PT Was Darth Maul really Necessary?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Polydroxol, Feb 11, 2014.

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  1. Oberst Hans Landa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 12, 2014
    star 2
    I'm sure my comment does not add anything new to this topic, but I honestly feel Darth Maul should have been the bad guy in the entire PT.
  2. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Evil isn't gone. The Force is in balance so long as there is good and evil.

    "I wanted to have this mythological footing because I was basing the films on the idea that the Force has two sides, the good side, the evil side, and they both need to be there. Most religions are built on that, whether it's called yin and yang, God and the devil—everything is built on the push-pull tension created by two sides of the equation. Right from the very beginning, that was the key issue in Star Wars."

    --George Lucas, “The Mythology of Star Wars,” Joseph Campbell and the Power of Myth DVD, 2001


    "The overriding philosophy in Episode I—and in all the Star Wars movies, for that matter—is the balance between good and evil."

    --George Lucas, Star Wars: The Making of Episode I, 1999

    "The film is ultimately about the dark side and the light side, and those sides are designed around compassion and greed. The issue of greed, of getting things and owning things and having things and not being able to let go of things, is the opposite of compassion—of not thinking of yourself all the time. These are the two sides—the good force and the bad force. They're the simplest parts of a complex cosmic construction."

    --George Lucas

    "If good and evil are mixed things become blurred - there is nothing between good and evil, everything is gray. In each of us we to have balance these emotions, and in the Star Wars saga the most important point is balance, balance between everything. It is dangerous to lose this. In The Phantom Menace one of the Jedi Council already knows the balance of The Force is starting to slip, and will slip further. It is obvious to this person that The Sith are going to destroy this balance. On the other hand a prediction which is referred to states someone will replace the balance in the future. At the right time a balance may again be created, but presently it is being eroded by dark forces."

    --George Lucas, Time Magazine article, 2002

    "The dark side is always there. It is experienced daily by people. It is like a huge cancer, alive, festering—both a reminder of a moral state and, at the same time, symptom and symbol of a very sick society."

    --George Lucas, “The Mythology of Star Wars,” Joseph Campbell and the Power of Myth DVD, 2001
    What becomes a problem is when the Sith push the Force out of balance through their actions. You can disagree with that simplicity, but that is how Lucas views the Saga. The blurring of the lines between good and evil is the point of view that Anakin and Palpatine have, that makes them who they are. The OT is the more simpler form because we're seeing things from Luke's point of view and he knows what is right and wrong in the universe. As does Leia who has had more experience in galactic affairs than Luke has.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  3. Rachel_In_Red Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 12, 2013
    star 3
    Yes, Darth Maul was necessary. More than necessary. If it were up to me, he would have conquered the galaxy and killed Luke Skywalker in "Episode VI: The Death of More Jedi" at the end of the Saga.

    ;)
  4. skyrimcat9416 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2013
    star 1
    You are asking if a guy with a creepy and devilish-looking face, was very quiet and mysterious, had a double-bladed lightsaber, and had the best lightsaber duel ever was necessary???

    ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!!!
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  5. SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2003
    star 6
  6. Merkual Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2013
    star 4
    I really don't know any reason why both Dooku and Maul couldn't be main villains in the PT
  7. Cushing's Admirer Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2006
    star 6
    Was Maul needed? Not really. Yet, it was nice to see an alien Sith in a film. A first. I just wish he'd been utilised better. Actually, I would say that for all the Sith and the entire SW Saga.
  8. SlashMan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 5, 2012
    star 3
    Maul was absolutely awesome in Episode I. We saw a Sith in their prime, and what they're capable of. As good a villain as Maul was, Episode II called for a different character. Even after we're shown Dooku, it's still not apparent that he's the villain. If we were shown Maul in his position, it would be painfully obvious that the Sith were in it all along. And as much as I'd like to see Yoda take on Maul, the role of Dooku is pretty unique.

    I find that Maul works best in small doses, while the more is revealed about Dooku, the more interesting he becomes. They're both vicious and elegant villains, respectively. I don't see them as interchangeable.
  9. Darth Maul Apprentice Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2014
    star 4
    I like the way you think. ^:)^
  10. DRush76 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2008
    star 4



    The Sith were not the only ones who pushed the Force out of balance. I believe that the Jedi's inability to really understand the Force and their dogmatic views on morality made them just as guilty as the Sith for pushing the Force out of balance.



    Why? Because he's cool?:rolleyes:
    Last edited by DRush76, Feb 14, 2014
  11. purplerain Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 14, 2013
    star 4
    I definitely would love to see Dooku in TPM, whether or not he's already turned to the dark side. If he hasn't turned to the dark side, I'd be interested in seeing his reaction to the Senate's refusal to help Amidala. If he had turned to the dark side, I second everything the OP said.
    Last edited by purplerain, Feb 14, 2014
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  12. Master Mini 907 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2013
    star 3
  13. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9

    Because of the rule of two. Lucas was connecting the motivations and actions of the OT Sith to the PT Sith, which meant that Maul was just cannonfodder and Dooku was the tool to turn Anakin.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  14. HevyDevy Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2011
    star 4
    I don't know if I'd call Maul cannonfodder, I mean I always got the impression Sidious valued him more than Dooku. Having said that, I can't imagine Maul in the role of the Sith Anakin kills to replace. Maul wouldn't just sit there waiting to be killed IMO, there needed to be some vulnerability there.
  15. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    I meant cannonfodder for Lucas.
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  16. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Actually, they were; in fact, Plagueis and Sidious while working in concert had shifted the balance directly around 42 BBY. There is no evidence that the Jedi contributed to the imbalance.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  17. HevyDevy Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2011
    star 4
    Oh I see. Well I'm still not sure I agree, unless I'm using a different definition of fodder... Maul does mark Qui-Gon's death, arguably a major catalyst for Anakin's fall. And Obi-Wan is knighted by killing Maul, and it makes a decent contrast to Dooku's death - Obi-Wan getting angry at his master's defeat then losing the duel, but regaining himself and killing Maul from a submissive position with Qui-Gon's saber (arguably becoming a Jedi with the action) /vs/ Anakin getting angry at his master's defeat and winning the duel, but of course not calming himself like Obi-Wan, and killing Dooku in cold blood with Dooku's saber, setting himself on the path to becoming a Sith (I know I'm off-topic, but I love the irony that Obi-Wan becomes his own Master by defeating Maul, where Anakin is goaded by Palpatine into bringing himself closer to submission to Palpatine with Dooku's death).

    Where I can see Maul as a one-time, perhaps throw-away, villain, I somewhat feel a (perhaps unintentional) ripple effect from the character on the other prequels, sort of a milder version of what Qui-Gon symbolically does for the rest of the saga. For example, when Obi-Wan quips to Palpatine in ROTS "Chancellor Palpatine, Sith Lords are our speciality"; besides the irony that he is saying it to Sidious, and also the fact that Obi-Wan has partially trained the next Sith apprentice himself, it kind of makes me think how much Obi-Wan's existence has sadly revolved around these characters. I mean, the Sith apprentice of TPM (Maul) killed his best friend directly, then when his current best friend Anakin kills Dooku it just sets up the ROTS Sith apprentice (Vader) "killing" Anakin. Then Obi-Wan has to take him out, begin training his son, and of course become one with the force at Vader's blade.
    If that makes sense anyway, it was confusing to type.
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  18. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Maul's death does drive the action forward, which I don't deny. But Lucas wanted to show how Palpatine's actions in sending Maul into battle had dire consequences for the Sith Order, which is what happens in ROTJ. He had inadvertently helped cause the prophecy to come true in doing so.
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  19. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
    Necessary? Is it necessary to drink my own urine? No, but I do it anyway because it's sterile, and I like the taste. Yes Maul was fine in TPM.
    The_Phantom_Calamari likes this.
  20. Darth Maul Apprentice Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2014
    star 4
    Are you vegan? A friend of mine knew this guy who was and ah nah, never mind.
  21. Space_Wolf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2007
    star 3
    I think he would have been a cool character if he'd been developed properly, but I think he was only included to sell action figures, posters, etc. Apologies to Darth Maul fans, but it does make you wonder.
  22. Darth Maul Apprentice Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2014
    star 4
    No worries Space_Wolf. Lucas got my money. Now disney's gonna get some of it too.

    Cute dog.
    Last edited by Darth Maul Apprentice, Feb 16, 2014
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  23. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
    I was quoting Dodgeball.
  24. Ambervikings91 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 1, 2012
    star 2
    There are always two sith, i think he was very important to ep 1 from a writing standpoint actually
    Andy Wylde likes this.
  25. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9

    You wouldn't happen to be this guy?

    [IMG]
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