Was the Phantom Menace neccessary

Discussion in 'The Phantom Menace' started by Grizham1, Jun 2, 2002.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. augusto Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 4
    What changed Anakin was his separation to his mother, specially at that age, when he was already attached to her.

    Her murder at the hands of the Tuskens aggravates this further and pushes him further into the dark side.

    That's why we see Anakin at age 9, because at that age it is more difficult to let go of your parents. I experienced some of that because I stopped living with my parents (they stayed in central america) at age 14. This caused a great impact on me. However, at that age I was mature enough to adapt to the situation.
  2. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Here's another thought...since Anakin being 9 years old seems to cause problems with the storyline overall, but yet is a concepot Lucas deemed important to show...perhaps another solution could have been to make Amidala younger as well? If they were both 9 year olds, that "are you angel" stuff might seem more realistic, and still allowed them to develop a sort of bond that could have been developed from in AOTC.
  3. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    What wasn't realistic about it the way it was? They do form a paternal bond as Padme sort of fills in the hole left by his Mother. This bond is what makes their eventual romance even more interesting.
  4. DarthVegas Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 4
    Doesn't matter how old your protaganist is... if a movie sucks... it sucks. Period.
  5. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    It's a good thing TPM doesn't suck period.
  6. DrEvazan Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 19, 2002
    star 4
    in your humble opinion.
  7. DarthVegas Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 4
    Fine, sucks is a bit strong.

    Stinks. That's better and more accurate. Maul was good, Liam good, Obi rocks. The rest is... the rest.
  8. -_-_-_-_-_- Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Apr 28, 2002
    star 6
    I'm glad someone decided to dig this thread up from the seventh layer of Hell.
  9. rpeugh Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 10, 2002
    star 4
    If you have to ask this question (the title of this thread), then you just dont get what SW is about. And you dont get what the PT is about.
  10. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    If you don't like TPM, fine. But it doesn't mean it is not necessary. I don't like ROTJ that much, but it's still necessary.
  11. winter_chili Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2002
    star 5
    I see the only real purpose of TPM is to give contrast to ep3.

    Ep1 = Light
    Ep3 = Dark
  12. Stridarious Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 27, 2002
    star 6
    Of course TPM is important it sets up all the other films in the classic trilogy and these new pre-trilogies.
  13. DarthVegas Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 4
    It's a shame I can't watch TPM all the way without being bored to death. I wish GL would have shown a lethal side to the battle droids. Sure they were easy to kill, but think about it...

    GL could have shown that these droids were lethal to anyone who was not accustomed or ready to defend themselves. They were droids, and one could not reason with them in anyway. They were programmed to kill. There could have been a nice lethal element to the droids which would have made the audience actually care about what the Jedi were doing. Instead we see Jedi knocking over walking Erector sets in between yawns.

    I also wish we could have seen Dooku instead of Yarael Poof who art in Star Wars limbo and comic EU spoofs.

    I wish Anakin would have been truly a bit frightened going up into space by himself in a Naboo fighter. Show some emotion. Show some of the pilots trying to protect the ship when Anakin begins using the call switch... and the pilots getting blown to smithereens increasing Anakin's fear. Then show Anakin using the force, not going, "oopsy-whoopsies-cool!"

    I mean is this a War or is this Playstation? Kids movie or not, watch a good Disney movie and notice the drama. In TPM, there was none. That's the ultimate problem.

    Maul was great, too bad all we got was Jar-Jar. And there's no need to rehash that nightmare cause we all know what a waste of screentime that ended up being.

    TPM was in a sense neccessary. Too bad it wasn't good.
  14. Jedi_Learner Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2002
    star 5
    "Maul was great, too bad all we got was Jar-Jar."

    Speak for yourself please. I love Jar Jar Binks, and I won't have you making sweep generalizations of people's opinion on this Gungan.
  15. DarthVegas Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 4
    If you love him, why don't you marry him?

    :D

    Seriously, I'm curious to know what people liked about Jar-Jar, the ones that love him. Why do you love him? What was good about him? I really don't know so enlighten me, please.
  16. Jedi_Learner Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2002
    star 5
    "If you love him, why don't you marry him?"

    I said I love him, but I love chocolate bars. Would I marry a chocolate bar? I don't think so. ;)

    "Seriously, I'm curious to know what people liked about Jar-Jar, the ones that love him. Why do you love him? What was good about him? I really don't know so enlighten me, please."

    If your really interested in knowing, you could look at about twelve topics I've done about him dotted around the movie forums. That will tell you all want to know, unless you really want me to tell you. Are you really interested? [face_mischief]
  17. Loco_for_Lucas Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2002
    star 5
    GL could have shown that these droids were lethal to anyone who was not accustomed or ready to defend themselves. They were droids, and one could not reason with them in anyway. They were programmed to kill. There could have been a nice lethal element to the droids which would have made the audience actually care about what the Jedi were doing. Instead we see Jedi knocking over walking Erector sets in between yawns.


    Not only that, but no Gungans were visibly hurt or killed in the Battle at Naboo while the Jedi were "decimated" at Geonosis. There were fewer droids in the arena than there were at the open field, were the droids set from stun to kill?
  18. JKBurtola Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 4, 2003
    star 4
    Well this thread seems a bit like a roundabout ;)

    TPM is only necessary if you deem it necessary. I, myself, do view it as necessary.

    I feel its important to see Anakin as a young child, Obi-Wan as a Padawan Learner, Palpatine's rise to power, the beginning of Padme & Anakin's relationship, the Republic at the beginning of the end of its long millennium of peace.

    But thats just me. And after all I will follow my opinion.

    BTW:

    I know this isn't a Christian forum, but according to the Bible, we are all BORN evil. I know that is not something we want to face, but it takes the responsibility of our own decisions and places them back on ourselves. We have no one or no thing to blame our bad choices on except our own wicked nature. When we make good choices, we actually overcome the evil within us.

    I'm an atheist so the bible is just bad fiction to me :p (I do not mean to offend Christians out there with this comment, its just my personal preference. My apologies if you take it as offensive.)
    But it doesn't matter whether we are born good or evil, we always have responsibility over our own actions and in the end we are the ones to blame or take pride in when we make a choice.
    I prefer to believe we are born in the middle, not on one side or the other, but through our decisions we plot which side we finish on.
    Being born evil is as bad as saying we are born good. Its putting life in a positive or negative light whereas life is neither, but is simply...life.

  19. Loco_for_Lucas Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2002
    star 5
    TPM is only necessary if you deem it necessary. I, myself, do view it as necessary.

    I feel its important to see Anakin as a young child, Obi-Wan as a Padawan Learner, Palpatine's rise to power, the beginning of Padme & Anakin's relationship, the Republic at the beginning of the end of its long millennium of peace.


    From that list, I would say the first two were the least necessary. Anakin's need of being a child was absolutely not necessary, I am of the thinking that he should have been at least sixteen years old. The only thing Lucas was going for in making him as young as he did, so it appears to me, was for cheap and sappy sentimentalism. That was about it. "Awww look, the cute little kid is saying goodbye to his mommy. No wonder he became so evil." Other than that, Anakin was a handicap rather than a fully functioning character in the story.

    Just as Obi-wan's being a padawan, it was completely unnecessary. This is the story of Anakin's training, not Obi-wan's. Seeing him as a young man was not a necessary part of the story, it detracted from the character because, just as Anakin and the others that were starkly different from Episode to Episode, he needed to be reintroduced with AOTC and redeveloped as what he did and what he was in TPM didn't ultimately matter in AOTC and on. So yes, TPM was entirely unnecessary, at least to me. It was a waste of time as it only "introduced" the characters and had them doing things that don't really have any relevance to the other five chapters.

    But thats just me. And after all I will follow my opinion.


    And you are to be respected for that. :p
  20. Jedi_Learner Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2002
    star 5
    "Why do you love him? What was good about him? I really don't know so enlighten me, please."

    I love him because I find him very interesting and humourous at times. The design of the Gungan Species was done very well and brings something very fresh to the Star Wars Universe. I like Jar Jar because although he seems clumsy and childish on the outside, he inside cares about people and himself. He took Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan to the Gungan City knowing that the punishment could be his own life. He wanted to help them and he does it again later on when he brings the two distant races together agasint the Trade Federation. He seems all hyper all the time, wouldn't you be if you were made an outcast of your home and forced to fend for yourself in the Naboo Swamps for several years? That is why I think he acts hyper at times. I could post more about my love for Jar Jar, but I think you can understand my opinion. You can disagree with me, but I'll hold to my opinion.

    :)
  21. Grizham1 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 5, 2001
    star 2
    The best thing about the Phantom Menace is the fight scenes. So their so fast paced and action-packed that when me and the boys go out for a few beers we would come home and watch the fight scenes for fun. To imagine that the lasting legacy of the new starwars movies would be drunken fun was unimaginable before these movies were released. This movie should have been done differently, where the hell is the cynical nature that was present in all the original movies? The witty one-liners? Where are Jung's archtypes in these movies? This movie reminds me of Wizard of Oz for some reason, I only wish their was more substance.

    What the hell do good and evil have to do with being born? and how does it relate to this thread? your either genetically pre-disposed to be a certain way when your born or your born tabula rosa...Starwars has Anakin being young and then turning evil as he ages. Then their is Luke who's born and is good throughout his life, though he shows signs of being tempted to be evil (especially at Jabba's palace in ROTJ). So Lucas prefers the Tabula Rosa approach it seems. (I think I spelled Locke's term right not sure though).

    Not only does this movie not fit with the original set, it doesn't even match up well to Attack of the Clones. Attack of the Clones is geared towards older teens (hopefully the next one will be geared towards an even older crowd, keeping my finger crossed) and it's all action with crappy dialogue. The Phantom Menace is boring dialogue sparsely populated with some nice fx sequences. I don't expect anything from the next movie, I look forward to the Matrix, X-Men, and Lord of the Rings to sate my thirst for fantasy based movies/lit. etc.,

    I"m sure most of you think this movie was necessary. Word processing always seems so impersonal, I bet it we all met face to face we'd get along a lot better and agree on alot more things than on these boards. Just as you can't understand why I detest this movie, I can't understand how you love it. Were really the same, more similar than not. It's funny I"m the Facist and your the Communist and we end up coming together in some odd way. If you'll enjoy Jar-Jar, shitty dialogue, children asking young girls if they're angels, obviously fake characters created from a computer, Villians with no motives other than a desire to kill Jedi b/c of something that happened thousands of years ago (kind of like some Muslims feel about the West, hmmmm) then I still love you, I just don't agree with you! Take it for what it's worth!

  22. DarthVegas Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2000
    star 4
    So true, Grizham.

    After seeing X-Men 2 I am really not expecting much from Episode III either. And maybe then we'll see Episode III and hopefully go, WOW! THAT WAS GREAT! NOTHING I EXPECTED! But I can't help but to have a feeling that we'll walk out of the theatres thinking about tomorrow's chores.

    As far as my question about Jar-Jar, I can really understand why people would like the character. It's the usage of the character that's the problem.

    Jar-Jar could have been an extremely popular character if he was used as a plot point instead of a comic sidekick. I know, I know, he was a plot point, as the whole war thing wouldn't have happened if not for him. Blah. What bad story telling. How about we actually care about the Gungans instead of just watching what seemed to be the intro movie of our favorite new PC game. I mean, if I wanted to see such a hapless, mundane battle, I'd buy a friggin playstation.

    If used correctly as a plot moving device, if not expunged throughout the entire movie as comic fodder, he could have been the new generation of R2-D2's so to speak as Lucas had in mind. Sloppy use of a potentially entertaining character is all I see from Binks.

    Useless scenes, mundane dialog, and a movie in which we care about non of the characters except for Obi-Wan, ONLY because we already know who he is... a waste of a neccessary movie.
  23. bjbrickm Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 14, 2002
    star 3
  24. Jedi_Learner Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2002
    star 5
    "Jar-Jar could have been an extremely popular character if he was used as a plot point instead of a comic sidekick. I know, I know, he was a plot point, as the whole war thing wouldn't have happened if not for him. Blah. What bad story telling."

    I don't understand your sudden change in your post. Please explain. :confused:
  25. Ophion Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    May 12, 2003
    the phantom menace was probly the worst movie lucas ever made... i mean who cares if some planet we've never heard of is invaded by some force we only here bits and pieces about in ep 2 and 3 and i know that amidala comes from there too but did we really need a whole movie to introduce her? or did we even need qui gon jin, a character never before mentioned before ep one. wouldnt it have been easier for obi wan to be the master and have a differnet apprentice that was killed in place of quigon? and jar jar binks... pointless! he might have been the one to call for the formation of a republic army but who cares? we didnt need him in the phantom menace

    finally who cares where anakin came from! it could have been mentioned in passing that he was from tatooine. In fact i think that they could have just as easily made attack of the clones the episode 1 in stead of that pathetic offering by lucas

    phantom menace could have been made a stand alone story like "ewok adventure" in the 80's

    oh well whats done is done "damn you lucas!!"
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.