Vader/Luke duels post PT.

What changes for you viewers young or old when watching these now after the events have played out in the first three episodes?
For the older viewers who grew up on OT only hating Vader and pulling so hard for Luke to kill this figure of pure evil, How do you see it now? As for the newer fans who experience it in order how do you view the confrontations? I am interested in this. I think for those of us who grew up watching the OT it is almost as if are view point of Vader is affected much like Lukes was from Episode V to VI and even more so now.

 

I see it as the same as I've always seen it. We knew Anakin was Vader during the OT. We just didn't know what happened to make him get to that point. We knew Luke and Leia were Vader's children, but we didn't know he was infatuated with a young Republic senator to make this happen. As far as the duels between Anakin and Luke themselves, they still rank amongst the best in the entire saga.

 

As a new fan it was different for me. Instead of rooting for Luke to defeet the evil Vader. I was pulling for Anakin to do the right thing (in vain).
The duels to me are now very heartbreaking.

 

I love the Duels they rock. Especially The Empire Strikes Back Duel and ROTS Vader vs. Obi-Wan Duel. The two longest duels in the Saga.

 

I see them even more clearly now! It's obvious that Vader NEVER intended to kill Luke, he just wanted him by his side. ROTJ, it's very obvious that Vader wasn't on a strong offensive due to his emotions-the conflict. In ESB, he was fosused on trying to turn his son, and held the upper hand the whole time-he spanked Luke. Some would say in ROTJ that Luke was that much better, but I don't think so, there's no way he was a match for the power of the dark side with soooooooo little training. He was lucky it was his father, other wise he's of been struck down when he didn't turn!

I want to see more of Vader in the suit fighting and using the force if they ever do any added scenes, with the way they can choreograph fight scenes now, they'd easily have the best fight scene ever if they had Vader eliminating Jedi's!

 

To be honest the OT struggle between Luke and his father Vader works the same as it always did for me. The PT fleshed out the story but ultimately is irrelvent when dealing with how Luke handles it. The PT helps clarify Vader's motives in the OT but in the end with or without the PT we still know Vader is Luke's father and that there is still good in him. What the PT does best is establish why Yoda and Obi Wan do what they did in the OT; particularly in partially training a young boy to face two Sith Lords when they were already lightyears ahead in their qualifications. By the PT showing that Vader has a soft spot for family and that it's the ultimate reason he fell in the first place, Luke becomes the best choice to confront Vader and awaken Anakin from his slumber.

 

Well, if you're watching these from 1-6 for the first time and you get to ESB, I think you'll still feel a sense of danger on Luke's behalf. As Vader, Anakin is capable of great evil, including killing his son. Besides, killing him never was his objective, and yet the danger still existed. As for Luke's part in the duel, knowing that there is a whole other movie to go and knowing that Vader/Anakin is crucial to the plot of SW, I don't think they'll worry about Luke killing Vader without knowing he's his father. A rematch is inevidable, so they'll probably wonder more "when will he find out? Now, before the rematch or during the rematch?"

 

I think the OT duels carry and emotional intensity not seen before.

The OT duels were always emotionally-centred, rather than plot or acrobatic centred, with lots of dialog and tons of meaning behind them, and when viewed in the contrast of the PT this stands out even more. Because Vader and Luke, and Vader and Obi Wan's relationships take on new meanings in light of the PT their duels are also much more emotionally intense and meaningful than they first appeared.

 

In the OT the plot directs the heroes and villains into a personal confrontation which inevitably involves lightsabers whereas in the PT, with the exception of the battle between Obi-Wan and Vader, lightsabers battles seem to occur because Sith and Jedi end up in the same airspace. They look cool but aren't emotionally resonant because in TPM and AOTC the characters are only doing their duty in trying to kill eachother and don't have any kind of emotional connection to the man they're fighting.

Luke's fights are powerful because it not only changes the plot but also transforms the characters involved. Vader and Luke are not the same men when they emerge from their confrontation on Bespin. Luke has to mature as a Jedi, and come to grips with his identity and destiny. Vader has to come to grips with fact that his son rejects him, and that he is increasingly becoming emotionally attached to the kid. However, after the ROTS fight, neither Obi-Wan nor Vader emotionally transform and only have to adapt to new circumstances, not a new personal emotional reality, like Luke and Vader do later on.

 

I agree.

I would love to see a CGI Vader in action.

 

I think that would be a huge mistake as the duels still hold up, they just are less flashy and slower. A CGI Vader also would be a huge mistake as the Jedi are supposed to be in hiding and near extinct and there's no movie where a montage of Vader killing Jedi would fit without harming the pacing.

 

I'm sorry but, the OT duels do not hold up. The only OT duel that some what holds up is Vader vs Luke in Empire. The duel in RotJ is crap when compared to the PT and don't even get me started on the duel in ANH.

And, I'm not saying to add a montage of Vader killing Jedi in any of the movies.

I'm saying that if they were to ever go back and re make the duels in the OT, then a CGI Vader would be raw.

 

I agree but the ESB duel is still a little weak but definately the best of the bunch. I think the ROTJ duel should be better to give more credit to Luke. He has gotten much better since facing Vader in ESB. I also think it would be cool to give Luke Sith eyes in the ROTJ duel to show how he was embracing the dark side. The line the Emperor says about making him more and more his servant would fit in perfectly with the PT now and how Anakin turned. The duels also are more emotional because you what happened during the PT. I can see Anakin behind the mask and it really makes Vader a more tragic figure than menacing.

 

I want to see more of Vader in the suit fighting and using the force if they ever do any added scenes, with the way they can choreograph fight scenes now, they'd easily have the best fight scene ever if they had Vader eliminating Jedi's!

I would love to see a CGI Vader in action.

That would be the biggest mistake you could ever make.

I'm sorry, I don't mean to offend, but it's the truth. A tacky CGI Vader slaying down Jedi in scenes that would be not only impossible, but also pointless? No.

The OT duels already had great resonance, and they've become only more powerful in light of the PT. It should remain that way.

 

In comparison, the duels in the OT definately rule the roost for me, only because of the emotional depth (and probably because I grew up with them!) When viewed together there's definately a kind of poetry to them, and the emoition of the OT is definately hightened. When viewed in order now, the duel in ESB is pretty unnerving; Luke's cockiness, and rage, ring any bells? And in ROTJ where he just completely loses it, you really get the sense that he's done for and that he will turn to the dark side (even though, you do know it's going to end with fireworks and teddybears!)

Really hate the PT Count Dooku fights..I just never really bought that character.

 

Vader/Luke duels post PT.

Iv'e always loved the OT duels. ESB in particular. ROTJ is a great duel as well. Okay so ANH looks a little old when compared and the pace of the duels in the OT is much slower, but I prefer them. Why? They are classic's, I grew up with them, and I love the dialogue the moves and all that transpires on film.

Come the PT. TPM duel blew me away, fantastic. I also loved the duels in ROTS, but my favourite duels take place in the OT, between Luke and Vader.

 

I found the Obi Wan and Vader fight in ROTS to be lacking. But it's my fault for having such a good imagination I guess. I pictured Lucas doing kind of a combo of ESB/ROTJ fights in the STYLE of the PT fights. Obi tries to turn Ani back to the light and Ani tries to turn Obi to the Dark. There just wasn't the Verbal "Fencing" I expected.