Voting laws and age restrictions.

Because our Constitution requires voters to actually be citizens of the United States

because the constitution says so is not a valid reason

This happens in almost every country around the world.

indeed I agree ! - doesn't make it fair though

Plus it prevents large groups of crazy people with agendas from migrating to other countries and messing with those elections.

As mentioned above its not easy to get into the country in the first place. Immigration is very hard. It would be difficult to get a few people into the country, let alone enough to influence an election. I'm sure there are at least 1 million people per voting area - so any group would have to migrate 1 million and 1 people to defineately influence a vote.

But my point still stands - if they are legally in the country, obeying all the laws and paying full taxes why shouldn't they be allowed to vote on matters that directly effect their lives ?

Malcolm

 

Essentially, the citizens are the joint home-owners and non-citizens are house guests. Sure, you help with the dishes, but you don't get to run the place.

 

Starfire no - that comparison doesn't work. I pay the same taxes and obey the same rules as every other person in my state, yet they get to vote, and I don't. Thats the only difference

Malcolm

 

Just a couple of weeks ago I went down to New Orleans. I stayed with the nicest folks for about a week.

I tried to help them out as much as possible as some form of recompense for their hospitality, of course. I cleaned up after myself and offered to help whenever I could (ie, paid 'taxes' for my use of their property). However, any decisions concerning the household were not mine to make, because I was not a member of that household--even though I contributed to the wellbeing of that household to the best of my ability.

 

Starfire that would work if I was a visitor. However I am not a visitor - I live here. I don't do the dishes, I actually pay the taxes.

Its the same as you moving in with people and paying an equal share of the running of the house - then you'd be entitled to a equal say in the household decisions.

Malcolm

 

I don't think you can call it moving in unless you become a member of the household (ie, citizen). Otherwise you're just an interminable house guest.

 

funny you should say that, because I live in a house with three other guys - all americans, all tax payers, all voters. Despite me being a "temporary" housemate with them I get an equal say in the running of the house

Oh, and I'm here for 2 years, I don't know if you count that as temporary

Malcolm

 

Despite me being a "temporary" housemate with them I get an equal say in the running of the house

So you're obviously a member of the household. Good on you

 

so, back to thread - why can't I vote ?

 

Because you're not a member of the household. You're an interminable guest.

It has nothing to do with how long you stay or what you wear. As a guest, you still gotta chip in, just like the members. The thing is, members get a say in how their contribution gets used.

 

you still gotta chip in

but I'm not chipping in - I'm contributing exactly the same amount as everyone else.
Thats my point

Malcolm

 

Nations are extremely bad hosts. What can I say?

 

LOL good point

I'd like someone from the Government explain it to me - perhaps I should approach one of those people waving fliers outside my metro station to explain it to me.

I don't think there is a perfectly valid reason why I can't vote, but as I said in my initial post, it was my choice to come here, and I knew I wouldn't be allowed to vote. (doesn't mean I should be happy about it though)

Malcolm

 

Well, I agree that there are certain times when the rules seem unfair, but some of the terrorists in this country [foreign types, not Tim McVeigh types] lived here for a few years. Do you want them to be able to vote?

That is what the citizenship requirement protects against.

 

Being foreign does not make one a terrorist.
Up until the point they committed any acts of terrorism they should have been allowed to vote, same as anyone else.

The second they break *any* law, their voting rights should be revoked - and up until the point they are committing any crimes, they are as innocent as you or I.

Just as much as any American terrorist (or any criminal for that matter) should not be allowed to vote as soon as they are convicted.

Your arguement doesn't really fit in. You are also suggesting that all foreigners are potential terrorists, which IMO is nearly a racist comment. Americans have just as much potential to commit acts of terror on other Americans.

Malcolm

 

No, no, you misunderstand. What I'm saying is that they have those laws in place to prevent those people from voting.

The government is practicing a "better safe than sorry" policy.

I don't agree with the laws, and I think they should be clarified so that someone in your case would be allowed to vote. There is a difference between someone who lands in the United States and wants to vote, and someone who is basically a common-law citizen.

My argument wasn't against you at all, and it looks weaker as I look back on it, seeing as how I don't think the terrorists held steady jobs, made a life here, or paid taxes.

 

thanks for the clarification xie I understand you now no harm done

It would be hard to decide who is a likely terrorist candidate, and who is a less-than likely terrorist candidate. Who decides, and what are the main signs ?

If an immigrant has a job, an address and pays taxes he or she should be allowed to vote - I really think its as simple as that.

I know I am not a terrorist, and to be honest, I had to complete forms when I came here promising that I wouldn't participate in terrorist activities and that I was not entering the US to become a terrorist.

I infact work for the US Government, which kinda puts me beyond suspicion, but still I cannot vote.

I'm glad you sympathise with my position xie. In the current election there is one candidate for the construction of a new road which will help traffic. The other candidate is against the new road. I would like to have the new road built (with my tax money), and would like to vote for that candidate.

"better safe than sorry" sums it up pretty well

hope my candidate wins

Malcolm