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Lit Unification wars and the formation of the old republic(Legends)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Darth Invictus, Jan 8, 2018.

  1. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 8, 2016
    So we know in Legends the old republic formed around 25,000 BBY or so. We also know there was this vague war or series of wars that preceded its formation called the unification wars.

    We know the Jedi participated in this war and there was an infamous warlord by the name of Zakrinand Minus. We also know interestingly enough the Bendu monks participated as well and the republic seemed to be formed immediately after this war.

    My question or rather opening point in what I hope will be a good discussion is what were these wars about? Who fought in them? How did they influence the formation of the republic and the politics of the core?

    How might this conflict have influenced notions of human supremacy? How did this conflict influence the Jedi and their relationship with the republic?

    Thoughts? Ideas?
     
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  2. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 8, 2016
  3. SheaHublin

    SheaHublin Jedi Master star 2

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    Feb 15, 2008
    It wasn't until the later EU reference works came out that we really got actual confirmation that there were Unification Wars waged to form the early Republic. There were, however, various bits of fan speculation, and even actual references to what would become known as the Unification Wars. The difficulty in analyzing them was that they (are) scattered about all sorts of works, often in obscure locations. I've come across a few every now and then.

    For example, the D20 Alien Anthology entry for the Ubese indicates that "The Ubese were building weapons that had been banned since the formation of the Old Republic" and later describes the effects of these "large scale tactical weapons" as including the rendering of whole worlds "uninhabitable by radioactive firestorms" and their homeworld "shattered into space debris". Now, why would the Republic have even had to ban these sorts of weapons unless they had seen firsthand their effects? The implication is that they were used during the events (whatever those were) around the formation of the Republic- the Unification Wars.
     
  4. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

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    Sep 2, 2012
    I would suggest that the collapse of the Rakatan Empire (thereby making Rakatan hyperdrive technology easily available to those who managed to get their hands on it and reverse-engineer it) probably played a major role in making these first galactic wars between the "Republic precursor states" possible.
     
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  5. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 8, 2016
    That's certainly an interesting suggestion-do you have any idea as to what the composition of these "precursor states" were? Single species?' Multiple species coalitions etc...?


    Edit: I'd hoped this would generate more discussion maybe I was wrong.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2018
  6. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

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    Sep 2, 2012
    The Core Founders would have been the most influential worlds within these states:

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Core_Founder

    Duro would have been very important too - as basically the creator of the modern hyperdrive using Rakata technology:

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Duros/Legends


    I would predict that Alsakan was one notable "capital of a precursor state", Coruscant another - hence the squabbling for thousands of years over which should be the capital of the Republic itself.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2018
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  7. SpecForce Trooper

    SpecForce Trooper Jedi Knight star 4

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    Jun 19, 2016
    I like to think "unification" is kind of a euphemism. The unification would be more like the humans and their allies conquering other nations and folding them into their federation. Of course this would all be brushed over and largely forgotten thousands of years later.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
  8. darklordoftech

    darklordoftech Force Ghost star 6

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    Sep 30, 2012
    It's a good question what the factions were. I wonder what role Wookiees played.
     
  9. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 8, 2016
    I doubt the wookiees were involved as Kashyyk was in the mid rim.

    @SpecForce Trooper that's an interesting idea and certainly puts the Jedi's role into question. It means the republic was formed through warfare-perhaps humans, duros, and those that managed to reverse engineer Rakatan technology conquered and consolidated the core.

    I wonder...who opposed unification? With what weapons in that ancient past was the war fought? What role did the Jedi play? Might they have participated on side of the proto republic forces?

    It's a very minor and obscure part of legends history but is interesting and shows us that the Star Wars Galaxy at least in the old eu had an ancient and deep history.
     
  10. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

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    Sep 2, 2012
    The impression I get from The Essential Atlas is that the Jedi had already moved to Ossus to act as "bastions against threats from the Outer Rim, especially the Hutts" at some point before the last few years of the pre-Republic era:

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ossus/Legends
    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Perlemian_Trade_Route/Legends

    The newly formed Republic established contact with the Jedi on Ossus - and that was when the Jedi first became recognized as "guardians of peace in the Republic" - protecting it from external threats.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
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  11. Havoc123

    Havoc123 Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 26, 2013
    It may have been Alsakan, rememmber that for several centuries later conflicts were fought on how the Republic should be set up. Alsakan supported a more decentralized model rather than a centralized Republic from Coruscant. I suspect Alsakan may have won out in the negotiations for the Ruusan Reformation, hence Alsakan essentially getting its way for a few thousand years.
     
  12. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 6

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    Oct 29, 2005
    We never got much about the Unification Wars, unfortunately - most sources about the birth of the Republic don't mention warfare, just the signing of an accord.

    Honestly, I assume that the 'unification' would've been a common threat of some kind - not the Rakata (too late) or the Tionese (too early), but maybe some other forgotten star empire that was broken up by the unified worlds.
     
  13. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 8, 2016
    I suppose it's possible. There have been indications that other interstellar states existed and do not such as the Pacian Empire.

    But unification implies the war was an intra core affair.
     
  14. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 6

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    Oct 29, 2005
    True enough. I looked at my old notes, which indicated that the NEC, EGTW, and the EA did not mention the wars, which complicates matters. However, the Atlas does have a map of the Republic at its founding in 25,000 which might hold some clues - and that the members did not want any overall navy for the Republic for fear of powerful Core worlds using it to further their own goals. (Another source, the Knights of the Old Republic SB, indicated that the first Republic navy was a 'fleet of Duros scout ships and repurposed Corusanti trade vessels'. )
     
  15. JediFett10

    JediFett10 Jedi Master star 1

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    Feb 8, 2008
    Taken from Bleeding Cool, dated October 15th, 2015, in an article written by Rich Johnston, entitled "The Languages Of Star Wars – The Infographic":
    [​IMG]

    As stated under Galactic Basic Standard, the founding members of the Galactic Republic were
    the Humans, Duros, and Bothans
     
  16. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

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    Sep 2, 2012
    That's odd. Star Wars Infographic may be newcanon-only. In Legends. Bothan Space is way out in the Mid Rim, making it difficult for them to be a Core Founder - and the Legends Core Founder page does not mention them.

    In Legends, Bothawai joined the Republic at some point between 17000 BBY and 12000 BBY.
     
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  17. JediFett10

    JediFett10 Jedi Master star 1

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    Feb 8, 2008
  18. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

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    Sep 2, 2012
    It says it was an influence on Galactic Basic Standard. I can't find a source for the Bothans being in contact with the Republic precursors, and helping to form the Republic, in 25053 BBY though. I think this may be a case of some Wookieepedian over-extrapolating.

    Given that 17000 BBY is usually given as the earliest date for them joining the Republic:

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Bothawui/Legends

    it's reasonable to assume that it was back then, but no earlier, that they started influencing Old Galactic Standard - a little before it became "Mid Galactic Standard".

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Galactic_Basic_Standard


    While Old Galactic Standard was mostly derived from Old Coruscanti, the mother tongue of the Humans of Coruscant, its vocabulary incorporated many words from over a dozen other languages,[3] including Durese[4] and Bothese.

    By the lifetime of Peshosloc, a holowright who lived between 15,762 BBY and 15,609 BBY, the language had evolved significantly enough to be considered a distinct historical division, which was latter dubbed Mid-Galactic Standard.[5] Galactic Basic was further influenced by Dromnyr after the Vultans joined the Republic around 14,000 BBY, resulting ultimately in the modern Galactic Basic Standard.[6][3]


    This was the Republic around 22000 BBY - note - no Bothan Space:

    Going by the Galactic Explorations map, Bothawui, in the orange section, probably joined between 20000 BBY and 15000 BBY - which is fairly consistent with the 17000-12000 figure given:

     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2018
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  19. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 6

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    Oct 29, 2005
    Note that the latter map is the only indication of what is included in the potential founding Republic of 25,000 BY.
     
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  20. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Yup - the white bit would be the founding Republic, the red bit represents the Republic a few thousand years later - and the orange bit is a few thousand years after that.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2018
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  21. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 6

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    Oct 29, 2005
    Interesting... apparently the MMO has something in the game called "Memoir of the Unification Wars".

    It seems to be a gift that you give a companion to woo them, so I'm guessing that there's no text and the game creators are just messing with people like us. [face_laugh]
     
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  22. MercenaryAce

    MercenaryAce Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Aug 10, 2005
    It is also possible that were some wars between the various states, but then peacemakers - including perhaps the jedi order (we don't see them in their diplomatic role often enough) - came together and convinced the sides to join a united republic.
     
  23. Noash_Retrac

    Noash_Retrac Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 14, 2006
    I've always been bugged by Bothans being members of the Republic pre-4,000 BBY for some unknown reason. It just feels that those sections of the Mid Rim and Outer Rim shouldn't have been found until around or after the time of the Great Hyperspace War.
     
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  24. blackmyron

    blackmyron Force Ghost star 6

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    Oct 29, 2005
    Well, the Slice was always considered to be in the earliest portion of the explored galaxy - the Atlas indicates that Bothan Space was explored by the Republic in the 20,000-15,000 BY period.