ST Was Kylo killing Snoke the final part of his training?

At the end of TFA, we hear Snoke tell Kylo Ren to come to him so that he could complete his training. Did Snoke foresee his apprentice killing him and somehow viewed it as a means to an end? Is this the first time he's pulled this "fake death" maneuver so that he could watch from the shadows?

Or am I giving the writers too much credit?

 

MODified: Goodbye.

 

Snoke got too cocky. Learned his lesson the hard way.

 

Somehow like the Jedi.

 

Snoke tells both Ben & Rey that he bridged their minds shortly after learning of Ben’s feelings for Rey and loss to her in TFA. He tells them he set it up as his final stage of training and as he’s presenting Rey to him he tells him literally that he’s doing so for him to execute her and complete his training.

Snoke has wanted Ben to kill everything he previously held dear, including relatives, to create a void and become desensitized to evil but realized that Rey represented a new sense of love within Ben Solo that needed to be squashed soon or it might undo Ben’s Dark Side potential long-term.

Snoke was right about his feelings for her, and learned from the Emperor’s mistake of trying to convert someone like her, but was still overconfident and it cost him his life.

 

I don' think smoke is even dead...... well not permanently.

I think he know how to cheat it, hence his confidence before Kylo kills him.

 

Under Snoke it was, but there is still things he has yet to learn such as lightning.

 

There are no Sith philosophies with this trilogy, so imo no.

 

"Star Wars" adheres to the "'Star Trek' Rule of Character Death": Only Red Shirts from Security die without hope of return. Anyone else is a candidate for resurrection, especially villains.
From the moment he was bisected, I fully expected that Snoke would return in IX. It's just a question of how they explain it away.

 

Well palpy did say there was a dark side power that can stop people from dying. Maybe snoke has mastered that.

 

I figure it's more like he's already dead, but won't allow himself to fully expire. Yes, it's not a new idea, but it seems to fit.

 

No, I don't think Snoke foresaw his own death at Kylo's hands. He intends for the completion of Kylo's training to culminate with the death of Rey. Instead, Kylo killing Snoke is his true moment of ascension.

 

I find it hard to believe Snoke died to some punk EMO kid with daddy issues. I pictured Snoke as more bad ass than that.

If Rian really did mean for that to happen........he has disappointed me even more.

 

While I would have liked to see a bit more from Snoke, I've accepted that he's more of a Dooku than a Palpatine in this trilogy. He's a stepping stone to the dark side in order for Kylo to become true big bad. And to me, it's more satisfying to see Kylo take him out rather than Luke or Rey.

 

Problem with things as they stand if Snoke is really dead is that there are currently no cool or threatening bad guys.
Star Wars needs that.

Phasma was a joke, Hux has had any sort of credibility removed from him and Kylo just....as trite as this sounds....isn't cool.

He comes across as a wimp and a petulant child. I dunno, do kids find him cool maybe?

I liked his character design, I like Adam Driver, I like some of the little things the actor does such as his unique way of stomping one foot and igniting his lightsaber, but the character itself? I just really doubt I would have been impressed by him as a kid.

So, having the threat of an all powerful and mysterious Snoke being there was necessary as far as I'm concerned anyway.

But, whatever, it's a sunny day today and my country just won their World Cup match so I'll be optimistic that JJ will wrap things up decently.

 

I expect the Knights of Ren to return from a week long mission and for them and Hux to overthrow Kylo Ren, helding Kylo Ren complete the heel-to-face turn and making him an uneasy ally of the heroes of episode IX versus this new structure of villains. My guess is that they'll give us a second flashback of the temple knight from their perspective and show how they killed other students before we see them coming back as the Knights of Ren. One of them will seem more evil, assertive and ambitious than the others during the temple night and further along the dark path than even Ben Solo was at that point in time and that will continue into IX. That Knight will be the one functions as the new bad and they'll make him sufficiently scary and strong with the Force.

Pick any one of them and give them a more menacing, assertive and back-stabbing personality and it could work.

 

I like it ! I dearly wish for something like this route to be taken.

And I think I'd pick the guy with the gun seeming like he's going to say something to Kylo. Interesting that they don't actually have any lightsabres.

 

My thinking for a long time has been that Snoke was involved with the training of the Praetorian Guard and that his role in offering the Praeotian Guard to the FO was his path in and that he then took over. My guess is that in the end, when they write Snoke's backstory more, that will be the most logical route in. He'll be underestimated initially and he'll hide his powers more. He'll function more like the manager of the guard who's hand-picked these people since they were young and trained them.

Then, the Knights of Ren will have some similarities to his Prateorian Guard. He'll approach them a little similarly but also a little different since they're Force users. He'll expose them to the training area where the Praetorian guard trained and show them all the different weapons there. Some of Luke's former students will like the new weapons more. Only Ben Solo will stick to his saber after others try Snoke's non-Jedi weapons and like them more.

 

Interesting. But are we sure the KOR are the students Luke was talking about? I guess they sort of have to be? Has it been established where Kylo got his sith-like lightsaber?
I had thought it odd that they were brandishing other weapons, you'd have thought if they were to carry out a swift, unplanned (as it's suggested in TLJ) massacre on the jedi temple they would have just picked up their lightsabres.
But, as you say, we may got another POV flashback perhaps more reliable than Kylo's story.

 

My belief is that the shot above is many months or years after the temple massacre. I would doubt Snoke had their armor ready from the Praetorian guard armor maker for that temple knight.

 

The problem is that for this plotline to be done well, along with the fates of Rey, Finn, Poe and Rose, plus the resolution of the FO vs. Resistance war, plus a possible return of Luke in Force ghost form, you need either a movie lasting as long as "Gone with the Wind" or turn the trilogy into a quartet. Otherwise it'll seem rushed and wholly insufficient.

 

I don’t think so. Let’s take TLJ plot timelines just for an example here.

Instead of Snoke on the throne scene talking to Kylo Ren imagine Ben Solo in the throne being updated that the Knights have returned.

3 minute flashback to the temple night from another part of the temple with them.

Then we see them come in. The most assertive one from the flashback comes in & pretends to be on Kylo Ren’s side for killing Snoke. Kylo Ren tries to make it clear they are even less equal than they used to be and asks him & the others to bow. The others do first. This guy does last. He then asks what happened to the guard & Kylo Ren tells them you’re my guard now.

Within 5 minutes they’re in the story, known to the audience and the coup attempt later is set up.

Don’t forget that TFA & TLJ both had 20-22 minutes of running time with Luke & Han. The same was probably planned for Leia but won’t be now. I doubt it all goes to Lando either.

I also doubt they split the resistance crew up as much in IX. They will have more scenes as a group. VIII split them up to test them, give them setbacks & show they’re strengths & weaknesses through those separated moments. IX will have them together more and that will streamline time on screen.

Luke’s screentime will probably be no more than 8 minutes in IX. Yoda had 12 min in Empire.

1) Other students see him in rubble and move to defend him versus the eventual KoR in their flashback.

2) Voice over moment with Rey.

3) Force ghost moment where Rey expresses regret for leaving him & he expresses regret in his choices.

4) Rey final Training montage or referencing a power in the books with him advising.

5) End Force ghost moment with him.

2.5 hour running time can have a lot.

 

I think Kylo Ren killed Snoke to become the supreme leader so he will become so much more powerful & also to save Rey but probably the main reason cause Snoke didn't like his helmet ......

 

That flashback cannot be depicting the Temple massacre, unless it had vastly more planning than the film suggests or than the most anti-Kylo among us have ever suspected. As in, they'd all secretly had armour made and cached somewhere in preparation(!) Bye, bye redemption!

However, the point still stands that it's odd that they're using those weapons at all, if these are really Luke's students. @Ender_and_Bean I see what you suggested, but is that really plausible? It wouldn't be some of them liking the new weapons more, it would be all of them (except Kylo). And the new weapons are- what?- a club, two guns, some sort of pole-arm/gardening implement and... a plank? And these ex-Jedi trainees all preferred these things to lightsabers?

Hmmn. Have we all been completely wrong in assuming the Temple massacre was also meant to be the KoR origin story? Because I'm only just now realising that it doesn't make an awful lot of sense.