry of the 30' & 40'"???

Vocabulary.

vo?cab?u?lary \vo-"ka-bye-'ler-e\ n, pl -lar?ies 1 : a list or collection of words usu. alphabetically arranged and defined or explained : lexicon 2 : a stock of words in a language used by a class or individual or in relation to a subject

Lucas is talking about a style of filmaking, not a remake (or a rip-off).

 

Do u honestly think that 12 months before principal photography starts and 18 months before the main production kicks of, GL already knows how to tell the story (technically wise) I DON'T THINK SO !
GL has always been a great story teller, not a great film maker (like Kubrick or Mallick)
So early on in production, i doubt he's already talking about the "HOW" but rather the "WHAT". He just finished writting the script and he's going to team up with Jonathan Hales to finish the screenplay.
He's not thinking about how to hold his camera and how to edit the film.
On top of this he was spotted by TV5 (Internationnal TV channel)in toronto in vacation with Francis Ford Coppola?
wierd Coincidence right?

 

I love the Frankenstein analogy, and Dooku is pointedly a precursor to Vader, but I have to say Anakin w/ Dooku parts is a stretch. You never know, of course. What Anakin inherits from Dooku - in stark contrast to what he chooses not to inherit from Obi Wan - is a sense of self-importance, a regality, and most of all, a thirst for the full power of the force.

Darb

 

Look Texas, your theory is indeed creative and is plausible but what you didn't think about is how burns and injuries can change your appearence and voice greatly.
I believe that Anakin and Obi-wan will duel on some kind of volcanic world and Anakin will be hurled into a pit of boiling magma, here's where the quote "I will learn to keep people from dying" comes in. What is he used the force to stay alive but after he recovered he was singed and deformed so badly he needed a suit to live. Therefore becoming darth Vader. Think about it Star Wars isn't going to follow things that happened in Frankenstien, GL has a unique imagination something else will happen