Lit We need a novel about Tarkin

Discussion in 'Literature' started by FTeik, Aug 29, 2013.

  1. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 2012
    star 4
    There is no justification of genocide.
    darklordoftech likes this.
  2. FTeik Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2000
    star 5
    Not really, because according to other sources the capital city of Tepasi, the Tagge-throneworld and a co-founder of the Old Republic is named after Unloss Tagge (probably the leader of the first settlers, who reached Tepasi in sleeper-ships). Consequently the Tagge's would have played an important role - as a noble family and leaders of TaggeCo. - long before Tarzen was even born.
    General Immodet likes this.
  3. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

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    Nov 4, 2012
    star 4
    Was it named 'Botany-Bay'?
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  4. FTeik Force Ghost

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    Nov 7, 2000
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    Oh, I agree. But from an IU-POV I have to ask: Really? What species was genocided? And lets not forget, that the much vaunted Republic Bail and Leia Organa wanted to restore had also its number of genocides under its belt, the original Sith-species being just the most prominent one among them.
  5. FTeik Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2000
    star 5
    "UNLOOOOOSSSSSSS!!!!!" ;)
    Bib Fartuna likes this.
  6. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

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    star 4
    Sins of the father?

    Were the Organa's generation responsible for this?
  7. General Immodet Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2012
    star 4
    You only helped to develop the point I was trying to make.
    National Socialism did not write Mein Kampf, Hitler did. Hitler is a person, National Socialism is not a person.
    Hitler was "evil" ("Only when one acts against one own's consciousness, does he commit a sin" - Abélard) and even that can be disputed.
    If Hitler won the war (what was quite unlikely due to him declaring war on all fronts), was Hitler "evil"? Something to think about...

    To come back to the point, do you think Communism is evil when you look at what Stalin did?
    That is exactly the same... => No, Communism is not evil. Stalin may have been evil, but Communism was not.
  8. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 2012
    star 4
    Not to play devil's advocate, however, the definition of 'evil' can be such a black-and-white term.

    For instance, Hitler was kind to children, and liked animals.

    I prefer the Yin-Yang philosophy. For every pure person, there is an ounce of evil. For every evil person, there is an ounce of good.

    Complicated subject, I know! ;)
  9. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    That's only said in the novelization though- and novelization stuff, G-canon or not, is prone to getting retconned (the Forest Moon's destroyed planet being retconned into still existing, for example)

    In the case of Alderaan- the Dark Empire Sourcebook (as @Gorefiend has pointed out numerous times) states outright that Alderaan doesn't have a planetary shield- which would therefore suggest that it can't have much in the way of defences without that- especially since between the Clone Wars and shortly before ANH, they'd renounced weapons.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Aug 30, 2013
  10. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    He don't drag me into this, :p for all I care they can have all the guns they want sitting around, just did not happen to have a planet shield, though at this point it looks more like Bail actually called a fleet to attack the Death Star (per EAW at least). Which somehow seems to also have been the original novels intention as on how that battle went.
    Last edited by Gorefiend, Aug 30, 2013
  11. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 2012
    star 4
    Poor Hitler and his meth addiction... he really was Breaking Bad.

    Walter White Theodor Morell really has a lot to answer for!
    General Immodet likes this.
  12. Iron_lord Chosen One

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    It's mostly because I don't have that book myself- but I trust that you have read it and the statement about the book's contents is accurate.
  13. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

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    Nov 4, 2012
    star 4
    Don't you have Walt Whitman's "Leaves of Grass"?
  14. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Nope. Never read anything by him- I only read a parodied version of one of his lines, in another novel "I am large, I contain multitudes" and looked it up to find out who originally came up with it.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Aug 30, 2013
  15. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5

    Oh you should, the Dark Empire source book is just all kinds of awesome. :)

    Iron_lord likes this.
  16. Bib Fartuna Jedi Grand Master

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    Nov 4, 2012
    star 4
    I realize that this is such a poor, lazy response, but I really have to say:

    +1
  17. General Immodet Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2012
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    I wonder what Mussolini and the Italians thought when they met a energetic, vital Hitler who kept talking and talking because he was on drugs.
    If I was addicted to drugs, I would order my armies to fight on three sides as well! ;)
    Bib Fartuna likes this.
  18. darklordoftech Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    Keep in mind that The Emperor of the ANH novelization is a totally different character from The Emperor we all know...
  19. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
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    And that quote is not from the ANH novelization- but from a book written after Revenge of the Sith came out.
  20. darklordoftech Chosen One

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    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    I think the wrong source was given. Why would that conversation be in Dark Lord?
  21. FTeik Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2000
    star 5
    I don't have to look at Stalin to think Communism is evil. I can look at Mao. ;)
    But to be serious, yes, I think Communism is evil. It is a sad truth, that every ideology that promised heavon on earth quickly turned into hell. Every ideology, that turns people into objects or possessions of state/society is evil. It might be benevolent evil, but it is still evil. Now, there might be cases, where it is truly unavoidable to trample on peoples rights, but those cases should be exceptions and not become the norm over time, because it is easier and convinient and people are complacent.
    You also can't separate the ideology from the people. If Communism or Nationalsocialism were just crazy theories in an old book nobody reads anymore, there wouldn't be a problem (although in that case they'd be neither good nor evil, they'd be irrelevant). But they aren't. People expect the solution to their problems or an improvement of their lives from those theories and they act accordingly. As long as they only organize themselves in a labour union to get better working conditions, ok, once they start killing Jews or lynching bankers without due process, not so good.
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  22. darklordoftech Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    Watching ANH gives the impression that Tarkin has a hard-on for the Sith.
  23. FTeik Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2000
    star 5
    ANH-novel as G-canon still tops the DESB. And we are not looking at a retcon. We are looking at a hack of a RPG-author, who was to lazy to read the ANH-novel. And how is the fact, that you renounce the use and possession of weapons irreconcilable with having a planetary shield? Even the millenia-long peaceniks from Caamas had one of those until it was sabotaged.:mad:
    darklordoftech likes this.
  24. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    It's more that, without a shield, and with minimal guns, the defenses can't "be as strong as any in the Empire"
    If The Essential Atlas can retcon "RoTJ as G-canon" (admittedly based on large amounts of other evidence in previous books contradicting RotJ) then why can't DESB retcon "ANH novel as G-canon"?
    It's not. You are confusing Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader (by James Luceno) with The Rise and Fall of Darth Vader (by Ryder Windham).
    Last edited by Iron_lord, Aug 30, 2013
  25. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5

    For the nth time the two statements don't contradict each other. [face_sigh]